My idea for the WHM II

[ReiMakoto]

i understand about endure and re raise might lead to mechanic being ignored once but they cant help all the times.
they are insurance skills,for just in case and to prevent alot of abuse from the skills is why they are target for only one member ,cost alot of mp and have huge cd.
rescue 1 to 2 members wont necessarily save a raid if everyone else already died but if needed the skills can always consume more mp and maybe have higher cd .

as for reflect,i don't believe 10% of damage done could be more then LB but if something like that could be an issue there can always be a limit to how much damage can be reflected ^^.

well if not them then what different skills would you give WHM or better yet you are welcome to publish your idea as well i will love to see it

Having 2 extra invulns mean 4 invulns available for the tanks. Invulns arn't used as "insurance" as you put it, theyre used to skip mechanics/ easily mitigate a mechanic. To use E4s again pretty much every hard hit on the tank can now be ignored, stonecruser is already invulned, megalith is also invulned already in some party comps, but could be done for both in this case with any tanks, and you wouldnt need to pop mitigation for the attack after dual earthen fists either. For e3s, every single rip current could be taken without a tank swap. They would not be used for emergencies to "save a raid" they will be used proactively to mitigate, unless its mana cost was extremely prohibitive (thin air exists though) in which case it just wouldnt get used. Even if its CD was so long it could only be done once a fight, thats 1 time you just dont need to think about a tank buster.

For reflect, stone crusher being used on a non paladin or gunbreaker, deals over a million damage to the tank, probably more 10% of that its easily going to deal over 100k+ basically for free unless you cap the damage.

Other than maybe aero 3 coming back, I don't think I would change whm, its fine and very strong as it stands.

[CrimsonGunner]

Having 2 extra invulns mean 4 invulns available for the tanks. Invulns arn't used as "insurance" as you put it, theyre used to skip mechanics/ easily mitigate a mechanic. To use E4s again pretty much every hard hit on the tank can now be ignored, stonecruser is already invulned, megalith is also invulned already in some party comps, but could be done for both in this case with any tanks, and you wouldnt need to pop mitigation for the attack after dual earthen fists either. For e3s, every single rip current could be taken without a tank swap. They would not be used for emergencies to "save a raid" they will be used proactively to mitigate, unless its mana cost was extremely prohibitive (thin air exists though) in which case it just wouldnt get used. Even if its CD was so long it could only be done once a fight, thats 1 time you just dont need to think about a tank buster.

For reflect, stone crusher being used on a non paladin or gunbreaker, deals over a million damage to the tank, probably more 10% of that its easily going to deal over 100k+ basically for free unless you cap the damage.

Other than maybe aero 3 coming back, I don't think I would change whm, its fine and very strong as it stands.

that isn't such a bad thing if they help to mitigate 1 to 2 times and whats wrong about 1 time that the tank or us don't need to worry about a tank buster again it's not a bad thing just help with the raid.
and there aren't 4 invincibility skills like i wrote before re-raise doesn't prevent death just allow immediate revive.and if the mana cost is too much of a problem for savage raid its fine ,there are also other contents then savage raid so i don't really see the trouble re-raise is more of a flavor skill.

as for reflect,i change it from percentage to just deal potency damage to attacker.^^

[ReiMakoto]

that isn't such a bad thing if they help to mitigate 1 to 2 times and whats wrong about 1 time that the tank or us don't need to worry about a tank buster again it's not a bad thing just help with the raid.
and there aren't 4 invincibility skills like i wrote before re-raise doesn't prevent death just allow immediate revive.and if the mana cost is too much of a problem for savage raid its fine ,there are also other contents then savage raid so i don't really see the trouble re-raise is more of a flavor skill.

as for reflect,i change it from percentage to just deal potency damage to attacker.^^

In a fight with a limited amount of Tank Busters, eliminating multiple of them across a fight using whm is a balance issue, it makes WHM super strong, if you were running WAR DRK WHM, even in fights with frequent tank busters you could just invalidate most of them which again is a balance issue. You say if its just a problem for savage then its not a problem, but that IS a problem, classes ARE balanced around savage and not other content types, because savage/ultimate is the hardest form of content.

Changing it to do potency damage makes it really weak going from fight to fight, fights with little autoattacks, whms damage potential goes down, and fights with more they end up doing way more, its why warriors vengence has such little potency attatched and is basically just flavour.

Also as Yusikah points out, you have a tonne of oGCDs in here with very few weaving tools, and if youre playing optimally you'd have to do all of them basically on CD for damage.

[CrimsonGunner]

i don't care about those who optimal and want to use all the skills in one go also even though savage/ultimate is the hardest not a lot of people want to do it and balance need to be in all contents not just one. also your thinking is only whm is changed and the others aren't,i didn't create it in thinking about the others classes or caring about their current kit to that matter.

lets say for example that it could be a whm kit, who said SCH and AST need to stay in their current iteration,why cant their own kit changed as well and have their own op thing to contribute.
maybe SCH have some wicked debuffs that speed dps or AST cards have better buffs then now that help with everything.
WHM can help survive mechanics with those skills but it doesn't mean those 2 won't have anything that they can do.
balance can be in different ways.while i gave WHM skills that might help with mechanics it doesn't mean SCH and AST cant have op stuff to balance that out.

caring for balance between roles is fine but WHM is WHM ,SCH is SCH and AST is AST ,just cause i offer something that might be "op" for WHM doesn't mean those 2 can't have something op of their own .

and like i said before if you don't like the skills , feel free to offer a different skill or something else.i would love to read it ^^

[ReiMakoto]

i don't care about those who optimal and want to use all the skills in one go.
also if you don't like the skills , feel free to offer a different skill or something else.^^

You asked for constructive criticism, if your response to it is "I don't care about those who optimal" then youre not practicing what you preach. Came here to offer criticism, not suggest how to change something that isn't broken in current WHM

[CrimsonGunner]

You asked for constructive criticism, if your response to it is "I don't care about those who optimal" then youre not practicing what you preach. Came here to offer criticism, not suggest how to change something that isn't broken in current WHM

i'm sorry i probably didn't write it well.
i meant i didn't create it for optimal use or put that much consideration for optimization since it not something that matter to me.
while optimizing the skills might be important to you and i respect it ,it isn't that much important for me and i feel that not all skills must be used but rather some can be situational or used for specific moments.

if you can offer how to optimize my idea, i'l love hear it then ^^.(but pls dont delete reflect,protect and shell ,i really loved those skill on FF whm)

as for balance around the hard content ,again i didn't put thought about it since there are a lot of other content even previous content that need to be considered since not all do savage/ultimate. as far as balance between roles ,i didn't create it in terms of caring what the AST and SCH have right now since they are their own and if i were to think about balance i would have just think of giving SCH and AST something else op that is different from endure and re-raise that will have equal value.

[ReiMakoto]

i'm sorry i probably didn't write it well.
it isn't that much important for me and i feel that not all skills must be used but rather some can be situational or used for specific moments.

Just to take this part, youve not really created any situational skills other than shell, all of the others are mandatory use if theyre in the kit, unless some of the skills you said like protect were on the gcd, in which case they wouldnt be used. The game as a whole as moved away from more situational skills.