It's time (Option to Hide other players Glamour)

[Krotoan]

And after that, we could all just make every map but dungeons character exclusive, so you can't see anyone outside dungeons.

Remember that MMOs are social by definition, and should be preserved that way...

Unrelated statements. The encounters were designed to be run by more than one player. The amount of work necessary to make the entire game single player accessible would be prohibitive. Also slippery slope logic. Just because I wish not to see thong-frog the shiny purple wonder, doesn't mean I never wish to interact with anyone. Heck I might even have a day I'll interact freely with his incredibly creative and whimsical character.. but I don't want to HAVE to.


MMO's are social as a symptom. By definition they're just games that many people play at the same time, in the same world. I've finished literally thousands of instances without saying a word. I've ground through 2 maps of Eureka without talking to ANY of the mishmash of insanity that is the shout chat. Other people are playing the game in the same world, this in no way means I must give each and every one of them anything above basic human courtesy.

[MelodyCrystel]

Please don't compare a crime with freedom of expression.

Sorry, can't follow your definition of "crime" in this case.

If it's about pedos:
Lalafell hardly match a normal human physique (closest would be toddlers) - and, furthermore, I was told in this forum that pedos playing this game prefer small Au Ra girls a ka playable characters - so that argument won't count for me.

If it's about traps:
Excuse me, princess, but there's nothing wrong with feminine looking guys and / or guys who enjoy female clothing.

If it's about Lalafell:
Oi, Lalas are cute little potatos, so what's your problem?

[Iscah]

Pardon?

I'm not the last to consider the world and people can be creepy but... I can't get ride from the idea it goes a bit too far to think that way. You're not your character and your character is not you and... well... it's just a 3D model running virtualy in an alternate world and who as no actual feelings or whatever since it is just a program and a virtual story...

But never mind. Definitely, I suppose I will never be good at RP.

It's not RP. For the purpose of interacting with other people in the game world, and also here talking to people on the forum, my character is the "face" attached to my actions. Therefore she is how people perceive me in the game world. Therefore, my choices in how I present her is how I present myself to others in the virtual space.

It's more like putting clothes on, except there's a whole visible person attached to those clothes.

When I'm playing the RPG story of FFXIV, Aurelie is a character in the same way any non-customisable player-character might be in another game. She's acting under her own willpower within the story, and I just take her where she needs to go. I care about her but she's not me.

But in the social world of FFXIV where you're not interacting with the story or the story-characters? She's not a story character any more either. She's being used as an avatar for my interactions with other people. They address me by her name, in-game or even in voice chat, and I recognise it as if they used my real one. If I want to wave to someone, I instruct her to do it.

I would expect that's actually a pretty common thing that if you're constantly acting through a character, you start to see that as an extension of yourself, whether you intended it or not.

And in that context, yes. I want her to wear something that I personally am happy to be seen wearing.

[Eldevern]

I get the point. The fact is my character is... just some kind of puppet and I am the puppeteer, even if I were playing a male character it wouldn't change. Or maybe by instinct I play a female character to keep the distance.

EDIT : Well, I need to fix it. It was not by instinct, it was a purpose to play not with an avatar but with some kind of puppet.

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

If it's about pedos:
Lalafell hardly match a normal human physique (closest would be toddlers) - and, furthermore, I was told in this forum that pedos playing this game prefer small Au Ra girls a ka playable characters - so that argument won't count for me.

I don't know what pedos play, nor what they want to play, and I sure don't want to know. But calling traps, which is a highly sexual connoted word, something that looks, from your own words, like toddlers, that's definitely pedophilia and a big yikes.

If it's about traps:
Excuse me, princess, but there's nothing wrong with feminine looking guys and / or guys who enjoy female clothing.

I've spent the last 4 or 5 messages arguing for feminine clothing for males (or masculine clothing for females), please don't just read what is being said to you, but what is said on the thread you're talking about. Also, fetishizing transgender people (or crossdressing people) is pretty much just as bad as fetishizing races or anything, and I do hope you're just calling them traps for the meme, and not because that's just a fetish, 'cause that would be highly disrespectful.

If it's about Lalafell:
Oi, Lalas are cute little potatos, so what's your problem?

