Struggling as Healer on Wall-to-Walls

[Numenor1379]

lol, you act as if I don't use those abilities. I will have to record a video one day and show you all.

I wasn't talking to you, get over yourself. Besides your post says you're also having issues with WHM.

[Mhaeric]

4. For meaty pulls, I make use of Fey Union so that Eos has her regen tether on them.

I will add that this works best if you wait until right after you use your fairy's Regen ability since you'll be locked out of it otherwise likely delaying its reuse. Same for dissipation. Whispering Dawn plus Fey Union gives lie to the idea that Scholar isn't a powerful regen healer. Doubly so once you get the Regen on Sacred Soil.

Also, use Seraph. People like to complain that she's just a Rouse substitute... but she's a Rouse substitute so use it. It will make every other fairy regen more powerful and give you some free additional shields for your tank to boot.

[Mhaeric]

I wasn't talking to you, get over yourself. Besides your post says you're also having issues with WHM.

Guaranteed that person has received healing advice during a run and took it as an insult.

[AphraelAmarantha]

Guaranteed that person has received healing advice during a run and took it as an insult.

Nice assumption, but no I have never received healing advice in an instance. My hostility stems from this forum feeling more like an elitist circlejerk where everyone here laughs at people less skilled than they are and then just go git gud. They don't try to see or understand how difficult things may actually be for someone like me, despite explaining over and over and over and over to them, so eventually it becomes tiresome and people wonder why someone gets jaded at a community. Practice doesn't always make perfect or better, some people just do not have the ability to get better at something even though they try their damnest, following other's advice, trying to apply what they are told, watching videos, reading guides, and no improvement whatsoever to show for it over months and years of trying.

People like the ones in this community or more specifically this forum just don't get it, and they never will because they have their stuck so far up in the clouds due to their skill level that they can never relate, never understand, so when you try to tell them you try and try and they just give a half-assed canned response, yeah I'm going to be hostile, jaded and angry because you still don't GET IT. Oh this fight is easy! Not to me and others liek me it isnt. Oh you just need more practice! What, ten years to see any modicum, improvement? How long do I have to practice at a game to get better at it if I don't see improvement over doing something for months or years? Oh but the job is so easy, I can do it in my sleep! Good for you, I'm glad teh game is trivial to you, its not to me and never will be.

@MikuMitsuko, Again I just say don't worry about it. Ask for smaller pulls and ditch them if they don't want to cooperate. There is only so much you can do. If you after practice practice practice practice and still cant handle large pulls, then you can't handle large pulls and you have to accept that. I can barely handle large pulls and usually someone dies if a tank goes crazy, this is with someone at a ilvl443, uses my ogcds and gcds as much as possible and the tank still dies. All you can really do is try your best and if teh party doesn't like that, they can find another healer.

[Saefinn]

In fairness, healing is all a learning curve. A lot of people have played healing roles for a long time, even outside of this game. So I'd probably not try to base your worth as a healer on what well experienced people can do, as well, a lot of it comes from experience and everybody has to start somewhere. And players, sadly, sometimes forget this when they start yelling at people.

With Scholar. I like to think we're good for damage mitigation. They can be useful in getting people's health up, not necessarily relying on oGCD's. At a basic level, I treat Adloquium as a cushion, it momentarily keeps somebody who's dying alive a little bit longer whilst you prepare something else. But a trick for getting health up quickly is: Emergency Tactics + Adloquium (I usually do this following another Adloquium), because it's a sizeable amount healed. Your faerie gives you some damage mitigation, which is useful to deploy when you can, as is her AoE regen. And if DPS are sustaining damage, of course remember that they are a low priority. 1) because they're less likely to take more damage right away 2) if it is their fault they took damage, then it's their mistake not yours, 3) The tank dying is much more difficult to recover from, a DPS dying is not the end of the world. You and the tank are the priority for heals above all else.

Excogitation is a good spell to have up on the tank. This is preferable to use over Lustrate, but has a recast unlike Lustrate. But it acts as a nice cushion when health is dropping.

Another thing to consider is that simply some tanks get overzealous in their pulls or don't pull to the skill of the healer. Tanks who do full pulls don't always use their cool downs, which is kinda important if they're going to do full pulls, whilst your job is to heal them, it is also their job to mitigate damage coming their way.

