FFXIV is too simplistic and bland

[HeulGDarian]

What is your point?

I didnt say it wasnt unenjoyable, I said it was simplistic and bland.




FFXI is a MMORPG , FFXIV is a MMORPG, thats apples to apples.

Plus there is no way you read it that fast.

different kind of mmos. In fact since you seem to have forgotten, ff14 1.0 had the ff11 style and it was one of the major factors that it flopped, it was only after that, that they took inspiration from Wow that 2.0 came to fruition.
Also i read most of it, the only thing that stack to me was how you compare it to ff1 and ff13. especially saying ff14 is also linear and ff13 side questing was more rewarding.
So ill say again what i said, youre comparing apples to oranges and finding the later inferior.

[Daniolaut]

d In fact since you seem to have forgotten, ff14 1.0 had the ff11 style and it was one of the major factors that it flopped,

This is so wrong.

FFXIV 1.23b only saw an increase in player retention and player attraction.

(To go even further, there was a huge "exodus" of 1.0 players at the release of version 2.0, because 2.0 did the very thing I'm mentioning here. Too much homogenization and simplification.)

The main reasons FFXIV 1.0 failed was its extremely high demand on PC's, which meant very few people could even get FFXIV to run, then of those few who could get it to run, were faced with an extremely lag ridden game, with little to no content, as well as restrictions such as the fatigue system.

Please do not try to talk about things you were not around to experience.

In fact, FFXI has seen a ... "resurgence" in players in so much they have decided to release new content. The failure of 1.0 was actually because XIV was so far from how XI was. They didnt even have jobs in version 1.0 until Yoshida took over.

That your opinion doesn't have merit to me. Thought that was obvious.

Edit: I mean, when you go into detail, but sprinkle in "not counting this/outside of this," things that show your argument isn't as strong as it actually is, and then have details that are just outright wrong in such an obvious way, it can't to me. Not strong enough an opinion.

Then you simply dont like how I talk. That doesnt mean the things I say are not facts.

I'll say it without the words you dont like.

Travel:

FFI
Character movement
Canoo
Boat
Airship
Teleport (teleport/warp within dungeons.)

FFXIV
Character movement
Teleport/All other "black screen"
Mounts.
Swimming

FFI wins.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Really? The big reason was demand? Not the lag ridden, little to no content, fatigue system plagued game? Just the demands and everything else was secondary?

The ONLY reason it saw an uptick near the end were: It became F2P after you bought the base game and a certain popular dev took over. The fact that you just got so much wrong to try and support your failed argument, then tried to tell someone to not talk about things they were not around to experience, is laughable. You're the worst troll the forum has.

That, and the main reason all the "1.23b veterans" quit, was not because the game was simplified, it was because it went away from xi style combat and went more towards wow styled combat.

[Xatsh]

That, and the main reason all the "1.23b veterans" quit, was not because the game was simplified, it was because it went away from xi style combat and went more towards wow styled combat.

Content design is why most the XI hold outs in the 1.0 era quit the game eventually. I had a guild of nearly 55 people in XIV from XI. Alot stuck through ARR and most quit at the start of HW, most as in 48 of them, when they realized it was just more ARR with a new story and fresh coat of paint. Most of us stuck with 1.x era after it was trash because SE gutted FFXI at that same time with abysea. So they burned the old home and gave us garbage to move to. Alot of people stuck with XIV assuming Yoshida would fix the problems. Alot were horrified when he made World of Finalfantasy. I honestly believe if they did not screw up XI so badly almost all the ffxi people who went to xiv in the 1.X era would of went back to it.

I do not think many people wanted XI's combat system back in xiv. It was slow and extremely outdated. I never heard anyone say they wanted the auto attack and menu based combat. People did wanted the XIV combat to be more complex though. With Enfeebles, Buffs, Situational spells and attack, basically more then just rotations and maximizing dmg. They wanted mechanics that made you choose your action carefully...not the, do the same rotation perfect for 10mins and stand in the right place and you win on every fight in the game that we have now.

[Daniolaut]

Really? The big reason was demand? Not the lag ridden, little to no content, fatigue system plagued game? Just the demands and everything else was secondary?

