The toxicity starting to happen.

[Black_Wing]

Since I last posted, the conversation seems to have evolved into elitism around disability, laziness, casual players and the dislike of.

Lots of people agree by now that there is a level of toxicity happening in this game, THIS IS NOT NEW, and I don’t want anyone to think, that I think, this is new. I know this game is growing and will continue too. I am afraid of the forums and the community going from helpful and caring and kind to WOW,

I mean no Offence to you wow players but have you seen your forums? Your own community? Christ it’s toxic and I fear that this community, this game will go that route, the GW2 community elitism route.

People seem less interested in either helping because they are afraid of being yelled at and bullied, or to ask for help because they might get attacked. I run roulettes these days with nothing but sprigs and maybe 1/10 will either ask for help or accept help where as before it was 6/10 and every one wanted to help.

Things change, times change and communities evolve. I found a guy in my FC who spent hours with me the other day, helping me understand how to do rotations to get HQ collectables for crafting. He bought me gear, we voice chatted and he walked me through not just what the skills do, BUT WHAT ORDER IS BEST OPTIMIZED TO PRESS THEM IN given the circumstances.

HE SPENT HOURS and GIL to help me. On two of my classes.


NO ONE DOES THIS ANY MORE. No one helps each other. No one takes time to help people. You want a damn Gil sink, help a newbie level to eighty in a class.

Christ what’s wrong with this community. I learned so much and more and feel more accomplished as a crafter and gatherer.

And everyone generalizes everyone else to make a point. Just because you don't run into helpful people doesn't mean they don't exist. I help when I can with mechanics, but even I will have an off night.

[Ayuhra]

Since I last posted, the conversation seems to have evolved into elitism around disability, laziness, casual players and the dislike of.

Lots of people agree by now that there is a level of toxicity happening in this game, THIS IS NOT NEW, and I don’t want anyone to think, that I think, this is new. I know this game is growing and will continue too. I am afraid of the forums and the community going from helpful and caring and kind to WOW,

I mean no Offence to you wow players but have you seen your forums? Your own community? Christ it’s toxic and I fear that this community, this game will go that route, the GW2 community elitism route.

People seem less interested in either helping because they are afraid of being yelled at and bullied, or to ask for help because they might get attacked. I run roulettes these days with nothing but sprigs and maybe 1/10 will either ask for help or accept help where as before it was 6/10 and every one wanted to help.

Things change, times change and communities evolve. I found a guy in my FC who spent hours with me the other day, helping me understand how to do rotations to get HQ collectables for crafting. He bought me gear, we voice chatted and he walked me through not just what the skills do, BUT WHAT ORDER IS BEST OPTIMIZED TO PRESS THEM IN given the circumstances.

HE SPENT HOURS and GIL to help me. On two of my classes.


NO ONE DOES THIS ANY MORE. No one helps each other. No one takes time to help people. You want a damn Gil sink, help a newbie level to eighty in a class.

Christ what’s wrong with this community. I learned so much and more and feel more accomplished as a crafter and gatherer.

I've actually been running into more helpful people lately. They seem to keep to FCs that run around "adopting" newbies and showing them the ropes. Helpful folks are still out there.

[LaughingBanana]

I stand by what I said and my perspective. Didn't miss anything.

It was pretty awesome seeing the user I responded to just continue to reaffirm my statement, though. Not going to lie: Having my own personal beliefs about the "toxic casual" side of the community affirmed is vindicating. Those of us on the other side of the fence self-policed and removed the toxic people from our "clique," for lack of a better term. Be a toxic person? Good luck with raiding.

When will your side do the same?

No need to answer. The likes on their post tell me what it is. When you all learn that you shouldn't support people like Elcia, let me know. THAT is classic toxicity and you all certainly don't call it out. Can't wait to see a few select people jump through hoops to justify it.

Peace <3

Edit: Oh, and before someone tries the "well not everyone is like that" shtick: If all you hear is the vocal minority of your group, then they are your voice. They are your views. They represent you. And I gotta say, that voice comes out as ignorant and toxic to a lot of people, in game and out. Might wanna get to changing that.

Can we not just do, you know, "Your side" and "Us on the other side of the fence" thing? Because it saddens me to read that. It doesn't do anything other to inflame the flammable and widen the schism between all of us.

I responded the way I responded because I felt Ramesses' post was being unfair because how he seemingly characterized the entire new players group as this one big collective of toxic culture thing. And I think I am not being unfair to criticize how he unfairly treated the player that apologized towards him because of what happened when he played with their group.

This is the problem with this whole thing, everyone is so quick to generalize and unwilling to admit that bad apples (and good people) do exist in both veterans and new players alike, and are so quick to use judge a whole lot group of people just to appease their confirmation bias. I am a relatively new member of this community (relatively speaking, compared to the years and years many of you have been) and yet I already feel tired seeing this seemingly happening again and again and again and again.

Also: don't take this the wrong way: but maybe you aught to do what you advice at the last part of your post; try to hear more voices and not the ones agreeing and supporting your opinion only. And be more open minded and not let yourself be offended by something as trivial as likes on a post that you disagree with.

[jameseoakes]

Edit: Oh, and before someone tries the "well not everyone is like that" shtick: If all you hear is the vocal minority of your group, then they are your voice. They are your views. They represent you. And I gotta say, that voice comes out as ignorant and toxic to a lot of people, in game and out. Might wanna get to changing that.

