Lack of End Game Content

[Fiorinol]

It’s one fight that is more challenging and carries more weight than the four you are progressing through currently. And it certainly took the best players in the game longer to clear than any Savage tier since Midas (UCoB took about 13 days; UwU took about 6 days—for comparison, Creator took about 36 hours; Deltascape, Sigmascape, and Alphascape took about 18 hours; and Eden took less than that).

Shrugging off Ultimate because “it’s just one fight” isn’t really a decent excuse not to acknowledge the content.

IDK about Ultimate. Many of my friends just "raid log" nowadays. For those who don't know what that is, it's when you only login to do your raids for the week. The game just has nothing else to offer them when they're done with MSQ.

There are many things I find lacking about this game's endgame. In North America, you're required (we can argue of course) to play on a schedule with a static to do the harder content, Party Finder is bad and party leaders don't have much control over their parties, for instance, there's no way for me to ensure that players have seen up to a certain phase, or that they're able to put out a certain amount of dps for a given fight. I can't say I enjoy Party Finder, I don't know whether it got worst or if my patience is growing thinner this expansion. I also don't find the rewards from ultimate to be incredibly interesting either especially given the prevalence of RMT groups selling the content. "Legend" players are a dime a dozen on my server, and I've seen more people getting harassed over using the title than people being wooed over it.

As for other content:

- Gathering and Crafting has a bot problem on Gilgamesh, many marketboard listings are dominated by players who bot and the updates to Shadowbringers just made crafting even more reliant on macros than before. I'm looking forward as to how that factors into the restoration of Ishgard.
- Extreme trials only last so long
- The post MSQ dungeon experience is very lacking. The fastest roulette by far to gear up is Expert, and there all you do is play the same 3 dungeons over and over for 6 months. When 5.1 rolls around, you will have an extra dungeon and will still be playing the other two dungeons that you've played for months prior to that.
- Eureka and diadem-type content feels like busywork with rewards that aren't exactly riveting. If I wanted to do busywork, I'd go play Oldschool Runescape. The relic was behind other weapons for ages in Stormblood.
- Housing doesn't get that many updates with each patch. It gets a few items here and there, yet you're expected to keep paying for a sub to keep a house. To add insult to injury, one player on my server owns an entire ward, and wrote a dissertation about it on his personal blog, bragging about how he's doing a good service for our server. Many players are completely locked out of housing outside of owning an apartment.
- Maps feel like an interesting concept, but a majority of the time, you're awarded with trash.
- I genuinely don't understand how people enjoy PvP in this game. It feels like a very lacking game mode.

[Zabuza]

You're ignoring constructive feedback in order to continue arguing. At this point, it is all on you. You're playing the victim when people are trying to give you actual feedback and saying you're being attacked.

Sorry, but I don't consider 'leave the game' constructive feedback. Anyways, I'm fatigued. For some reason people want to apply a unique standard to endgame to where only someone who has done 100% can say anything about endgame. So that means 1% of people since there is one actual hard fight in the game per tier(Ultimate). That is a good way to ensure that the endgame scene will never improve if no one can ever offer suggestions for it. We do not tell people that they cannot offer suggestions for mounts if they have not collected every mount. You guys keep applying that type of standard here, however. It is hypocritical. Anyways, I probably will try Ultimate later on. Otherwise, I'm done with this argument unless someone has something new to add. I'm just...tired.

[Nemmar]

Well... i tire of saying this, but FF isn't WoW. If you are playing it like WoW, you are not gonna find a better WoW here.

FF is fundamentally different. Your end-game is the end game you got and all the other things you can do. You want to remove them from this discussion and you want the developers to just focus in end game to end up with a shallow game like WoW? Probably not gonna happen. The sugestion of a system like AP is atrocious. One of the worst things WoW has ever done. Also, the director said he doesn't want to create a game where you are never done. He cares about people and wants you to have time to go back to the things that matter to you irl and then come back when the next patch comes out. Wich honestly it's something WoW players complain about WoW these days. That they can never have that feeling that they are done with a tier anymore (titanforging and AP stuff).

The things you can do is level other jobs, gold saucer, housing, Eureka, FATEs, Grand company stuff, PvP, etc. If all you care about and your measure is dungeons and raids, no one is gonna beat wow anytime soon. So, if you only enjoy them stick with it. This is a different game. There's a bit less focus in the end-game and more focus everywhere else. And even so the encounters are better if you ask me.

