Valentione's Day Items

[Clover_Blake]

Making clothes for both genders would take extra resources. Considering that the vast majority of males want to dress like males, and that resources aren't unlimited, I can see why they wouldn't consider spending extra work and money on such a thing.

There are still many feminine pieces that males can use, way more than lolita fashion pieces I can use myself. I simply understand that I'm a minority and my personal priorities (lolita fashion) shouldn't be demanded.

[KatieConnr]

Making clothes for both genders would take extra resources. Considering that the vast majority of males want to dress like males, and that resources aren't unlimited, I can see why they wouldn't consider spending extra work and money on such a thing.

There are still many feminine pieces that males can use, way more than lolita fashion pieces I can use myself. I simply understand that I'm a minority and my personal priorities (lolita fashion) shouldn't be demanded.

With you on that one.......High house Justacorps would be awesome to wear -just to name one thing.

[REPROBEAN_CHILD]

As a person who wears the YoRHa Casting dress 90% of the time at the moment, no, I don't have an issue with femininity, or the dress for that matter. I just don't think my character would wear a dress like that. I feel like it's more of a playful/ outgoing/ heart-on-their-sleeve character's style, which is something my character isn't. This was never about femininity, this was about freedom of choice and ability to dress as whatever one likes, no matter the gender.

And no, this community doesn't have an 'issue with femininity'? People would just like there to be freedom in how they are allowed to express themselves in their game and their avatars of choice. That's their business. Yoshida has expressed a desire to open things up on that front and people hoped that would happen more. And people are allowed to say so. People are also allowed to have different tastes and opinions therein, including on this dress/suit combo. Not everyone likes it, some do. Not everyone loves the harlequin look, and the fact that the parts of it would be tricky to use in other glamours.

I bring this up, because a lot of point of contention about glam stems from female clothing. Just a few months ago, there was vitriol over female characters getting two female glams back to back on mog station. And then it's this; people acting as if the dress is horrible when it's not and that the male is vastly better, when that's completely subjective. I've never seen male clothing hated, before it even has the chance to be released. But I digress.

[Iscah]

What exactly is wrong with the dress? I see all this backlach and vouching for the suit, yet the dress itself anywhere near as bad as people are saying that it is. I actually like the way it looks. I have a feminine highlander, so this will be perfect for her. It's very similar to the Thavnairain Wool dress in terms of length. So, I don't see why people are complaining, like it's the worst thing ever. Far from it.

Here's another question: Does this community have an issue with femininity? I don't mean slutty or revealing outfits, like DNC artifact gear. I mean dresses, like the Far Eastern Matriarch. I just see far more requests for making the suit unisex and anything feminine is "reinforcing gendered stereotypes." And so what if they don't make it unisex? The males get something cool for a change. It's so ironic that this community bemoaned that males don't get cool glams (which they do), and when something like this comes along, it must be made unisex.

Simply enough, I just don't think it's a very nice dress.

I certainly have no issue with feminity (besides the game's tendency to equate it with "make the outfit more revealing") - most of Aurelie's outfits are dresses and skirts, and I love it when I find things that work for my Roegadyn alt.

The Valentione's dress just looks awkward to me. Particularly, the skirt looks incredibly stiff - more like a flat cone than a fabric skirt.

Compare the Thavnairian wool dress (which is actually nowhere near the Valentione's dress in terms of length, but does have a similar construction with stitched ruffles along the lower hem). Look at the texture of it - the small folds and gathers across the fabric. The Valentione's dress doesn't seem to have any of that - just a flat colour, suggesting a very stiff skirt or supporting petticoat. It also makes it look somewhat cartoony.

The patterned tights are going to be hard to find other uses for, at least for me. I'd rather have plain ones.

And I'm just not keen on the top. I don't like the sleeveless look, and it's just... not quite right. I think it reminds me of an apron more than a dress.

Meanwhile, the male version is just nice. It's something you could use in more situations, and it looks stylish.

Personally, I would have liked to get a more feminine version of the waistcoat - more of a blouse maybe, with gathered sleeves, more ornate collar/cuffs and a bow at the neck instead of the tie. Keep the tights, add a nicer skirt (maybe a less-vanishing version of the Quaintrelle's?). I guess the problem would be whether to attach the skirt to the blouse or to the tights - or give two versions of the tights with/without skirt, but then it wouldn't be "fair" that the guys only get one set of pants. But that's another slippery business...

Gents got the 2B dress and I have seen like 2 male characters wear it. I have seen zero guys wear the bunny costume since ShB launched. Why exactly does a 1% minority need the same amount of glamour as normal people? It takes resources and we probably wouldn't get two versions of an outfit. We didn't get a masculine counterpart for the level 1 cosmetic 2B set, for example.

The NieR raids aren't over yet, so we can't say for sure that we don't get a unisex masculine counterpart to the 2B set until we've seen everything that's planned to be released.

On the broader question of whether anyone is actually using the 2B dress or bunny suit... I've seen a few people use it, but more importantly I've seen people wearing pieces of the outfit more often than the whole thing. Would you notice if a male character was just wearing the rabbit ears, or the plain cloth wristbands, or 2B's boots?

In some ways yes, it does mean a disproportionate amount of effort is being put into adapting the core outfits for a small number of people who would wear them, and personally I would love to see more adapted designs instead of transferring the female version straight over, but they're in an awkward position when a lot of people do want the male outfits for their female characters but a lot less want the female outfits for male characters.