The way I would approach learning the role and the way I usually tell people to is working your way up in the difficulty of content and how you're healing. Some will argue that healers should DPS, but my argument for less experienced healers is that they should learn to heal first, be confident with it before they try to manage DPS in with it.

There's layers to the healing tool kit. Looking at your healing tool kit in its entirety could be overwhelming. I think a good place to start is the earlier dungeons where you have a roll back kit. For Scholar, at a base level all you need to worry about is: Physick, Adloquium and Succor. Once you've got the hang of those (if you haven't already), then I'd move up in the dungeon levels and add more to your repertoire and learn how you might implement them to your benefit. Alternatively, as one of my FC mates is doing, practicing through using trusts and if you're not high enough level for content with Trusts, there's still squadrons.

[Saefinn]

My hostility stems from this forum feeling more like an elitist circlejerk where everyone here laughs at people less skilled than they are and then just go git gud. They don't try to see or understand how difficult things may actually be for someone like me, despite explaining over and over and over and over to them, so eventually it becomes tiresome and people wonder why someone gets jaded at a community. Practice doesn't always make perfect or better, some people just do not have the ability to get better at something even though they try their damnest, following other's advice, trying to apply what they are told, watching videos, reading guides, and no improvement whatsoever to show for it over months and years of trying.

People like the ones in this community or more specifically this forum just don't get it, and they never will because they have their stuck so far up in the clouds due to their skill level that they can never relate, never understand, so when you try to tell them you try and try and they just give a half-assed canned response, yeah I'm going to be hostile, jaded and angry because you still don't GET IT. Oh this fight is easy! Not to me and others liek me it isnt. Oh you just need more practice! What, ten years to see any modicum, improvement? How long do I have to practice at a game to get better at it if I don't see improvement over doing something for months or years? Oh but the job is so easy, I can do it in my sleep! Good for you, I'm glad teh game is trivial to you, its not to me and never will be.

Whilst I can understand the dislike for elitism or people talking down to others for being less experienced or not as skilled as they are. I've played with a variety of people with varying levels of abilities, and I know it can be a PITA when somebody's just being a rear end about it.

But I reread the guy's post trying to find any hints of this and all he was literally doing was giving advice after the OP and yourself included (but I imagine directed at the OP) have said they've struggled and the OP has struggled for advice in-game and has come here and people have subsequently followed with advice. Your hostility arguably is misplaced.

Unfortunately, there is a stereotype of people in-game who will get hostile when you try to give them advice, even if you're polite and respectful about it. When in actuality you're just trying to help. So I expect that's where the assumption from the other guy came from. I've had it, and I try to be polite and respectful, because I know people have to start somewhere, but I've had people genuinely flip out at me because I wanted to help.

[HyoMinPark]

Nice assumption, but no I have never received healing advice in an instance. My hostility stems from this forum feeling more like an elitist circlejerk where everyone here laughs at people less skilled than they are and then just go git gud.

Where is anyone in this thread laughing at the OP for asking for advice? Literally, where. A lot of threads that pop up asking for legitimate advice don’t end in the forum mob ganging up on the poor, innocent sprout and not helping them. Most end in people offering the advice players are asking for. Quite thoroughly and politely, usually. Threads only devolve when attitudes like yours arise.

They don't try to see or understand how difficult things may actually be for someone like me, despite explaining over and over and over and over to them, so eventually it becomes tiresome and people wonder why someone gets jaded at a community. Practice doesn't always make perfect or better, some people just do not have the ability to get better at something even though they try their damnest, following other's advice, trying to apply what they are told, watching videos, reading guides, and no improvement whatsoever to show for it over months and years of trying.

Except practice does make one better. Throwing your hands in the air and giving up at the first sign of challenge is what causes people to not progress in terms of skill level. Sure, some may never be as good as the top raiders. But not everyone has to be. And people certainly aren’t demanding that they be.

The hostility you tend to see on here is when people pop up and demand things like MSQ solo instances be nerfed because they’re repeatedly not paying attention to the mechanics and failing them; or they’re going into an instance severely undergeared and wondering why they’re getting one-shot by mechanics (see: The Will of the Moon threads). A lot of players don’t want to acknowledge their own mistakes, which is where you’ll see people “talking down to them” and telling them that they need to own what they’re doing wrong. This game handholds its playerbase through all of the story content. It can’t do much more—other than completely automate your character—to make things easier. At some point, people need to take responsibility and push themselves to do better, which is what most of those “elitists” are telling them to do.

