Reimbursement for Lost Tomes due to Wrongful use of Kick

[Noitems]

Me. Stop making it about. Me.

All I care about is to hear the pros or cons of having a system, and that's as little as a fourth of the content posted here. Now I am being blamed

If you started this thread going into detail of what ACTUALLY happened to get you vote kicked, instead of being absolutely vague on the concept and name dropping an entire Data Center then more people here would be showing sympathy for you. However you worded your post as an individual account (so we can relate to you) and then tried making it a broader statement. Problem is by not actually explaining (even now with so multiple people asking why) you're hurting your entire argument and making yourself look like a clown.

There are threads you can have this general conversation in, but the way you worded your first post and the domino effect it's having is not giving YOU any credibility. Going back and editing it didn't change a thing except make you look worse by comparison when the post history for quotes tells a different story.

[HyoMinPark]

Whether or not -I- specifically deserved a kick is irrelevant to reimbursement needed for a rampant problem. Even if I were justified to be kicked 9 out of 10 times, the other one needs coverage and it's not just me but thousands of players suffering that a week. We need some coverage for toxic PvE that's weeded out my friend's list real thin. That's why I am suggesting this and only because of GM prompting.

How can you prove that this problem is rampant? How can you prove that it affects thousands of players? You have nothing but anecdotes—and some of these anecdotes are likely not even entirely truthful in nature. You have no actual statistics of the amount of legitimate kicks versus the amount of abusive kicks.

Do you know what the GMs and the developers have? Statistics. They can see how many vote dismissals are deemed abusive or not, and can choose to act or make an announcement if they find it swinging towards the former. Considering they have never made any comments about how there’s an excess of abusive kicks compared to legitimate ones, it’s likely not as rampant as you are saying it is.

And your dismissal is very relevant when you made a big deal of making it the very first thing you mentioned in your opening post. You making this suggestion is completely selfish in nature. Don’t act like it’s not. You were kicked from a dungeon, got mad about it, and came here to demand that you be compensated tomestones when the GMs told you that they wouldn’t compensate you for something you didn’t earn. Please don’t try to act like this thread was made out of concern for those poor, unfortunate souls who are victims of abusive vote dismissals. This thread was started out of concern for yourself and no one else.

Editing your opening post to try and save face doesn’t help you. It only hurts you.

[Alklios]

How can you prove that this problem is rampant? How can you prove that it affects thousands of players? You have nothing but anecdotes—and some of these anecdotes are likely not even entirely truthful in nature. You have no actual statistics of the amount of legitimate kicks versus the amount of abusive kicks.

Do you know what the GMs and the developers have? Statistics. They can see how many vote dismissals are deemed abusive or not, and can choose to act or make an announcement if they find it swinging towards the former. Considering they have never made any comments about how there’s an excess of abusive kicks compared to legitimate ones, it’s likely not as rampant as you are saying it is.

And your dismissal is very relevant when you made a big deal of making it the very first thing you mentioned in your opening post. You making this suggestion is completely selfish in nature. Don’t act like it’s not. You were kicked from a dungeon, got mad about it, and came here to demand that you be compensated tomestones when the GMs told you that they wouldn’t compensate you for something you didn’t earn. Please don’t try to act like this thread was made out of concern for those poor, unfortunate souls who are victims of abusive vote dismissals. This thread was started out of concern for yourself and no one else.

Editing your opening post to try and save face doesn’t help you. It only hurts you.

If that's the image you want to paint, you may. That someone is crazy enough to go through all this trouble to get a pity party which is irrelevant. I've never seen the words 'Aelfred deserves reimbursement and none else.' You're so confident with painting a picture to derail the thesis, the literal title of the thread which contains no 'I' statement, into something to make it easier to attack the individual and create a flood of ad-hominems.

The developers have statistics on it being a problem and any google check shows it being a historical problem. They have the statistics, and either have decided not to help out these victims or haven't considered it, which I assume the latter due to the repeat of the GM encouraging my post here. It's been my stance honestly for awhile, I only bothered to come here because they suggested it. If I just was enraged and prompted it here at the first time, I would have posted this thread years ago.

Please stop this. I just want people to consider the thread title, even if I have to make the first post blank from hereon to stop derailing it with all the assumed intents. Blank as hell, just for people to digest the raw bones of title.

[HyoMinPark]

Again, idk why all of you are concerned over sympathy and thumbs up.

