Reasonable buff to war

[Argyle_Darkheart]

Wow you are completely insufferable reign your ego in son.

No.

You claimed it to be nearly linear which is blatantly untrue.

It's not blatantly untrue. At the least, it's far more true than you seem to think.

Youve neither earned respect nor shown yourself to be worth any

I was perfectly respectful in my first reply to you, but then you pretend to be an idiot and mis-characterize what I've said. I have no tolerance for that, sorry.

[Jukebox12]

I like how bo one quoted me when these comments are or was a little mean now there just mean. Dang! boys and girls

[BarretOblivion]

It doesn't mean that War need a potency buff, maybe it needs some changes, but potency wise is perfectly fine.

At no point have I said WAR needs potency buffs, they need skills. I used to main WAR and the moment you hit 80 you realize just how barren the job is. You got 1 new skill and basically 2 passives for a "progression" of the job while losing the thing that made WAR unique and skill based in SB. Tank Dancing. WAR was the best at it even with the issue with Inner Beast as it gave WAR the unique ability to use their Tank Stance as a tool with very little downsides mid fight before swapping back to Deliverance. With the removal of that feature WAR is now a shallow, dead class. It needs skills and something to do outside of IR because... holy crap does it feel like crap to play when IR is on cooldown.

[Jukebox12]

Someone must love being called mean

[Marc-Vigar]

WAR only needs 4 things:

1. Onslaught costing no Beast Gauge and usable outside of battle.

2. Another combo line starting from Heavy Swing to make the rotation more engaging, could finish with Storm's Eye so 1 DPS/heal combo and 1 buff combo (same as DRG)

3. More skills, specifically oGCDs to weave inbetween GCD, the rotation is boring as f*** and Upheaval costing BG is awful, remove BG costs from abilities and give us maybe another long cooldown BG finisher.

4. MAKE OVERPOWER BE CIRCULAR AREA SKILL FOR F***S SAKE.

[NyneSwordz]

WAR only needs 4 things:

1. Onslaught costing no Beast Gauge and usable outside of battle.

2. Another combo line starting from Heavy Swing to make the rotation more engaging, could finish with Storm's Eye so 1 DPS/heal combo and 1 buff combo (same as DRG)

3. More skills, specifically oGCDs to weave inbetween GCD, the rotation is boring as f*** and Upheaval costing BG is awful, remove BG costs from abilities and give us maybe another long cooldown BG finisher.

4. MAKE OVERPOWER BE CIRCULAR AREA SKILL FOR F***S SAKE.

Overpower being conal aoe and mythril tempest 360 feels clunky. I hate having to constantly move to make sure i catch all the monsters in the cone.

It usef to be sorta okay, but in shb there seemd to be more monsters when u pull wall to wall than before. The large number causes the monsters to sorta disperse around me in such a wide fashion that sometimes it feels impossible to hit all of them with overpower.

[Izyla]

Overpower being conal aoe and mythril tempest 360 feels clunky. I hate having to constantly move to make sure i catch all the monsters in the cone.

It usef to be sorta okay, but in shb there seemd to be more monsters when u pull wall to wall than before. The large number causes the monsters to sorta disperse around me in such a wide fashion that sometimes it feels impossible to hit all of them with overpower.

I just pick up mobs with tempest tbh, when done running I'll do the proper combo.

It makes it much less of a hassle but sadly no extending storm's eye during this time.

[BarretOblivion]

Most of the savages fights aren't designed well with WAR in mind. The main exception to this is E3S where WAR is the best tank to bring into it. I can't comment on E4S as I haven't gone in yet (just cleared 3 yesterday) but baised off the numbers WAR isn't perfered in there likely because of tank swapping.
Here is the thing, WAR is kinda designed to be the MT at all times. Yes, they can OT but their effectiveness is reduced when doing so.
Reasons:
1) Vengeance still has damage tied to it. It might not be much but with IR affecting it as well as in the long run if you use it cooldown unless you need it for TBs you should be using it. Getting about 6-7 vengeance off comes to around 1320 potency or more if you are using it on cooldown not counting DH/Crits. Of course this can only be used on physical attacks so Leviathan ignores this. The problem is every fight is designed around tank swapping and if the WAR isn't getting auto attacked, well vengeance damage is kinda dead.
2) Nascent flash is a better MT skill than an OT skill. The 50% reduction on your co-tank makes even setting up a beefy nascent flash heal not noticable to maybe heal a boss basic attack, its good for you, but if your the OT the heal probably doesn't affect you as you'll be at full HP (except again Leviathan where you both are getting auto'd so its always good to use it on cooldown there). With a weak heal you have to look at its mitigation which is the lowest of all tanks outside of naked PLD interventions, but PLD has the option of using a cooldown they don't need to buff it to the highest giving it flexibility.
3) Raw Intiution is the best MT skill identity cooldown in the game. Simple as that. 20% mitigation on a 25 second cooldown with no need to worry about job guage or resources? Yeah its the best for TBs making it easy for a WAR to surive a tank buster with a good chunk of HP when paried with another cooldown (if you even need to).
4) Holmgang is still a thing. However, the issue with this raiding tier is 3/4 of the fights tie a required tank swap debuff to the Tankbusters now. Leviathan is however a short debuff so holmgang lets the OT not worry about requiring to share Tankbusters (except 1). E2S doesn't have a debuff tied to it but both tanks will always get hit by the tankbuster so using an OT skill during that on your other tank isn't advised... except for PLD because intervention works well with those kinds of tankbusters mitigating the most damage by far of all the tanks.