I play both games btw. And i am very aware of what strengths and weaknesses they have. WoW has a compelling gearing system and bigger raids (and constant AP grind to keep up). But it's reset every 6 months and eventually you feel like the hamster in the wheel. FF focus more on the whole experience. If you rush through it, like you do in WoW, you are never gonna find what makes this game great. Another way to say it is WoW is geared for E-sports and FF is geared to keep it's players entertained. It's your choice what you prefer. If you want to pretend you are an e-sports player, WoW is your game.

And btw, no other mmo has raids and dungeons the size of WoW's. So, as much as you want to shove it to blizzard, you have to be able to recognize where their strengths are. And your gaming habits have been shaped by them. You can always try to break free and immerse yourself rather than constantly playing in the most efficient mode possible to get to end game and rinse and repeat. Take your time and enjoy. You will find a surprisingly great game when you do.

[Holydippy]

Do people not have other games they like to play as well? Or work? Or School?
Wow has loads of 'end game' stuff to do but none of it is rewarding or requires you to actually work towards anything... it's like oh do world quest ... get gear ... or join the rest of the player base doing an AP grind for your necklace ...
TBH I'm not yet at this games end game but I have other games I want to play after getting to end game and being able to 'hopefully' put ff14 down for 20 minutes a day to actually play something else.
Also ... This will sound harsh but if you have such a problem with end game ... go play another MMO? it isn't like there are none out there...

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Sorry, but I don't consider 'leave the game' constructive feedback. Anyways, I'm fatigued. For some reason people want to apply a unique standard to endgame to where only someone who has done 100% can say anything about endgame. So that means 1% of people since there is one actual hard fight in the game per tier(Ultimate). That is a good way to ensure that the endgame scene will never improve if no one can ever offer suggestions for it. We do not tell people that they cannot offer suggestions for mounts if they have not collected every mount. You guys keep applying that type of standard here, however. It is hypocritical. Anyways, I probably will try Ultimate later on. Otherwise, I'm done with this argument unless someone has something new to add. I'm just...tired.

You're tired because you keep misconstruing the argument and people don't let on.
Look at what you're saying. You're saying that others are saying you need to complete Ultimate to say anything about endgame.
Yet you're complaining about lack of endgame... while not having cleared all of the available endgame. You're asking for more food and your plate isn't empty yet.

[Zabuza]

You're tired because you keep misconstruing the argument and people don't let on.
Look at what you're saying. You're saying that others are saying you need to complete Ultimate to say anything about endgame.
Yet you're complaining about lack of endgame... while not having cleared all of the available endgame. You're asking for more food and your plate isn't empty yet.

Yet people ask for new mounts and glamour all the time without having obtained all mounts and glamour. You don't see the clear double standard. Please tell me why it's okay for that but not this.

The forum is already a tiny minority of the game, and you guys want to stifle ideas further by saying only those who have cleared Ultimate(1%) can discuss endgame. So basically, 1% of 1% are allowed to discuss endgame. That's absurd.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Yet people ask for new mounts and glamour all the time without having obtained all mounts and glamour. You don't see the clear double standard. Please tell me why it's okay for that but not this.

The forum is already a tiny minority of the game, and you guys want to stifle ideas further by saying only those who have cleared Ultimate(1%) can discuss endgame. So basically, 1% of 1% are allowed to discuss endgame. That's absurd.

Wanting a particular mount =/= wanting more mounts in general. I'm allowed to ask for a particular kind of mount because it's my personal taste. But it would be hypocritical of me to ask 50 more mounts while not having collected all of them. Kinda like asking for more endgame without having cleared Ultimate.

Clear Ultimate first, then you'll truly be out of endgame to do and you can legitimately complain. Right now, your claim that you don't have anymore endgame to do is a lie. You still have Ultimate.

[BlitzAceRush]

Yet people ask for new mounts and glamour all the time without having obtained all mounts and glamour. You don't see the clear double standard. Please tell me why it's okay for that but not this.

The forum is already a tiny minority of the game, and you guys want to stifle ideas further by saying only those who have cleared Ultimate(1%) can discuss endgame. So basically, 1% of 1% are allowed to discuss endgame. That's absurd.

