Revelations from Patch 5.3

[Fenral]

So anyway, on that assumption that all is well and it's only the Exarch's body that is there in the tower... it's a strange thing. He died and there's a body but at the same time he's not dead, so should it be mourned or not? His departure from the First might as well be death in some ways, and yet the people know he's alive but beyond their reach.

All of a sudden I am reminded of The Little Prince... there are shades of that story's ending here, I think, though of course it's not the same thing. But a bit of that mixed joy and sorrow.

In the major arcana of the Tarot, "death" is used less to mean "oh emm jeebers you gon die" like you see in fiction, but to symbolize an end necessary for a new beginning. Even when the Tarot aren't invoked, I still consider it a useful lens to view situations like this through. He did actually die as the Exarch, but rather than simply reverting to the old G'raha, he was reborn as a combination of the two.

(For aspiring writers out there, the tl;dr is that it is perfectly okay to bring dead characters back, as long as they are changed by the experience in some way, not necessarily the Pet Sematary kind of way...)

The Exarch ended up being this weird mashup of Desch and Xande (FFIII editions), I wrote up something a bit after he was revealed (speculative, so I got some stuff wrong), so I imagine this was probably the best way they had to reconcile those polar opposites.

Also yeah, Le Petit Prince is exactly the tone they were going for. Doing something that will definitely kill you, on the belief, with no concrete evidence, that it won't be the end. In that case, I think it's okay to mourn.

[Iscah]

The Exarch ended up being this weird mashup of Desch and Xande (FFIII editions), I wrote up something a bit after he was revealed (speculative, so I got some stuff wrong), so I imagine this was probably the best way they had to reconcile those polar opposites.

Having played FFIII now (minus actually defeating the Cloud of Darkness and getting to the ending) I don't see much parallel between the Exarch and Xande but I do think he's taking some degree of inspiration from the original Doga - at a superficial level, he's the old mentor-mage in a red cloak, but also the penultimate "gather heroes to help you in your moment of need" thing stuck out to me as parallel to the Exarch calling up heroes to help us fight Hades.

[Fenral]

Having played FFIII now (minus actually defeating the Cloud of Darkness and getting to the ending) I don't see much parallel between the Exarch and Xande but I do think he's taking some degree of inspiration from the original Doga - at a superficial level, he's the old mentor-mage in a red cloak, but also the penultimate "gather heroes to help you in your moment of need" thing stuck out to me as parallel to the Exarch calling up heroes to help us fight Hades.

Actually, yeah. I was seeing the Xande parallel as "going to great lengths to extend his lifespan in the face of an inevitable end," with "acceptance" as the most probable resolution to his arc with what little we had to go on (see also, Kuja), but he ended up crossing the Minwu threshold into anti-nihilism and then everything went really off the rails. But the way he "sacrificed" himself (in 2.5), went unremarked on for most of the story's runtime (until late 4.X), and then returned dramatically to save us is definitely the crowning Desch moment people (mostly JP) believed he was being set up for.

But now that you've met FFIII Desch, I think you can agree it's fitting that his "Salina" is actually the Warrior of Light (though I guess that's an ending spoiler kinda). I was admittedly worried they would lean too hard into the source material again and award that role to the literal, 2000-years-ago Salina (in a bid to stabilize the time loop).


Also, farm Eureka! The EXP is good, and having a large stack of Shuriken makes the adds on the remake's Cloud of Darkness a lot more manageable.

[Iscah]

Actually, yeah. I was seeing the Xande parallel as "going to great lengths to extend his lifespan in the face of an inevitable end," with "acceptance" as the most probable resolution to his arc with what little we had to go on (see also, Kuja), but he ended up crossing the Minwu threshold into anti-nihilism and then everything went really off the rails. But the way he "sacrificed" himself (in 2.5), went unremarked on for most of the story's runtime (until late 4.X), and then returned dramatically to save us is definitely the crowning Desch moment people (mostly JP) believed he was being set up for.

It seems strange to me if, as you said in your older linked post, people weren't seeing the parallel between G'raha and Desch. I can't have a neutral view on it since I went into FFIII already having read that it was the case, but the progression is clear from "trying to remember something important" to remembering he has a direct link to the ancient race that constructed the tower, and then sacrificing himself in some way.

I still don't see the parallel between the Exarch and Xande, beyond perhaps a tentative one in the very early days of speculation when all we knew was it's him! - if anything, it's a contrast. While both made some kind of effort to prolong their life, it was for utterly different reasons: Xande is fearful of his own death and will do anything to prevent it; the Exarch is acting on a need to survive so he can protect the lives of others.

But now that you've met FFIII Desch, I think you can agree it's fitting that his "Salina" is actually the Warrior of Light (though I guess that's an ending spoiler kinda). I was admittedly worried they would lean too hard into the source material again and award that role to the literal, 2000-years-ago Salina (in a bid to stabilize the time loop).

I think there's some character amalgamation going on in the FFXIV version of the story. "Princess Salina" seems to be FFIII Salina only in her relationship to Desch, and otherwise seems more likely to equate to Princess Sara - in fact, having met her first, I assumed that she probably was Salina and the name had been localised differently between games.

Anyway, for XIV it's definitely an equivalent having Raha reunited with [the person he cares about], rather than Salina specifically.

---

On a related note regarding FFXIV's Salina and Desch, my mind keeps going to the odd revelations we got from Heaven-on-High (particularly the follow-up quest), seeing as it name-dropped them again and now the larger CT plot has become so central to the game's story.

The Onishishu "seek the lost knowledge of the Allagans, that it may benefit the peoples of the modern world". Their founder knew Salina and Desch. The recorded conversation at the Pine - still overly cryptic - touches on the same themes that ring through Shadowbringers and was surely written in combination with it.

I can't see them forcing us to do Heaven-on-High for MSQ purposes but I could see the Onishishu returning for some future plot point that builds on the idea.

When I last played through HoH either shortly before or after 5.0, I thought at the time that if CT hadn't happened, G'raha probably would have been an excellent candidate for them to recruit, simply based on his expertise regarding Allag. And now... assuming they are keeping tabs on the WoL's activities then they might be very interested now.

Maybe G'raha is already a member. Or maybe Rammbroes is.

I wonder if they have ties to Sharlayan...?

[Fenral]

On a related note regarding FFXIV's Salina and Desch, my mind keeps going to the odd revelations we got from Heaven-on-High (particularly the follow-up quest), seeing as it name-dropped them again and now the larger CT plot has become so central to the game's story.

The Onishishu "seek the lost knowledge of the Allagans, that it may benefit the peoples of the modern world". Their founder knew Salina and Desch. The recorded conversation at the Pine - still overly cryptic - touches on the same themes that ring through Shadowbringers and was surely written in combination with it.

Ugh, FFXIV Salina. At this point, I think anything involving her can only be read in the broadest sense as "she knew Calamities were a cyclical occurrence." So, she figured the Crystal Tower could be a sort of insurance policy. And yet, every time she's mentioned, I get this nagging feeling like there was some specific future disaster she was trying to prevent, and not just the stuff we took care of during the 24-man series.

Though it seems now like whatever version of Salina was in G'raha's head back in 2.5 (I guess just a secondhand remembrance?) is a long abandoned plot point they don't intend to do anything with. With everything Hydaelyn has put us through, they really shouldn't have framed it like an Echo vision...