Do they take the previous approach of only making the "male" costume unisex while not putting the resources into modelling the counterpart female costume for male characters? (Resource-efficient but leads to people complaining that female characters get more outfits.) Or do they keep the number of outfits balanced with a "both or neither" approach to unisex outfits, regardless of how many people would actually use it?

It also depends what sort of time they are putting into the adaptation work. Are they being assigned it as something to be prepared on a deadline with a planned release date, or is it a background task that they pick up on the occasions when they've finished everything else they had to do (or can currently do) to keep on the current production schedule?

I bring this up, because a lot of point of contention about glam stems from female clothing. Just a few months ago, there was vitriol over female characters getting two female glams back to back on mog station. And then it's this; people acting as if the dress is horrible when it's not and that the male is vastly better, when that's completely subjective. I've never seen male clothing hated, before it even has the chance to be released. But I digress.

I think you may find there are a small number of people here who repeat their complaint about male-female outfit balance every time it happens, while overlooking things like there being a logical reason to release unisex-male exclusive-female pairs (as discussed above) - and overlooking things like getting new male hairstyles for free while new female hairstyles are locked behind Eureka/HoH.

(Personally, when you have to pay for the outfits I don't see the balance being anywhere near as important as it is for free ones within the game. Though I do find it disappointing that Y'shtola got a new outfit for Shadowbringers - which you know is going to end up on Mog Station - while Thancred and Urianger only got recycled relic gear, which probably won't be sold. That's more of a character-fairness thing as far as I'm concerned, but it's how we end up with the "more female than male NPC outfits on Mog Station" imbalance in the first place, when they put more priority into designing outfits for female NPCs.)

I have definitely seen "male clothing hated" though - there's not enough of it, or it's too feminine when we get it. There was a post a while back complaining that the Adventuring Sweater and Spring Shirt only looked good on female characters (they don't). There were complaints about the Boulevardier set - somewhat justified with dear goodness those ruffled shorts but it's not like you're required to wear the full set, and we already have other pants to combine with the shirt. They're even salvageable if you wear them with long boots so they tuck in, and I've occasionally seen people wearing them as-is - usually Lalafells, but still.

Personally I think we have lots of unisex stuff that looks better on male characters, but that seems to be overlooked in favour of just counting up the numbers of how many unique items each gender gets.

[Tlamila]

So wait, to be "feminine" (stupid word) you have to wear ribbons and lace and hearts? If so, I've been doing real life wrong as well, and so have most people.
There's a different between not being "feminine" (whatever that means) and not wanting to dress up like a kitsch porcelain doll.

[Rymm]

Simply enough, it's just not a very nice dress.

I love this dress and can't wait to get my hands on it. It's playful and fun and suits the theme of the event.

cutsey dresses only ever work on smol and skinny races.

My character has been exclusively femroe since day one. I will be rocking this dress the day the event drops.

Every single opinion in this thread is entirely subjective. There is no right answer. People will be going back and forth with the "Yeah-huh/Nuh-uh" argument until the next glamour item is released and they can fight about it instead.

[Iscah]

I love this dress and can't wait to get my hands on it. It's playful and fun and suits the theme of the event.

It's very much personal opinion, and I did mean that statement as an opinion of "why I personally do not like it (despite having no issue with dresses)".

I'll amend that wording.

[reivaxe]

Every single opinion in this thread is entirely subjective. There is no right answer. People will be going back and forth with the "Yeah-huh/Nuh-uh" argument until the next glamour item is released and they can fight about it instead.

Yeeeah, my giant woman can be mega cute when she wants to be.

Sure, I'd say I don't personally like how so-n-so tops looks on her ... but with some thought, good matching and color theory I can make a number of cute looks using cute tops. It's all subjective really.

As for this dress I can't say much about it til I see it in game.

[KalinOrthos]

Ugh, but I want the vest. SE, we look good in vests and slacks, I promise!

[Jumper]

What exactly is wrong with the dress? I see all this backlach and vouching for the suit, yet the dress itself anywhere near as bad as people are saying that it is. I actually like the way it looks. I have a feminine highlander, so this will be perfect for her. It's very similar to the Thavnairain Wool dress in terms of length. So, I don't see why people are complaining, like it's the worst thing ever. Far from it.

Here's another question: Does this community have an issue with femininity? I don't mean slutty or revealing outfits, like DNC artifact gear. I mean dresses, like the Far Eastern Matriarch. I just see far more requests for making the suit unisex and anything feminine is "reinforcing gendered stereotypes." And so what if they don't make it unisex? The males get something cool for a change. It's so ironic that this community bemoaned that males don't get cool glams (which they do), and when something like this comes along, it must be made unisex.



I was a Roe for over two years. True, glam is harder for them, but you can make a feminine Roe if you used the right pieces. I have two highlanders and one of them is quite feminine. People can make characters anyway they want. But I've noticed people tend to make butch Roes and Highlanders, because it's easier to make them that way. Highlander is no more less feminine than a Viera

Part of my dislike for the dress is how it's going to hang on a femroe over how the vest will look. If you look at like, the princess dress, or any big skirt'ed armor, they've rigged the armor model REALLY high on the waist compared to other races.

Which leaves Roe's rocking a maternity dress look when all it needs, is to be like three of four comparative inches lower on the torso. The way this thing is now, it's going to be a circus tent.

I'd even just take the top as a separate piece without the skirt attached, if I couldn't get the vest, but that skirt is going to be a lalafel wedding chapel on femroes.