Has anyone quit healing?

[Billythepancake]

I'm still baffled. On launch, they shipped Sleeve Draw in the state where, not only can you draw the same card 3 times in a row, but you had to hit Draw before your 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Arrows in a row. I know it's a bit unfair to give 'em flak for issues they've addressed, but I also think it's unfair to say "they're doing their best" when there are so, so many issues that still need to be addressed one year later that we're getting radio silence on.



Is it too much to ask to have our new AST abilities playtested thoroughly first, by people who enjoy and understand the job, so that we don't have these incredibly frustrating and obvious issues in the first place?

I still give them flak for taking away energy drain on SCH without anything to replace. Literally anyone with the most basic understanding of the class would tell you that SCH flat out does not work without energy drain, they NEED some sort of DPS spell to spend aetherflow on, it is a worthless mechanic if you only have heals tied to it, it's like they learned nothing from SB lillies.


The worst part was they were told, vehemently, before release that it was a terrible idea. Players tested it, said SCH didn't feel right without ED.

Yet they still released SCH without energy drain, and, to nobody's surprise other than SE SCH did not work. Shocking innit?

Yet I'm 100% convinced they'll remove ED from SCH again come 6.0 and this time we won't get it back. Instead it'll be something dumb like "excess stacks turn into MP" and just make SCH even less interesting.

[Crushnight]

I'm still baffled. On launch, they shipped Sleeve Draw in the state where, not only can you draw the same card 3 times in a row, but you had to hit Draw before your 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Arrows in a row. I know it's a bit unfair to give 'em flak for issues they've addressed, but I also think it's unfair to say "they're doing their best" when there are so, so many issues that still need to be addressed one year later that we're getting radio silence on.



Is it too much to ask to have our new AST abilities playtested thoroughly first, by people who enjoy and understand the job, so that we don't have these incredibly frustrating and obvious issues in the first place?

If they had playtested we wouldn't have a useless stance that being Diurnal Sect for 4 levels, we wouldn't still have Undraw, there wouldn't be controller issues due to target switching so much, they give Healers the least amount of time and it shows, even dps and tanks are not immune to the neglect the lack of job design staff has caused, look at Smn/Drk/Mnk.

The job design team seriously needs a upgrade to at least 6 members, 1 overseerer, and 1 person per role (the ones SE set up so Tank, Healer, Caster, Melee, Ranged), it is showing how bad things are with their paltry 4 people for 17 jobs

[Crushnight]

I still give them flak for taking away energy drain on SCH without anything to replace. Literally anyone with the most basic understanding of the class would tell you that SCH flat out does not work without energy drain, they NEED some sort of DPS spell to spend aetherflow on, it is a worthless mechanic if you only have heals tied to it, it's like they learned nothing from SB lillies.


The worst part was they were told, vehemently, before release that it was a terrible idea. Players tested it, said SCH didn't feel right without ED.

Yet they still released SCH without energy drain, and, to nobody's surprise other than SE SCH did not work. Shocking innit?

Yet I'm 100% convinced they'll remove ED from SCH again come 6.0 and this time we won't get it back. Instead it'll be something dumb like "access stacks turn into MP" and just make SCH even less interesting.

Honestly see that happening too, along with Whm losing cure 3 to cross role, have aero 3 re-package to be a Holy upgrade, Ast to get more ogcds that benefit Diurnal more than Nocturnal further invalidating it, all the while all 3 healers get more ogcd heals, which makes cure 2/benefic 2/adlo nigh useless as content design won't change, and our spam goes from 60%-90% of our time to 80%-100%.

At which point SE will finally say we'll listen to feedback and give back one DoT. >_> yes I have that little faith in healer design from the Devs over 5 years of Nocturnal never being good enough, whm getting nothing to combat what the other healers bring on their own merits(essentially the other 2 had to be gutted for Whm to shine that is patooky backwards design philosophy), and the multiple removal of sch DoTs in multiple expansions.

[Morningstar1337]

Honestly see that happening too, along with Whm losing cure 3 to cross role, have aero 3 re-package to be a Holy upgrade, Ast to get more ogcds that benefit Diurnal more than Nocturnal further invalidating it, all the while all 3 healers get more ogcd heals, which makes cure 2/benefic 2/adlo nigh useless as content design won't change, and our spam goes from 60%-90% of our time to 80%-100%.

At which point SE will finally say we'll listen to feedback and give back one DoT. >_> yes I have that little faith in healer design from the Devs over 5 years of Nocturnal never being good enough, whm getting nothing to combat what the other healers bring on their own merits(essentially the other 2 had to be gutted for Whm to shine that is patooky backwards design philosophy), and the multiple removal of sch DoTs in multiple expansions.

I do wonder what effects could be more useful with shields compared to regens?

