Bring back crowd control. Bring back branching dungeons. Bring back ADVENTURE.

[Quri]

Make the raids like this and you solve the problem. Like Destiny they have loot hidden around. So if they do that it solve the problem. BA kinda did that and it was the best raid experience so far.

[Shurrikhan]

tether was useless and nobody used it other than you so they said we're getting rid of it.

Her, Jim from Eureka, Janet from PotD, James from FATEs...

Seriously, though, why did they remove that, yet leave the more costly niche tools like Shield Bash?

[StriderShinryu]

This really is a tough one. Going back to some of the earlier dungeons for Itinerant Moogle really made it even more clear that dungeon design philosophy in FF14 has changed dramatically. Qarn, amongst others, was pretty cool in it's design with a pretty straightforward path but optional puzzles/rooms for treasure if you cared. It also had pretty interesting bosses for that level range and mobs that were legitimately dangerous if not taken care of properly. A large part of me absolutely does want more dungeons like that. But, yeah, we all know that even if they did bring design like that back no one would actually do it outside of the first few runs where they used the bonus rooms to get geared for the level. So I can understand why the devs don't bother with that sort of design any more (and I'm just as guilty as everyone else of just wanting to burn through ASAP once you've done it two or three times).

So would I like to see more adventurous and interesting dungeons again? Yes, but I recognize it's unlikely we'll get them and we really probably shouldn't unless the devs can come up with some new interesting way to make running them "properly" actually appealing.

[CookiesNCreams]

Brain input required. Too difficult, please nerf. Msq content should not be difficult to complete. Stop shutting me out the game with savage quality dungeons. What do you mean I need to use cooldowns? Heal? For real?

Hmm think that’s about it?

Brilliant lol. Same could be said about people using the same excuse for wanting to spam macros during endgame crafting instead of using their brains. :P

[PyurBlue]

The thing is.... It's only an adventure the first time. After that, its already known.

Adventure is great and all, but you can only experience something for the first time once.

That's only true for a static dungeon. There are a lot of ways to get around problems like this, though how easy they are to add into the game is another question.

I think too many people are focusing on what has been done and not what could be. While I'm not exactly sure what Dinah is asking for, the old dungeons aren't the only ways to feature exploration or differing design. I'd like to see more variety myself, but as I said before I don't see the low level dungeons as examples of super interesting content.

[Valic]

I've been wanting more dungeons that aren't just run from point A to point B and do X mechanics for 4 minutes until boss dies so you can repeat that algorithm 2 more times but with an additional "epic ending boss cutscene". I've been saying we need less linear dungeons in general with things that focus on strategy and cooperation. Maybe dungeons that aren't just one big line but instead have a giant open area where the party has to go together to different objectives similar to the first ARR 24 man(minus the lockout of content until "X" boss is defeated). Or dungeons where all 4 have to split into different sections to handle separate mechanics that need to be completed within a time frame. things that require the team to assign responsibilities, roles, duties, and etc to adventure and defeat the dungeon... Not just "have the dps and do the things so your dps isn't 0". I wish there were ideas taken out of Satasha's first mechanic of reading the book to know how to proceed through the first door without traps but on a grander scale that forces the party to delegate responsibilities to specific jobs.

Or even have dungeons that aren't just dungeons, but instead instances similar to the ones we have to queue for alone. Such as this section of the area needs a defender to stall the enemies until blank is ready, meanwhile this section needs a healer to assist the other side's defense. Meanwhile this side has no reinforcements and needs damage on the field sent out.... Etc. Like adding NPC's in place of roles and duties but still lacking certain abilities that will require YOUR party to understand who needs to do what and where. All the while it needs to be done with coordination or wipe.


I feel like I've seen games do this, but for some reason FFXIV is afraid to give up this formula because it's the standard for an mmo that people are comfy with and everyone seems to hate change. Or when they do execute ideas like this, people more vocally say they dislike the content... A great example being the dragon walking across the bridge that the party has to use cannons and etc for...