The ONLY reason it saw an uptick near the end were: It became F2P after you bought the base game and a certain popular dev took over. The fact that you just got so much wrong to try and support your failed argument, then tried to tell someone to not talk about things they were not around to experience, is laughable. You're the worst troll the forum has.

Only reason I'm responding is to make sure passers by have the real facts. I hope you reach a point in your life that you aren't so sad as to stir up stuff on an internet forum for fun.

Really? I literally said those exact things.

I said the "reasons" plural.

Those were all the main reasons, the ones that I mentioned. I can only name one thing first, and yes, if you cant even play a game, then you cant experience the lag and everything else.

The "uptick" stayed after FFXIV 1.23b was no longer free to play. Again, you're also talking out of experience.

(edit and before someone tries to "aruge" that "1.23b was never free to play". I"m using 1.23b as a catch all version. I dont recall exactly what patch Yoshida took over. But 1.23b was not free to play. Version 1.0 was free to play, sometime after Yoshida took over, then he re-initiated the monthly subscription, and added the legacy campaign.)

FFXIV was not free to play once Yoshida took over until 2.0. There is a thing called Legacy status, which required you to have paid 3 months during version 1.0 prior to the release of 2.0, while Yoshida was running the game. I repeat, you're talking out of experience.

Its not trolling when I share my thoughts, and use facts. You're completely refusing to say anything that I havent already said, and you're also aggressive when I'm not aggressive at all. I'm not trolling, thats just a word you're all using when you fail to make valid points or to stay on topic.

I mean literally I said those exact things, and then you said the things I said are not reasons. When I am the person who said those very things. I'm sorry, but your logic is not even logic.

Edit:
I just read your "response" at the end ... that is completely uncalled for, and I never once comment for the reasons you imply. No joke. No troll. No sarcasm. Dead serious. I post here the things I think about. I wrote all this because the more I've been playing XI lately and not playing XIV, I get more and more annoyed at the thought of turning XIV back on. The problem is I just paid 6 months of sub for XIV, and I know if I dont keep my sub I lose my house. Which on that very topic, Yoshida said would never happen (housing being tied to your sub)

Here I"ll even link it for anyone who tries to argue that he never said it wouldnt be tied to your sub...
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-%2810-30-2013

Edit of edits.
I forgot to finalize my point. I'm annoyed that I just subscribed for longer, even though I know I "have to" when I see the potential of FFXIV, it so easily can be better, but I feel there is not even really an attempt at being made. I see them only focusing on getting new players, instead of keeping the ones they have.

You don't need to have been around during 1.0 to know how clunky, unintuitive, needlessly complicated, and all the lack of basic QoL functionality during it. There's plenty of resources out there that have archived and compiled various features and tidbits from 1.0.

My biggest point: You mean to tell me having unlimited access to teleports is too bland when there's things like timed gathering nodes and fates that can take most of their timer to do? Because in 1.0 you had limited teleports and all the maps were bigger than post-HW iirc.

I never said unlimited teleports are a bland feature.

What could make travel, and the aspect of gathering you mentioned more enjoyable, if the nodes being spaced apart so that a mount is not the most viable method for reaching nodes.

This way the player can choose to use the mount music without having to hear it be an incessant spam fest while gathering. (this is actually the only reason I ever turn off mount music. Otherwise I'd leave it on. I simply cannot get sick of the chocobo/mount music. There is already an option to turn off the music, which is also a good feature. The entire game is not bland. I just am pointing out the parts that are.)

To enhance travel itself, they could add cutscenes for all zoning, while using something such as a boat or airship. They can even add an actual boat in certain instances, such as the one in Upper La Noscea, or going to the "island" (spoilers) in Lakeland. I personally watch the cutscenes each time. They could also have a feature where you pay more gil to skip what I'm about to mention. Express airship, and normal airship. Normal Airship, you go to the dock, wait for the ship, ship arrives, you choose to board, and then you get said cutscene. Similarly to version 1.0. They could make the game very engaging, and very optional, but they choose to just water it down to nothingness. No this is not the perfect answer, Its just one that was already there, and they are choosing the easy brainless option, and in my opinion it hurts the game.

I am already well aware, that others dont notice this. With that said, its the very reason I choose to play Final Fantasy games over other games. Other games completely fail to deliver in terms of quality, and this entry in the series is going that same route, and I'm expressing my displeasure.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Really? I literally said those exact things.