[Rilifane]

If they had playtested we wouldn't have a useless stance that being Diurnal Sect for 4 levels, we wouldn't still have Undraw, there wouldn't be controller issues due to target switching so much, they give Healers the least amount of time and it shows, even dps and tanks are not immune to the neglect the lack of job design staff has caused, look at Smn/Drk/Mnk.

The job design team seriously needs a upgrade to at least 6 members, 1 overseerer, and 1 person per role (the ones SE set up so Tank, Healer, Caster, Melee, Ranged), it is showing how bad things are with their paltry 4 people for 17 jobs

*cough* Fluid Aura *cough*

I wouldn't mind that one additional button if it was actually useful. Something like keeping the current seal but switching card. You have an Ewer, you get an Arrow with Undraw (or whatever they will call it), you have a Bole, you get a Balance etc. I'm probably the oddball here but I'm okay with some RNG as long as you also get tools to manipulate the outcome. You can get lucky and get maximum effect for no effort or you get unlucky and have to work for the (almost) same effect. But you can get it.
It would be a nice effect but nobody would worry about it outside optimized endgame content, making the additional button nice but not mandatory everywhere else. Just like almost no SCH manually places fairy outside endgame content or WHM happily clipping because those tiny things don't matter.

I'm placing my hopes in 6.0.
New healer, healer rework that gives us more interesting downtime, maybe some nice synergies between skills, some skills get reintroduced... things like that. And don't you dare crush my hopes with your realism. Until 6.0 is live I will dream.

[Gravagar]

If they had playtested we wouldn't have a useless stance that being Diurnal Sect for 4 levels, we wouldn't still have Undraw, there wouldn't be controller issues due to target switching so much, they give Healers the least amount of time and it shows, even dps and tanks are not immune to the neglect the lack of job design staff has caused, look at Smn/Drk/Mnk.

The job design team seriously needs a upgrade to at least 6 members, 1 overseerer, and 1 person per role (the ones SE set up so Tank, Healer, Caster, Melee, Ranged), it is showing how bad things are with their paltry 4 people for 17 jobs

They have HOW many?! Considering they're under the impression that melee / ranged / caster deeps "should" count as separate roles ([X] Strongly Disagree- by that token, regen and shield healers should be given separate real estate on the job list, too...) I'm gonna revise my statement: what we need is a public test world. They should've done, like, 85% of the work to get QA running during quarantine. Yikes...
What's the source for that number, btw? Do they show up in the credits somewhere?

[QooEr]

I do wonder what effects could be more useful with shields compared to regens?

maybe not shields in the strict sense of the word but mitigation. nocturnal collective unconscious made noct ast from Literally not even worth considering to actually a decently good choice just from that change alone. 20 seconds of 10% mitigation every minute is huge.

in stormblood, part of what compounded the ast/sch meta is that whm/ast was unviable. not only was whm weak (it did more damage than sch actually) but also noct ast could not hope to compete with scholar's mitigation (sacred soil every 30s + fey covenant) despite having stronger shields than sch.

if nocturnal sect was to actually compete with diurnal itd have to have stronger heals OR provide actual mitigation beyond shields

[YusiKha]

not only was whm weak (it did more damage than sch actually)

WHM did less damage than SCH and AST even before taking into account Chain Strat, Fey Wind, and Card buffs.
WHM was outclassed by AST in healing output, mitigation, and damage. Not only that, but SCH overcame AST's biggest weakness (single target healing) while WHM only made it worse (Diurnal Benefic >>> Noct Benefic)

noct ast could not hope to compete with scholar's mitigation (sacred soil every 30s + fey covenant) despite having stronger shields than sch.

Noct AST couldn't hope to compete with Scholar's healing output, not mitigation. Whispering Dawn was free and fantastic, and Indom was 500 potency on a 30s cooldown.

But most importantly, when it came to single-target healing. Noct + WHM only had Essential Dignity and Tetragrammaton before breaking into GCDs
Diurnal + Scholar had Essential Dignity, Excog, Embrace (buffable by Rouse and Convalesence), and Fey Union (even more uses with prepull AF and quickened AF), along with Diurnal Benefic.

[Crushnight]

They have HOW many?! Considering they're under the impression that melee / ranged / caster deeps "should" count as separate roles ([X] Strongly Disagree- by that token, regen and shield healers should be given separate real estate on the job list, too...) I'm gonna revise my statement: what we need is a public test world. They should've done, like, 85% of the work to get QA running during quarantine. Yikes...
What's the source for that number, btw? Do they show up in the credits somewhere?

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...threads/391471

Sebazy did an excellent thread about it at the end of SB the amount of people hasn't changed with ShB based on its credits, the job design team is understaffed and it will only get worse the more jobs added.

[Gravagar]

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...threads/391471

Sebazy did an excellent thread about it at the end of SB the amount of people hasn't changed with ShB based on its credits, the job design team is understaffed and it will only get worse the more jobs added.

Sorry, having a little difficulty with the link- which forum is it from? It redirects me to the EN top page, since forum ID 619 is that. I wanna see this thread, this sounds spicy.