So, can we just ban damage meters already.

[Goji1639]

You talk about roulettes, right? We are compensated for being in that particular dungeon. We are not compensated for dragging you through the thing.



Remembers me to my customers: "You are paid for helping me". I responded once: "No, I am paid for offering goods in self-service - help yourself".


Draw the analogy yourself.




Sincerely,

You get "new player in the party" bonus rewards for anything you run.

[MrKusakabe]

You get "new player in the party" bonus rewards for anything you run.

Does not change my stance at all. Being "new" and being a slacker are two different things, mate. I had this just yesterday in LoL. An ADC "was new, do not flame him" whilst merely saying to right-click on the enemy. That was "toxic" of me apparently already. While LoL is a dumpster fire of historical measurements and can't be taken serious for any kind of valuable social interaction, this game has tools - votekicks and GMs. I lose my cool that moment you even dare to use this "argument" for your slacking. The same to White Knights, especially with their friends. (I told you the story of the #8-emnity Gun Breaker that "was learning" in Garuda Hard).


The game is pure fun to me and a leisure time activity. When I am in a dungeon, I am usually kinda mellow, especially as Red Mage, because I just freakin love every aspect of that profession. It makes me happy to be RDM, simply put. But you can get my bloodpressure high when someone "is new" and presses one button or runs into AoE circles. The toxicity, ironically, comes from the White Knights and pseudo-newbies - not from the people calling those out for their lack of teamwork and contribution.


To use the same analogy from my workday in a grocery store: The same "you are paid for helping me" people act like I have to put the items in their cart and drive them to their home and stock them in their fridge and and wipe your @$§! afterwards, too... No. Reality check: It merely means I offer goods in self-service, which are present on the shelves. Not more. If I am in a dungeon with you, I am here to be your Scholar or Red Mage. Not your magical mentor level-skip cheatcode instantwin buttler that has to pull 150% of your weight so my own time is not wasted in several wipes. This unspoken "Hah, he will carry me because he wants the bonus" attitude made me quit my Scholar duty often before. I happily get you stuck in a dungeon for a lesson of how to treat your teammates / party members. Unlike you, I can afford to leave the dungeon as completed it 50x before. You, as ungrateful newbie however,...

When you are new in a dungeon and you slack, you want others to pull more weight so you can have an easier life and get the same reward. It's a logical reflex that you get rid off parasites, no?

Also, my signature needs an alpha channel, but imgur hates PNGs with transparency for some reason, making those quotes ugly.....

[Rivxkobe]

You get "new player in the party" bonus rewards for anything you run.

False. And even if you did being "new" and "not trying"/"being carried"/"not doing your job" are completely different things.

False.

There's a large difference between "do you mind using aoe spells for groups?" and "You are so bad, your dps is so low that you should just unsub"

I never said telling someone they are bad, or that they should unsub, isn't harassment. It is. But telling someone they aren't doing enough damage, or to do something, or to pull their weight because you don't want to carry them are not.

How about instead of twisting words or saying I said something I never did you actually discuss my point or the points being made by others in this thread?

[Forever_Learning]

I never said telling someone they are bad, or that they should unsub, isn't harassment. It is. But telling someone they aren't doing enough damage, or to do something, or to pull their weight because you don't want to carry them are not.

How about instead of twisting words or saying I said something I never did you actually discuss my point or the points being made by others in this thread?

Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement.

I'm not twisting your words, I am discussing your point, I'm stating your sentence was overly vague.

There's a million ways to help someone they need to improve, some that could be considered harrasement.

The medium is the message- it matters more how you deliver a message rather than the point you actually want to make.

Harassement has more to do with you delivered the message rather than the message expressed.

No one is getting reported for politely asking a tank to use tank stance.

Someone doing poor DPS doesn't give you the right to tell them to put their weight in whatever format you feel is appropriate.

If anything, I am enhancing your statement by clarifying that there are limits to how you convey a message.

Rather than twist your words, I improved them by adding clarity.

[Hash_Browns]

Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement.

