The State of the Ascians (Assume Spoilers as of TODAY)

[YianKutku]

Zodiark just seems to have a very subtle form of Tempering that just seems to "nudge" what the Convoction wants.

And then there's Lahabrea, who goes on about Zodiark being the One True God and Hydaelyn being a False God(dess), even though literally nobody actively worships Hydaelyn as a deity. (We acknowledge her existence and also concede that she has godlike powers, but we don't worship her.)

Not even the Sundered necessarily see Zodiark as a god, as shown by Fandaniel. So I have no idea why Lahabrea got tempered hard enough to believe Zodiark to be the True God, when even Emet-Selch went "yeah, Zodiark's a Primal, he tempered us, next question". And Lahabrea's condescending dismissal of Elidibus also seems weird in light of the revelation that Elidibus is a Primal-made portion of Zodiark.

[Iscah]

And then there's Lahabrea, who goes on about Zodiark being the One True God and Hydaelyn being a False God(dess), even though literally nobody actively worships Hydaelyn as a deity. (We acknowledge her existence and also concede that she has godlike powers, but we don't worship her.)

Worship might not be the right word, but I think those who are aware of Hydaelyn certainly revere her in the same way they do the Twelve. (We don't see anyone actively worship them either, but I'm sure they do.) Things like saying "may you walk in the light of the Crystal" instead of invoking the Twelve or another specific god.

[ShadowMeowth]

Cut because too many characters.

Besides the point that both are false gods, the first one that "earned" the right to be called a god would be Zodiark, being will of the star made manifest and the whole thing, but whatever the point, they are both primals. However, in Lahabrea's defense (and I am not known for advocating in favor of Lahabrea) I speculate that, as the resident most prominent scholar and sage researching phantomology, the brunt of Zodiark's summoning would have fallen to him, and he probably directed the energies, the concept, that formed Zodiark. In any case, the way the Ascians refer to Zodiark as the one true god seems more like a formality than true belief. To be fair, except Elidibus because we know he does not have much of a choice there, even the Unsundered see Zodiark more like a means to an end: Lahabrea for whatever he is scheming and Elidibus has to admonish him, and Emet does not bat an eye when admitting that the only thing he expects from Zodiark is to have his people and his loved ones back. Rejoining the worlds, yes, of course the Unsundered work to that end, but that does not mean they necessarily enjoy the idea; at least Emet does not, because he himself admits he has been searching for "a path of lesser tragedy" for a long time. So the Rejoining is probably more about Zodiark's purpose (and I cannot blame the will of the star for wanting to become whole) seeping into His tempered and driving this compulsion.

As for the sundered Ascians, if Fandaniel is setting a precedent, then they definitely are not chained in service to Zodiark. And it would make sense because they are sundered, which means they ascended to their seats when Zodiark was already bound inside the moon, and He would have a hard time tempering anyone in that state. The only way I see them being tempered is if Elidibus had any hand in their ascension since he is a primal, but the one who had the constellation crystals was Emet, and Elidibus was quite taken aback when we give them to him. Perhaps the sundered Ascians are influenced, but not tempered; therefore, as Saint Ajora did in Hydaelyn's case, they can turn against Zodiark.

Concerning Lahabrea's condescending dismissal of Elidibus, well... Considering that Elidibus was suffering a bad case of fog-of-ages, I can see Lahabrea forgetting that Elidibus is actually a primal. So far, the only one who truly remembers things rather reliably is Emet, and he did because he made great efforts to not forget. And this is obvious because he littered every single nation we know he had a hand on with specific references to that which he did not want to forget, and the only Ascian who remembered the Fourteenth seat was him, and it was because he broke Ancient law and crafted Azem's crystal and held onto it hidden from the others for 12000 years.

[JeanneOrnitier]

And then there's Lahabrea, who goes on about Zodiark being the One True God and Hydaelyn being a False God(dess), even though literally nobody actively worships Hydaelyn as a deity. (We acknowledge her existence and also concede that she has godlike powers, but we don't worship her.)

Not even the Sundered necessarily see Zodiark as a god, as shown by Fandaniel. So I have no idea why Lahabrea got tempered hard enough to believe Zodiark to be the True God, when even Emet-Selch went "yeah, Zodiark's a Primal, he tempered us, next question". And Lahabrea's condescending dismissal of Elidibus also seems weird in light of the revelation that Elidibus is a Primal-made portion of Zodiark.

Lahabrea wasn't exactly right in the head. Didn't Emet say somewhere that Lahabrea body hopping so much broke his mind or something?

[Cilia]

Lahabrea wasn't exactly right in the head. Didn't Emet say somewhere that Lahabrea body hopping so much broke his mind or something?

It reduced his power due to the effort needed to wrest control of bodies from their owners. No mention of it reducing his mental faculties was ever made.

[Rosenoire]

Not even the Sundered necessarily see Zodiark as a god, as shown by Fandaniel. So I have no idea why Lahabrea got tempered hard enough to believe Zodiark to be the True God, when even Emet-Selch went "yeah, Zodiark's a Primal, he tempered us, next question".

When Emet-Selch gives us the big reveal after Qitana Ravel, he says:

Emet-Selch: But through prayer and sacrifice, the will of the star was made manifest.
Emet-Selch: Zodiark was His name, and by His grace was the calamity averted.
Emet-Selch:...A savior mighty and magnificent, deserving of reverence and gratitude one would have thought.

That definiitely sounds like worship.

[YianKutku]

When Emet-Selch gives us the big reveal after Qitana Ravel, he says:



That definiitely sounds like worship.

To be honest, given Emet-Selch's later (and some earlier) comments, I've always read this as biting sarcasm on Emet-Selch's part. But it's true that he could be sincere here, and the dialogue where he's less than reverent towards Zodiark could be his way of playing it cool for some reason.

[Kesey]

To be honest, given Emet-Selch's later (and some earlier) comments, I've always read this as biting sarcasm on Emet-Selch's part. But it's true that he could be sincere here, and the dialogue where he's less than reverent towards Zodiark could be his way of playing it cool for some reason.

It was sarcasm on Emet's part. But I think he was referring to the fact that even though they sacrificed so much to get Zodiark and saved their civilization, there was still a faction that broke off and summoned Hydaelyn, leading to the situation he has in the present of setting up and causing rejoinings. That he is allowed, from his POV, to be a bit salty about.