My two best friends play lalafells, there is nothing wrong with that. They just deserve better players than some people that play them.

I get the point. The fact is my character is... just some kind of puppet and I am the puppeteer, even if I were playing a male character it wouldn't change. Or maybe by instinct I play a female character to keep the distance.

And that's perfectly alright. Nobody should try to change the way you play the game. Nobody's saying you're a bad person because of that. You can of course play a MMORPG without ever concerning yourself with other people, but don't take the option out for other players.

[Eldevern]

...

I do interact with others players.

In fact, I've discovered Internet more or less between 1996 and 1999 and already at that time, there were some kind of jokes, of meme, a warning among us (it was more or less before A grade) :
Don't trust people you see on internet, the cute girl can be a ugly fat guy with dirty beard, at home, laughing at you while eating chips and the ugly monster avatar with male pseudonym can be a beautiful girl.

I guess it remains in my mind whatever I do on Internet and leads me to act accordingly.

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

I do interact with others players.

In fact, I've discovered Internet more or less between 1996 and 1999 and already at that time, there were some kind of jokes, of meme, a warning among us (it was more or less before A grade) :
Don't trust people you see on internet, the cute girl can be a ugly fat guy with dirty beard, at home, laughing at you while eating chips and the ugly monster avatar with male pseudonym can be a beautiful girl.

I guess it remains in my mind whatever I do on Internet and leads me to act accordingly.

Yeah, I was indirectly answering Krotoan here, when I say you can play without concerning yourself with others. My point was "Either your or Krotoan's way of playing are as valid as mine or whoever's, that's why FFXIV should remain a space where everyone can play the way they want". Sorry for not being clear about it.

And of course, there are people that lie about themselves, for whatever reason (because they're trolls, because they fear harassment, and everything in between or outside of that) but, and I certainly won't teach you that out of all things, it's only as important as the trust you put in these people.

[Iscah]

I get the point. The fact is my character is... just some kind of puppet and I am the puppeteer, even if I were playing a male character it wouldn't change. Or maybe by instinct I play a female character to keep the distance.

I'm sure there's some element of association. I have alts of both genders and I do feel less protective about what the male characters wear in terms of personally representing me - though still overall conservative (except occasionally more open shirts when it works for the outfit, and only on certain characters) and I'm more strongly "this is how the character would dress" and job gear is very rarely the answer for any of them. I wouldn't want to dress "silly" on any of them because I hate being silly.


On the issue of identifying with a character though, perhaps there are different types of that too. I think the "social identity" of characters-as-avatars works in a different way to the "emotional identity" of character-as-story-protagonist, because I've never had any trouble identifying with characters of any physical appearance - the emotion of the story is key and identifying with them comes from, I think, being made to feel the same emotion that the character would be feeling at a particular moment.

The most standout moments in gaming for me have been where that "player feeling the character's emotions" builds to a point - perhaps combined with established gameplay cues - that when it momentarily tricks your brain into thinking as that character, in that space, making an urgent decision with no thought of it being a game. The character's choice is your choice and you feel like you own the consequences. It's only happened twice, and neither of those characters were anything like me, but I felt how they were feeling.

But this is quite a digression.

[Eldevern]

But this is quite a digression.

Not that much. Playing a RPG, whatever the way it's done is to play with reality or to escape the reality but is always pretty related to our feelings, our relationships, the rules in real life.

We admit it or not, it is some kind of alternative life. The real question is the way we chose to "live" it, how and why.

I will keep my reasons for myself

[Awha]

Sorry still do not get it, if the option is client side and no icon is placed how would anyone know a person has had their appearance changed unless they mention it or catch them streaming.

And even if someone does find out as others have mentioned to those in favor of the feature one can simply choose to ignore them and move on. Sure the stream creates a record, but is that really such a big deal? Especially if the feature makes everyone name into initials. Sure one could still figure out it is them, but it would be harder and require a little more effort outside a quick glance or viewing.

I grant this is a first world problem, and maybe I am just out of touch of reality but in the game a video is an escape for many people, so if those that are advocating for a safe space for certain players who wish to Express themselves in such a way that may not be accepted outside why can the same not be requested for those that wish to refrain from seeing certain things while playing a video game?