I always love when this argument shows up. Does it honestly surprise people that some of us don’t give a flying flip about virtual internet points? If I was after karma, I’d go post Miqo’te fanart on the subreddit. But instead I’m here.

There's a problem, we need to find ways to abate it.

What problem? You mean the one that you can’t actually prove is as pervasive as you’re saying it is? Or the one where you didn’t get your tomestones? Because your motivation for this thread had nothing to do with others getting wrongfully dismissed and everything with you demanding compensation.

You don't want to believe there's a problem? Compare old Q times to the mentioned data center b/f and after the server drops, reflecting how many people (and many of my friends) left the toxicity using their free server hop they didn't consider before.

The Crystal servers had perfectly fine queues when it was still a part of Aether. Are you trying to imply otherwise? What are you even implying here?

As for why so many supposedly left Crystal: quite a few moved to Aether because we’re the raid-heavy NA data center and they wanted to raid. I know a raiding FC of Balmung moved off and settled on Jenova purely for raiding. Not because of this “toxicity”.

If that's the image you want to paint, you may. That someone is crazy enough to go through all this trouble to get a pity party which is irrelevant. I've never seen the words 'Aelfred deserves reimbursement and none else.' You're so confident with painting a picture to derail the thesis, the literal title of the thread which contains no 'I' statement, into something to make it easier to attack the individual and create a flood of ad-hominems.

Please stop this. I just want people to consider the thread title, even if I have to make the first post blank from hereon to stop derailing it with all the assumed intents. Blank as hell, just for people to digest the raw bones of title.

Your thread title was lost when you spent the first half of your original post ranting about your own dismissal, my dude.

I’ve already addressed your suggestion multiple times. But to placate you, here it is again: this isn’t a necessary feature and I think the GMs can find better uses of their time. You cannot prove that this problem is as pervasive as you claim.

The developers have statistics on it being a problem and any google check shows it being a historical problem. They have the statistics, and either have decided not to help out these victims or haven't considered it, which I assume the latter due to the repeat of the GM encouraging my post here. It's been my stance honestly for awhile, I only bothered to come here because they suggested it. If I just was enraged and prompted it here at the first time, I would have posted this thread years ago.

These are anecdotes. Do you understand what anecdotes are? They aren’t facts. They aren’t statistics.

[Alklios]

Your thread title was lost when you spent the first half of your original post ranting about your own dismissal, my dude.

You can call a personal experience a rant if you want. Seeing no name callouts and no derogitory comments thrown probably weakens that argument.

If you give up a thread title for a few sentences of an introduction of problem, the reading problem may lie with you.

I at least make the suggestion so they can tie it with their data and see if its a possible solution or any level of compromise afterward would help.

[HyoMinPark]

You can call a personal experience a rant if you want. Seeing no name callouts and no derogitory comments thrown probably weakens that argument.

Not at all. Ranting doesn’t have to involve either of these.

If you give up a thread title for a few sentences of an introduction of problem, the reading problem may lie with you.

Introductions are the most important part of a proposal. When you introduce your suggestion with nothing about how you were wronged, people begin to question your motives.

You seem very concerned about my reading skills, but I can assure you they are fine. In the event you missed it, I actually addressed your suggestion in Post #24 before any of this conversation even happened. I’ll post it here for your reading convenience.

There is no need to reimburse you when you can literally just queue up for the Roulette/duty again after being dismissed. You didn’t lose your reward—you just never earned it because you didn’t complete the duty. Tomes are not awarded until after the final boss of the dungeon is killed (even though the game tells you “You earn [x amount of y tomes]” mid-duty, they aren’t actually given to you until after you beat the dungeon).

If you feel like these individuals were abusing the Vote Dismiss feature, by all means, report them. But you cannot demand compensation when you can just requeue immediately afterwards and earn your tomes with a party that won’t kick you before the last boss. Yeah, it sucks that your time was wasted; I won’t deny that. But you can’t just demand free tomestones for it.

Let me make it known that I still stand by this. And I also still question your true motives behind this suggestion. I don’t think they were fueled by as much altruism as you’d like to portray the last few posts. There’s nothing wrong with making a selfish suggestion, but at least don’t pretend you aren’t being selfish when you make it.

[Alklios]

If you started this thread going into detail of what ACTUALLY happened to get you vote kicked, instead of being absolutely vague on the concept and name dropping an entire Data Center then more people here would be showing sympathy for you. However you worded your post as an individual account (so we can relate to you) and then tried making it a broader statement. Problem is by not actually explaining (even now with so multiple people asking why) you're hurting your entire argument and making yourself look like a clown.