WAR isn't designed well for this raid tier I would argue outside of Leviathan and even there one of its damaging skills is gimped because its all magical. Its a small problem but it adds up when its personal DPS isn't very good and personal mitigation doesn't matter too much when you are forced to tank swap anyways.

[BarretOblivion]

So to follow up on the previous post what buffs does WAR need?
1) Nascent flash buff. Give it 75% of total healing you do to yourself shared with your target instead of 50% and increase the time on it so you can fit one more GCD in it.
2) Remove the potency on vengeance and slightly buff other skills so you are basically 'moving' that potency so it doesn't feel bad when WAR isn't MTing.
3) WAR needs improvements to the flow of the job. The job feels like crap to play when IR is on cooldown while all other tank jobs outside of their "burst phases" still having things to manage and do. WAR does not besides trying to hold on fell cleaves for raid buffs or IC for raid buffs. WAR doesn't scale well with DRG and BRD buffs because of the DH/CRIT guarenteed so if you are running them WAR falls behind all other tanks.

(Personal request)
Rework the DH/CRIT identity of the job. I don't like it and it makes melding WAR akward when all other tanks meld in one way (Skill speed requirements is the exception) but WAR has to be melded differently. DH? You don't do that on WAR and right now DH is the best to meld in all other tanks until the end of this tier with BiS because there is so much crit on them. It makes swapping between tank jobs expensive for an unnessesary reason.

[Tex_Mex]

1) Nascent flash buff. Give it 75% of total healing you do to yourself shared with your target instead of 50% and increase the time on it so you can fit one more GCD in it.

I don't mind this at all. Giving WAR some more self heal is not really a big deal to me at all. Nascent only being a 10% damage reduction as well warrants some more healing for the target too.

2) Remove the potency on vengeance and slightly buff other skills so you are basically 'moving' that potency so it doesn't feel bad when WAR isn't MTing.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. The entire point of so many of the ShB tank changes was to make all tanks equally (or near equally) viable at both the MT and OT roles. Vengeance is the only tank ability in the game that rewards the player with damage for being attacked. (TBN is close, but you can use it on other targets and it is only DPS neutral when it breaks, so I don't consider it here) It honestly feels like this ability just fell through the cracks and should have been changed along with everything else.

3) WAR needs improvements to the flow of the job. The job feels like crap to play when IR is on cooldown while all other tank jobs outside of their "burst phases" still having things to manage and do. WAR does not besides trying to hold on fell cleaves for raid buffs or IC for raid buffs. WAR doesn't scale well with DRG and BRD buffs because of the DH/CRIT guarenteed so if you are running them WAR falls behind all other tanks.

I do agree that it is pretty boring to play. The removal of stance dancing really took a lot of the complexity of the job away. I would be fine with adding some more oGCD skills, a DoT, or really anything else to add a bit more to the job. See below for my thoughts on secondary stats between classes.

Rework the DH/CRIT identity of the job. I don't like it and it makes melding WAR akward when all other tanks meld in one way (Skill speed requirements is the exception) but WAR has to be melded differently. DH? You don't do that on WAR and right now DH is the best to meld in all other tanks until the end of this tier with BiS because there is so much crit on them. It makes swapping between tank jobs expensive for an unnessesary reason.

I have to disagree with you on this point. I do like to see all the big numbers during my IR window and the only way to remove the different effect that secondary stats have on the job would be to rework this mechanic completely. It is a bummer that you can't reuse the same gear as the other tanks, but this is a small price to pay for maintaining class identity.