Man, posts like these are why I opt to kick players who don't play their class correctly without even talking to them.

[HyoMinPark]

Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement.

If you’re asking for a DPS to deal damage—which is their primary job—how is that harassment? Asking a DPS to AOE, apply DoTs, do a basic rotation, or fulfill any aspect of their basic role isn’t harassment. It’s asking for them to do the job they queued up as.

This is like saying “tank - hold aggro” or “tank - use cooldowns” or “healer, please heal” is harassment. You’re asking for a person to fulfill a basic role that they’re clearly not fulfilling. It’s very easy to tell if DPS aren’t pulling their weight when things take forever and a day to die. Parsers aren’t needed to tell when things are dying slowly.

[Rivxkobe]

Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement.

How?

I'm not twisting your words, I am discussing your point, I'm stating your sentence was overly vague.

Not what you did at all. If it was you would have said: "your post is vague". Instead, you insinuated I said calling someone bad or that they should unsub wasn't harassment.

There's a million ways to help someone they need to improve, some that could be considered harrasement.

This depends on each individual person and, honestly, a lot of it isn't worth reporting even if you take it the wrong way.

The medium is the message- it matters more how you deliver a message rather than the point you actually want to make.

Yes. Exactly.

Umm, where did I say it wasn't?

Harassement has more to do with you delivered the message rather than the message expressed.

Again, yes. But I never said "it is all the same" or anything. I was stating that stating what I listed is not harassment. I didn't think I needed to clarify that insulting someone or attacking them is harassment.

No one is getting reported for politely asking a tank to use tank stance.

They are though. Rarely, probably, but it happens.

Someone doing poor DPS doesn't give you the right to tell them to put their weight in whatever format you feel is appropriate.

Yes it does. I am playing too and if they are dragging the team down or being carried because they are spamming one move or just auto-attacking I have a right to complain.

If anything, I am enhancing your statement by clarifying that there are limits to how you convey a message.

Rather than twist your words, I improved them by adding clarity.

LMAO!

Ok.

Not sure how stating that what I said, that telling someone that they need to do more damage or carry their weight or that you want to carry them is not harassment, was the same as saying "you are bad, you aren't doing enough dps, unsub" is not harassment is enhancing my point. Especially when you didn't state that I was being vague or that you were expanding my point or clarifying things for people who may be confused.

[Forever_Learning]

My first sentence was "Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement."

My response is that simply stating that is harrassement. I also didn't mention you personally. I stated that simply stating that sentence in isolation is harassment.

You seem kinda triggered and basically agreeing with everything I said, so I would recommend understanding that I wasn't attacking you, but rather the notion that any statement can be thrown out if the DPS is bad.

[Komarimono]

My first sentence was "Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement."

My response is that simply stating that is harrassement. I also didn't mention you personally. I stated that simply stating that sentence in isolation is harassment.

You seem kinda triggered and basically agreeing with everything I said, so I would recommend understanding that I wasn't attacking you, but rather the notion that any statement can be thrown out if the DPS is bad.

I'm not triggered, I'm far too old for that, I grew up in a generation of respect and no safe places. You are the one acting as such though, flying those white knight colors and parading as in as the defender of the down trodden. I was simply stating my opinions and some facts. I never implied in any of my posts that I was being attacked either, rather confusing how you came to that conclusion.

I still stand by my statement that if someone takes offense to something so trivial and tiny in those passing seconds of their life, they need to stop playing and figure out why they got offended or hurt, then realize it was pointless to be offended or hurt in the first place.

[Granyala]

My first sentence was "Simply stating "DPS pull your weight" or simply stating "DPS - do more damage" IS harrassement."
My response is that simply stating that is harrassement.

I think you need to read up on the definition of "harassment".
Stating a simple fact is not and never will be considered harassment as long as the fact is conveyed in a non insulting manner.

If the boss wipes the floor with your rear end due to enrage, the BOSS ITSELF (I guess you consider that harassment too. :O )is already telling you that DPS players need to step up their game. Technically you don't need another player to spell it out for you.