There are threads you can have this general conversation in, but the way you worded your first post and the domino effect it's having is not giving YOU any credibility. Going back and editing it didn't change a thing except make you look worse by comparison when the post history for quotes tells a different story.

I readily welcome people to view the quotes as was mentioned already. The server callout means nothing for me being on Balmung, it's obviously under my character's picture

Once again idc on sympathy or not and it's starting to disturb me that's people's primary motivation apparently for posting anything here. I want rational debate over this concept and alternative suggestions breaking it down. So far it's only been minor points which I've already responded to by comparisons to other MMOs providing this service and recommending that FF14 do it to remain competitive.

Again, idk why all of you are concerned over sympathy and thumbs up. There's a problem, we need to find ways to abate it. You don't want to believe there's a problem? Compare old Q times to the mentioned data center b/f and after the server drops, reflecting how many people (and many of my friends) left the toxicity using their free server hop they didn't consider before.

[Noitems]

I readily welcome people to view the quotes as was mentioned already. The server callout means nothing for me being on Balmung, it's obviously under my character's picture

Once again idc on sympathy or not and it's starting to disturb me that's people's primary motivation apparently for posting anything here. I want rational debate over this concept and alternative suggestions breaking it down. So far it's only been minor points which I've already responded to by comparisons to other MMOs providing this service and recommending that FF14 do it to remain competitive.

Again, idk why all of you are concerned over sympathy and thumbs up. There's a problem, we need to find ways to abate it. You don't want to believe there's a problem? Compare old Q times to the mentioned data center b/f and after the server drops, reflecting how many people (and many of my friends) left the toxicity using their free server hop they didn't consider before.

Yet you still decided to edit your first post to take it completely out of your narrative. If it didn't bother you at all and you're neutral about it why not keep that part in?

Your cries for rational debate got thrown out the window the moment you told you us you got vote kicked but never explained why. That's a Part of the 5 W's for a reason, man. Hell even every post about negative GM interactions on here a person will know flat out why they're getting banned and will usually explain why to convey their message about why it was wrong. You decided to just say something on the lines of "We got into an argument" which is an vague as all hell statement which provokes more questions then answers. Not giving us an explanation is just showing you don't have confidence to even explain why you did get kicked, ergo making you look like an entitled clown.

Also don't even start bringing up a split argument about q times on Crystal or whatever the heck you're going on about. The only reason I brought Crystal up is that is was completely unneeded and made you look like you were treating the majority of the Data Center like they do it frequently, making your overall argument more biased and in turn less compelling. You're having enough trouble dealing with this reimbursement problem and adding another completely different debate to the mix is gonna make it even worse for you on a moral standpoint.

[Alklios]

Yet you still decided to edit your first post to take it completely out of your narrative. If it didn't bother you at all and you're neutral about it why not keep that part in?

Your cries for rational debate got thrown out the window the moment you told you us you got vote kicked but never explained why. That's a Part of the 5 W's for a reason, man. Hell even every post about negative GM interactions on here a person will know flat out why they're getting banned and will usually explain why to convey their message about why it was wrong. You decided to just say something on the lines of "We got into an argument" which is an vague as all hell statement which provokes more questions then answers. Not giving us an explanation is just showing you don't have confidence to even explain why you did get kicked, ergo making you look like an entitled clown.

Also don't even start bringing up a split argument about q times on Crystal or whatever the heck you're going on about. The only reason I brought Crystal up is that is was completely unneeded and made you look like you were treating the majority of the Data Center like they do it frequently, making your overall argument more biased and in turn less compelling. You're having enough trouble dealing with this reimbursement problem and adding another completely different debate to the mix is gonna make it even worse for you on a moral standpoint.

I removed it because of the toxic fixation on it and feedback that it was the the majority thing people were willing to discuss, and apparently ignoring thread title. If folk want to leap around like apes banging on the same dead horse that is wanting source on my kick, they won't have it. It doesn't exist. The fact I'm being criticized for wanting to edit a post to make it more concise and relevant, further proves the circle jerk which you are a part of, good sir. What do you want -- conciseness, or possibly irrelevant information?

So do us a favor and keep to thread title.

[Alklios]

I will be waiting for the GM's decision because that is the only one that will matter because aside from myself they are the only one with full context of the situation. The input I am recieving here is counter productive and has grown hostile without reason. Have a good day.