That's only true for a static dungeon. There are a lot of ways to get around problems like this, though how easy they are to add into the game is another question.

I mean, just like the satasha example I used above... could use that alone for several ideas andin different manners. We have treasure hunts with a format that almost complicates things but still keeps a set "formula" of things such as "this floor will randomly spawn this big mob, or 3 smaller mobs, or the 5 mobs in order to kill, along with the standard 3 sets of enemies to clear the floor".

The problem is FFXIV keeps using a standard formula, without changing up the base design. What if they designed a dungeon that all 3 paths of it had different segments that interchange. The first time around would be new, the 2nd and third time around would be varying degrees of familiarity and party members could discuss "oh I've seen this path in my last run here, you have to do blank". Part of this is laziness/time/resources... Personally I think they could get away with a lot more if they experimented more with RNG in dungeons, and not just a "1 of 3 possibilities" idea. That's usually why I like mechanics that don't specifically mark tanks/healers or specific dps, and instead mark all party members with randomness. Like the 24man in SB that does the prime numbers mechanic, or the boss in the monk temple that assigns you a sun or moon coin that determines where you need to move. If they could turn mechanics like that into things more corresponding to whole dungeon layouts and how the party traverses them... It'd be a lot more interesting. Even better if they made it so many enemies aren't always the same pack or in the same exact spots or 100% always the same exact boss or the same 1 in 3 bosses... Heck, how about a dungeon where depending on how fast or slow you get through bosses determines what bosses you fight at the end or what path opens up in the dungeon.

Or how about one that actually requires a person to throw a body off the side as a sacrifice like we all meme about to open a pathway and then the healer is required to res the person.

Or how about something that isn't conveyed as just one form of progression and isn't even told directly to the player? Like maybe reading the notes in a dungeon tells you if you do X emote at X spot, you open a secret pathway to X. Or dying to X boss at least once causes X to activate a certain thing at X.... there's so much potential I feel like but..... screw it all, the formula of dungeons work... and why would they change something that people are used to and know works?

[Berteaux_Braumegain]

I think a dungeon where there's multiple paths, which includes multiple ways to clear the dungeon would be cool. And depending on decisions through out the dungeon, it could change which path you have to take. Maybe a bit much for a normal dungeon, though. Maybe some sort of side content?

That'd be neat, but I imagine that before long you'd have people complaining about you taking the "longer route" or choosing to deal with the "harder boss".

[Valic]

That'd be neat, but I imagine that before long you'd have people complaining about you taking the "longer route" or choosing to deal with the "harder boss".

Doesn't even have to be that simple. Could make it so that maybe your party has more ranged dealers than melee and the decisions you make in the dungeon can influence you to get a boss that's particularly easier to deal with as a caster or ranged job than a melee one. Using hints given through the dungeon or experience with it. Or create different trap patterns on the floor that the party has to look at the notes ahead of time to memorize where is safe to actually run through without dying. Instead of just "every run I've been here, this rile and this tile are always safe to run to, and it always will be" type deals.

[Nestama]

I think a dungeon where there's multiple paths, which includes multiple ways to clear the dungeon would be cool. And depending on decisions through out the dungeon, it could change which path you have to take. Maybe a bit much for a normal dungeon, though. Maybe some sort of side content?

People would just always choose the quickest/easiest path and stick to it, regardless of the rewards. If people meet a disagreement, then someone is probably gonna get kicked.
So instead of multiple pathways leading to a different boss/reward, why not instead be different linear pathways per run. One run you go left, another run you go right. Clear times will always be the same (player skill excluded), but at least you'll be seeing more of a dungeon (maybe different bosses, too).

Kinda like Left 4 Dead 2, where the AI Director would close up some pathways and have you go down a different pathway (though the safe room would always be the same).

[DenzelVilliers]

ARR Dungeons was more open, with opcional rooms with chests and stuff like that, but it's "useless" since people even back in that time always ignored those side stuff, they always go straight to the main/quickest point and that's it. Those Dungeons design was fun but a waste of resources and effort since people makes it trivial