I said the "reasons" plural.

Those were all the main reasons, the ones that I mentioned. I can only name one thing first, and yes, if you cant even play a game, then you cant experience the lag and everything else.

The "uptick" stayed after FFXIV 1.23b was no longer free to play. Again, you're also talking out of experience.

FFXIV was not free to play once Yoshida took over until 2.0. There is a thing called Legacy status, which required you to have paid 3 months during version 1.0 prior to the release of 2.0, while Yoshida was running the game. I repeat, you're talking out of experience.

Its not trolling when I share my thoughts, and use facts. You're completely refusing to say anything that I havent already said, and you're also aggressive when I'm not aggressive at all. I'm not trolling, thats just a word you're all using when you fail to make valid points or to stay on topic.

I mean literally I said those exact things, and then you said the things I said are not reasons. When I am the person who said those very things. I'm sorry, but your logic is not even logic.

I mean, one can argue that the reason for the uptick in 1.23b has literally nothing to do with game quality and EVERYTHING to do with them pushing the legacy campaign hard for 2.0s release. Its literally the only reason I resubbed, to do the tie in questline with the grand companies.

Also, does my forum join date that predates yours mean my opinion holds more water (since you keep bringing that up to other people?) Especially since I was there for 1.0's beta?

[kaynide]

This is so wrong.

FFXIV 1.23b only saw an increase in player retention and player attraction.

(To go even further, there was a huge "exodus" of 1.0 players at the release of version 2.0, because 2.0 did the very thing I'm mentioning here. Too much homogenization and simplification.)

You are completely entitled to your opinions, thoughts and ideas (of course). Some of your points I agree with, especially regarding exploreable open world options (a la FFXI dungeons) and travel (I was dissapointed very much that fishing was on a stationary ship, when it should have been easy to make the ship appear to move).

That said, the above point I would need source to confirm. If the game was doing particularly well, SE wouldn't have fired most of the 1.0 team and spent a huge chunk of money rebooting it with team YoshiP.

I CAN buy people jumping ship at launch because when 1.0 was going down it had no subscription fee, but upon 2.0 release it became subscription based, so yeah, obviously some people dipped.

Moreover, if memory serves, wasn't 1.0 overly homogeneous in that classes were largely cosmetic due to the amount of cross-class skill setups?

[Boa-Noah]

Moreover, if memory serves, wasn't 1.0 overly homogeneous in that classes were largely cosmetic due to the amount of cross-class skill setups?

To put it bluntly 1.0 was a massive failure both commercially and gameplay-wise, the maps were gigantic empty wastelands, the content not very fun to play, and the engine incredibly stilted (which we're still dealing with a decade later) and basically no one but the most hardcore even wanted to touch it. That said classes did have variety and different stats that they relied upon which you could reset by building up reset points or something like it, so if you wanted to be a warrior or whatever you'd need/level up STR and Dex and stuff and if you switched to thaumaturge you'd need to reset your points to be INT and stuff like that.

Honestly, anyone that prefers 1.0 to 2.0 is welcome to their opinion but it's an objectively terrible opinion, 1.0 died for a reason and returning 2.0 to that kind of wasted existence would decimate the playerbase and destroy the game.

[Enla]

To put it bluntly 1.0 was a massive failure both commercially and gameplay-wise, the maps were gigantic empty wastelands, the content not very fun to play, and the engine incredibly stilted (which we're still dealing with a decade later) and basically no one but the most hardcore even wanted to touch it. That said classes did have variety and different stats that they relied upon which you could reset by building up reset points or something like it, so if you wanted to be a warrior or whatever you'd need/level up STR and Dex and stuff and if you switched to thaumaturge you'd need to reset your points to be INT and stuff like that.

Honestly, anyone that prefers 1.0 to 2.0 is welcome to their opinion but it's an objectively terrible opinion, 1.0 died for a reason and returning 2.0 to that kind of wasted existence would decimate the playerbase and destroy the game.

This clip shows me pretty much everything I need to know about what playing 1.0 was like frankly. Honestly everything I've heard about 1.0 from both outside sources and friends makes it sound like a god damned nightmare to play. I'm glad it appealed to some people, but the game wouldn't have flopped so hard if something wasn't wrong with it.