That seems like a odd angel to push as the vocal minority of the raid community paints raiders is a very poor light and if they represent you then the raid scene has big issues

[Nekaru_Infitima]

Me thinks Darsien is either an elaborate troll or just has SJW mindset.

I don't see what's so hard about having patience for other users, and not looking down on them like you own the game.. =/

[WaxSw]

To be honest the biggest amount of toxicity I've seen in this game comes from the casual community, players refusing to learn, rejecting advice/leaving instance when advice is given and being disrespectful to those who give it, players who do not take into consideration the rest of the party and treat this game as a single player game, all of them are far more common than the "You're trash l2p idiot" kind of player.

Also I've noticed a huge amount of those players are healers (curebots) or single pulling no mitigation tanks

[Nekaru_Infitima]

To be honest the biggest amount of toxicity I've seen in this game comes from the casual community, players refusing to learn, rejecting advice/leaving instance when advice is given and being disrespectful to those who give it, players who do not take into consideration the rest of the party and treat this game as a single player game, all of them are far more common than the "You're trash l2p idiot" kind of player.

Also I've noticed a huge amount of those players are healers (curebots) or single pulling no mitigation tanks

And how is it toxicity to not want to watch a video or read a guide? Read the normal guide for the game, yeah. But to have to go through diagrams, others play styles, and videos just to have fun and play a game? That's not your call to make. That's not anyone's call to make. An MMO is not locked to only one playstyle that has to be super effecient or the people playing aren't 'doing it right'. It's an MMORPG "RPG" Role Playing Game. Taking on a role. Playing that role how you see fit.

[Shalan]

And how is it toxicity to not want to watch a video or read a guide? Read the normal guide for the game, yeah. But to have to go through diagrams, others play styles, and videos just to have fun and play a game? That's not your call to make. That's not anyone's call to make. An MMO is not locked to only one playstyle that has to be super effecient or the people playing aren't 'doing it right'. It's an MMORPG "RPG" Role Playing Game. Taking on a role. Playing that role how you see fit.

It's toxic because people apply that same attitude about how they don't have to play optimally to even the basic functions of their class.
Curebotting healers
Non-mitigating tanks
BLMs not using Enochian
Ice/Thunder Mages
Freestyle Sam
Non-positional Monks

The list goes on. And if you try to call it out people will rush to their defense and shout, "It's just a game! Let them play how they want to play! Don't try to tell them to do the most basic, simple rotation their class is expected to do!" Even if you try to be courteous and respectful in your request for better play people will still snap and hound you for it.

But for some reason, that's not viewed as being toxic, even though it's having a detrimental effect on the players grouped up with them.

Frankly it's insulting to those players as well. Imagine someone telling you that it's okay that you're playing worse than the trusts/NPCs in the game play. That their expectations of you are so low.

[Nekaru_Infitima]

It's toxic because people apply that same attitude about how they don't have to play optimally to even the basic functions of their class.
Curebotting healers
Non-mitigating tanks
BLMs not using Enochian
Ice/Thunder Mages
Freestyle Sam
Non-positional Monks

The list goes on. And if you try to call it out people will rush to their defense and shout, "It's just a game! Let them play how they want to play! Don't try to tell them to do the most basic, simple rotation their class is expected to do!" Even if you try to be courteous and respectful in your request for better play people will still snap and hound you for it.

But for some reason, that's not viewed as being toxic, even though it's having a detrimental effect on the players grouped up with them.

Look at it this way. Before wiki's were a thing and people made articles when the game was new no one knew what to do for their class, no one knew all the secrets, and the efficiency. Some people want to figure that out on their own, to play it without 'cheating'. I know I do. It feels totally cheap to look something up on a guide just because there's struggle. It's like in the Playstation days with strategy guides and walkthroughs. They're tools, and it's fine for people to use them. But not everyone wants to. Some want the mystery of discovery on their own.

Sure, a class may be played best one way with all its rotations. Yeah, some on here may have the class explained down to the literal quantum formulas. ... However, that takes the fun out of it. It's just cheating, by copying what someone else already figured out.

[Hugowulf]

It's toxic because people apply that same attitude about how they don't have to play optimally to even the basic functions of their class.
Curebotting healers
Non-mitigating tanks
BLMs not using Enochian
Ice/Thunder Mages
Freestyle Sam
Non-positional Monks

The list goes on. And if you try to call it out people will rush to their defense and shout, "It's just a game! Let them play how they want to play! Don't try to tell them to do the most basic, simple rotation their class is expected to do!" Even if you try to be courteous and respectful in your request for better play people will still snap and hound you for it.

But for some reason, that's not viewed as being toxic, even though it's having a detrimental effect on the players grouped up with them.

Frankly it's insulting to those players as well. Imagine someone telling you that it's okay that you're playing worse than the trusts/NPCs in the game play. That their expectations of you are so low.

To be fair the game doesn’t exactly explain how to play ones job at all, other than reading tool tips(which some don’t even bother with). It would be nice if novice extended to level 50 for jobs and how they function. Though I agree that it’s more bothersome that the other players have to stop and teach someone at 70+ content about how popping defensive cooldowns on a tank is beneficial for the team.