Finally, it may have escaped your notice, but the OP isn’t you. So you shouldn’t assume that they will struggle the same way you’re apparently struggling. Or that they won’t learn and become better the way you’ve repeatedly stated you won’t.

People like the ones in this community or more specifically this forum just don't get it, and they never will because they have their stuck so far up in the clouds due to their skill level that they can never relate, never understand, so when you try to tell them you try and try and they just give a half-assed canned response, yeah I'm going to be hostile, jaded and angry because you still don't GET IT. Oh this fight is easy! Not to me and others liek me it isnt. Oh you just need more practice! What, ten years to see any modicum, improvement? How long do I have to practice at a game to get better at it if I don't see improvement over doing something for months or years? Oh but the job is so easy, I can do it in my sleep! Good for you, I'm glad teh game is trivial to you, its not to me and never will be.

You are holding on to a lot of hostility for literally no reason. And it’s making you construe everything about everyone on here negatively. You would do well to get rid of these feelings before you lash out at someone again—just like you did to Numenor in this very thread when they weren’t even talking to you.

@MikuMitsuko, Again I just say don't worry about it. Ask for smaller pulls and ditch them if they don't want to cooperate. There is only so much you can do. If you after practice practice practice practice and still cant handle large pulls, then you can't handle large pulls and you have to accept that. I can barely handle large pulls and usually someone dies if a tank goes crazy, this is with someone at a ilvl443, uses my ogcds and gcds as much as possible and the tank still dies. All you can really do is try your best and if teh party doesn't like that, they can find another healer.

I disagree. I think OP should continue to try. I think they should practice first with friends that they trust playing tanks and then shift slowly to dealing with random as opposed to following this defeatist attitude of “I’ll never get better”. Large pulls aren’t going to go away; so it would be good to learn how to handle them. And the more one handles then successfully, the easier they continue to be.

[AphraelAmarantha]

Except practice does make one better. Throwing your hands in the air and giving up at the first sign of challenge is what causes people to not progress in terms of skill level. Sure, some may never be as good as the top raiders. But not everyone has to be. And people simply aren’t demanding that they be.

Who says I've thrown my hands in the air and just give up without trying and trying and trying and trying? Again, you don't get it. Re-read my post.

You are holding on to a lot of hostility for literally no reason.

I've explained my reasons for my hostility. I'm not repeating myself, this is exactly why someone like you will never get it. And I'm tired of explaining myself.

[Saefinn]

I disagree. I think OP should continue to try. I think they should practice first with friends that they trust playing tanks and then shift slowly to dealing with random as opposed to following this defeatist attitude of “I’ll never get better”. Large pulls aren’t going to go away; so it would be good to learn how to handle them. And the more one handles then successfully, the easier they continue to be.

I think this is the important point. Practice is a chunk of it, because it's a skill and healing is one of those roles that require you to make judgment calls and sometimes knowing the right call can come from experience and most of the time it comes from failure not success. Practice if anything is full of failure, because you learn from mistakes. We've all as healers, no matter where we currently stand on the scale have probably caused wipes, let people die who didn't need to or made a poor judgment call that's been a detriment to the party. And I'd be lying if I said I no longer make such errors.

And much like other skills, some will struggle more than others and some will naturally be better than others, which is fine.

[Saefinn]

I've explained my reasons for my hostility. I'm not repeating myself, this is exactly why someone like you will never get it. And I'm tired of explaining myself.

Whilst I think understand your reasons why you might be hostile to people who're being elitists, talking people down or putting them down or not making accommodations for them etc. Whilst I may not necessarily agree hostility is the answer, I can respect that we're all different here and handle things differently and in such cases, if they are being toxic, then if somebody is hostile back to them, then what do they expect?

But what I don't understand is the hostility when somebody was not rude, elitist, did not put anybody down, did not do anything untoward, whose tone was not off and gave advice the OP was struggling to get in-game whilst trying to be helpful? From what I've read, despite your sweeping generalisations about people on the forum, we've come here to try and offer advice we think is helpful.