Monk rework/dmg nerf idea.

[Vendalwind]

The problem with that logic is it ignores that the devs have admitted to not having much of an idea of what to do with Monk moving forward from expansion to expansion while also saying they were convinced that Monk in ARR was a complete job.

That isn't a problem with my logic. My logic was sound, but did not examine or analyze ALL events ever in the history of the game. If all events had to be considered for logic to be sound then no logic in any field except for math would be sound.

ANYWAYS
That's definitely some analysis I hadn't considered, And you have some good points. It is absolutely true that the negligence towards Fists Of* suggests that it hasn't been integral to their current iteration of the job. And the Decoupling of riddles from fist stances further suggest that, but what I said about the original complete job still holds true, even if back in ARR fist stances weren't perfectly designed, they were absolutely a facet of the Monks original identity and development.

So I pretty much agree with all of your analysis except this one part:

I'd posit that the Fist Stances aren't part of the Jobs identity right now and they never have been.

The "they never have been" part you have not disproven by any means. Absolutely right now they aren't really part of MNK identity, but to me at the beginning of the game they absolutely were, and I would posit that by very nature of being included in, and acquired by the job quests in ARR that they were very much part of Monks identity at least during ARR.

Regardless I've made it pretty clear my position is one of perspective and desire. I LIKE the Fist Of* moves and want them to become a more prominent part of Monk's kit, thus my proposals and hopes for the classes future.

I don't think forcing Monk to slow down (again) and stance dance just so it can use Riddle of Fire is a good interaction at all. It actively draws away from one of the few good things about Shadowbringer Monk by taking you out of GL4.

I disagree, which isn't to invalidate your statement, as I recognize you think would be a bad interaction. To me trade-offs with positive gain are a very valuable and interesting way to build a class. Losing GL4 for 20 seconds (with it 5% atk speed) to instead net gain 20% bonus dmg for those seconds is a very good trade off. Now this may be biased and here is admitting why: I enjoy NIN at the moment. And... well basically every part of NIN's kit right now is a trade off.

Using a Ninjutsu right now is a guaranteed minor clip into GCDs resulting in a lost GCD over time.
Using Suiton Loses you a Raiton, and some additional GCD clip, but gains you access to trick attack.
Using Meisui trades access to trick attack and loses a raiton OR a gcd if used in TCJ in favor of half a bhavacakra, or a better aligned bunshin. Literally a CRAZY trade off that requires over 20 seconds of prep to net gain only 30 potency should you be able to actually get the bhavacakra in. (what the hell Devs? this is the only trade off I hate right now)
Using TCJ loses you 2-4 GCDs, but is still very much a potency gain.
Delaying Mug loses you some Mug potency, but prevents Ninki overcapping from time to time, and honestly its hard to tell when and how long one can delay mug without serious loss. but It is still an interesting trade off tool that takes skill and fight knowledge to use perfectly.

My point being trade offs aren't inherently bad, but can sometimes make a class more dynamic and interesting. Right now MNK doesn't have to make any decisions with any amount of foresight. If you do the opener right it's pretty much just use everything in order, on cooldown, and react to disconnects or downtime appropriately. I want MNK to be more than that.

And it's obvious... that many people don't want MNK to be more than that. And that's okay.

It actively draws away from one of the few good things about Shadowbringer Monk by taking you out of GL4.

To me that's actually one of the bad things about ShB. I actually don't like just sitting in GL4 and ignoring positionals. via riddle of earth. And if it wasn't the case then TK might still be useful. In fact I'd go as far as to say that sitting in GL4 right now is so valuable, that its the thing that indirectly makes so many other parts of the kit flawed and useless currently. But that is absolutely just a perspective opinion.