FFXIV is too simplistic and bland

[Enla]

We all know that the forum is an echo chamber and the moment you dare criticise XIV people tell you to go play somewhere else and take your ball with you. Especially when you mention either XI or WoW. Imagine players from 1.0 said tthat. Come to think of it, they did. But that defines a fanboy. Been playing since closed alpha so I should know. haha

I mean first rule of fandom is that you never go to the official forums or the subreddit for ANYTHING if you want a bevy of nuanced responses. So regardless of my own take on the situation I'm not sure what exactly you're expecting? People who like the game are more likely to congregate here, simple as that. Though simply because they like the game doesn't make them 'fanboys' and you aren't exactly doing your own argument many favors with the tone you're taking either.

[tymora]

That appears strange to me. I can't fathom the logic behind "I can craft really well therefore I do more damage with a combat class". It doesn't make sense to me. How did this particular mechanic work?

If you think about it as "Blacksmith/Armorer trains arm strength, so you can hit harder", "GSM/Weaver trains precision, so you can hit better"...etc, it makes some sense.
In 1.0, these get bundled up as a "physical level" that you level through crafting. So there is a Class level which is how skilled you are in the class and a physical level which represents your body condition.

If you don't have all these fancy mechanics to make your character stronger, then you only end up with a single boring leveling up mechanic which is what we have now.
Of course the stats now is over simplified too to the point that only 1-2 stat matter. As far as we are concerned, we are all "kyokufuri" characters.

[Penthea]

If you think about it as "Blacksmith/Armorer trains arm strength, so you can hit harder", "GSM/Weaver trains precision, so you can hit better"...etc, it makes some sense.

I can see the logic behind smithing increasing strength but weaving? I completely fail to see how sewing would make someone better at combat.

I have studied karate and I do arts and crafts. My art, knitting, sewing and crafting has given me zero help in martial arts. They're completely different skills that use entirely different muscles, strength and knowledge.

If you don't have all these fancy mechanics to make your character stronger, then you only end up with a single boring leveling up mechanic.

I'd rather something make actual sense than exist for the sake of maybe being interesting. And personally I don't think crafting making you better at combat is interesting. To me that looks like little more than a way to gate combat performance to make players play more. You don't see MMA fighters sewing a dress or making a necklace as part of their training for a reason.

I'm not saying this because I dislike crafting in games. It's one of my favourite things to do. I just don't see a valid combat connection between all types of crafting and fighting.

And yes I am aware all mechanics are designed to make players play for longer but when it is exceptionally obvious that this is the case then the feature often isn't very good or doesn't make a lot of sense. I'd prefer something like "you killed X number of beasts so now you do more damage to beasts" than "you made a lot of chairs, now you hit things harder".

[DrWho2010]

gamers don't have XI style play time to invest in anymore. that's a big design issue to get around.

[tymora]

gamers don't have XI style play time to invest in anymore. that's a big design issue to get around.

Yep, no longer a student with lots of time...haha...now working full time + wife + kids.
I kind of appreciate this theme park idea. Can be better but its ok.

[Taebok]

If I go to a restaurant and I don't like what's on the menu, I don't issue a long list of "suggestions" they could make so the restaurant could fit my personal taste.
I go to another restaurant.

[StriderShinryu]

We all know that the forum is an echo chamber and the moment you dare criticise XIV people tell you to go play somewhere else and take your ball with you. Especially when you mention either XI or WoW. Imagine players from 1.0 said tthat. Come to think of it, they did. But that defines a fanboy. Been playing since closed alpha so I should know. haha

I mean, not saying you or the OP are wrong about some of the points made, but I'm not really sure what you expect. FF14 is 7+ years old now and what you're asking for are for the devs to essentially scrap major elements of the game and go (back) to something else. Frankly, the game isn't going to change at this point, and it's certainly not going to change the in the ways that you and the OP want it to. If the option is to enjoy 14 for what it is or to go find a game you actually enjoy then I don't think it's really that much out of line for people to suggest you find a game you actually enjoy.

[Payadopa]

I mean, not saying you or the OP are wrong about some of the points made, but I'm not really sure what you expect. FF14 is 7+ years old now and what you're asking for are for the devs to essentially scrap major elements of the game and go (back) to something else. Frankly, the game isn't going to change at this point, and it's certainly not going to change the in the ways that you and the OP want it to. If the option is to enjoy 14 for what it is or to go find a game you actually enjoy then I don't think it's really that much out of line for people to suggest you find a game you actually enjoy.

See, that's where I disagree. As much as I'd love another calamity for instance it's probably not happening. That doesn't mean i can't ask for... I don't know.. less boring quest and FATE design? Or more actual diversity between jobs other than different particles? Or another approach to dungeon/open world design? Eureka was a good start. I also quite like how PLD plays./shrug Doesn't mean tanks and healers aren't seriously boring since 5.0. You don't necessarily need a new engine for changes concerning that.

Also, I may have strong opinions on the game but I'm also willing to discuss issues. But that's not what fanboys do, to reiterate my point. They just reeeee, cover their ears and tell you to go play something else because criticising something they like somehow lessens their view of the game? Or maybe it's niggling doubt? Haha Who knows.

That's not to say I don't really like the game. Otherwise I would leave. But, I'm not gonna lie, I get bored by the same old, same old more and more. That's why I also appreciate that we get less dungeons for.. whatever. The gundam fight was great. More surprises, please.

Either way, I'm here to leave feedback.

[Shurrikhan]

gamers don't have XI style play time to invest in anymore. that's a big design issue to get around.

I'm not sure where the idea comes from that an experience like XI's itself requires massive amounts of playtime per week, or even necessarily large chunks at a time, to enjoy.

I had some of the most fun I'd had in years playing WoW Classic or XIV 1.x... far, far more casually than I'd played retail WoW, let alone XIV.

The issue you seem to be describing only comes when you can no longer enjoy the ways to spend your time granularly (e.g. in crafting, in hunting, in exploration, in doing the quest here or there) and instead feel like there's nothing to the game outside of comparatively lengthy pre-packed pieces of content -- when the leveling itself is no longer enjoyable in its own right, but is instead solely a gatekeeper to "the real game".

Yes, inconveniences that resulted in it taking longer to partake in content was part of the XI experience, but was it fundamental to it? Would it have somehow fallen apart if it that weren't quite the case? More importantly, would people be unable to enjoy all those things the game offered outside of set content -- all that could be enjoyed at one's own pace -- if the game weren't held back elsewhere by older systems, or instead used more modern systems to flesh out its world (and, in that, content that can be done at one's own pace) even further?

[Payadopa]

If I go to a restaurant and I don't like what's on the menu, I don't issue a long list of "suggestions" they could make so the restaurant could fit my personal taste.
I go to another restaurant.

I know for a fact that people said the same when 1.0 was released. lol
Heaven forfend someone make suggestions. It's not like you need to take everything at face value.

So when am I allowed to suggest then? When the seasoning is bland? lol The forum was made for suggestions. Nevertheless, you dare criticise and you get a lot of people up in arms with pitchforks. But try see it from a different view. Maybe it's -because- people like the game a lot that they are making these suggestions. As much fun as XIV can be, it's seriously wasting its potential in places.

Ah, well. Here's hoping for 6.0.