Different arguments,
"I'd like a Slime mount" is not the same us "There aren't enough mounts."
Lay out a request for a specific bit of new content you would like to see, lets talk about that, but saying "There isn't enough endgame" isn't asking for something specific, it's claiming you're out of endgame content and want more, but you're not.
Like I said you're talking on a public forum and branding anyone who doesn't agree with you as a villain while you're the victim, if you don't want discussion with people of differing options then leave a feedback topic or a question for the LL and move on.
But stop treating anyone with a conflicting view point as the enemy and acting like those happy with the game are out to ruin it for you, by your logic I should go over the the Overwatch forums and demand they give up some of their PVP stuff so I can have more PVE, I mean why not? They've got so much why shouldn't they alter the game they enjoy for me?

[HyoMinPark]

snip

I guess what keeps me constantly subbed is that I tend to not limit my activities to endgame or raiding. I have a lot of alts that I enjoy “escaping” to and just doing baby stuff on because it’s relaxing—I have one alt ready for ShB whenever I finish leveling GNB on her, and 3 going through the early MSQ at various stages of ARR; another is in HW that I’m doing MSQ over again with a friend. I’ve considered asking my sister or my fiancé if they would like to play FFXIV. I’d go through the story with them again on an alt whenever I’m not raiding; but the ARR slog tends to make people pause, and I’m not sure how they’ll take to it (besides, sister is heading back to school in two weeks, so she’ll be pretty busy anyways). I also have in-game friends that I do things with, be it Roulettes, random dungeons, maps, whatever. One night, a couple of us went to different areas in-game and shared “baby stories” from back when we were new players. It was a fun thing to do.

I’m also fairly busy when school starts up, so a lot of evenings are either just dedicated to raid, or I can only get on and do stuff like capping or whatnot during the weekend (last semester I was super busy the last month or so, so I was barely online outside of raid nights). The only notable time I found myself bored was during 4.1 until I started doing UCoB, and that kept me entertained—I had a static that was on break until Sigmascape, I wasn’t interested in doing Shinryu because PF was a mixed bag, and there were no relics or anything to really work on. End of SB was particularly slow, but I passed the time on alts instead of my main. I think non-Eureka relics would have eased that a bit, because I spent a lot of time during the last months of HW just working on relics because I wanted them for glamour.

I understand people don’t always care to do alts or relive the MSQ or do any of the things I particularly enjoy doing. But I do think a lot of the limiting oneself to “endgame only” is something that can cause fast boredom with this game. I can’t make people do non-endgame things; however, the reason I hardly ever grow tired or bored of FFXIV is simply because I do a lot of different stuff and not just endgame raiding/dungeons/primals/etc..


As for the Ultimate and the selling thing—well, selling content has existed in this game since Titan HM. It’s fairly easy to tell who legitimate “Legends” are, and which ones aren’t. I don’t really see the “people can sell this” as a reason to not do the content. But I do it to prove to myself that I can do it—not for lording the weapon or the title over other people. And the fights are just fun. Wiping to Twin and Garuda can get tedious sometimes, but I’d go in for more reclears of UwU any day. Plus, I’d like to beat my current best of the fight. Like with Savage: the content stays alive longer for me because I want to beat my last personal best. People hate on The Website That Shall Not Be Named a lot; but, for raiders like myself, it keeps the content alive because we have something we push for and go back into the content for after we’ve secured our BiS.

[Millybonk]

Different arguments,
"I'd like a Slime mount" is not the same us "There aren't enough mounts."
Lay out a request for a specific bit of new content you would like to see, lets talk about that, but saying "There isn't enough endgame" isn't asking for something specific, it's claiming you're out of endgame content and want more, but you're not.
Like I said you're talking on a public forum and branding anyone who doesn't agree with you as a villain while you're the victim, if you don't want discussion with people of differing options then leave a feedback topic or a question for the LL and move on.
But stop treating anyone with a conflicting view point as the enemy and acting like those happy with the game are out to ruin it for you, by your logic I should go over the the Overwatch forums and demand they give up some of their PVP stuff so I can have more PVE, I mean why not? They've got so much why shouldn't they alter the game they enjoy for me?

• Mounts/glamor can be farmed year round - whereas 5.05 endgame content is very limited, and every other instanced content doesn't offer you anything if it's not a daily roulette due to tomestone bonus; additionally keep an eye out how many additional mounts/glamors gets frequently released vs. actual challenging combat outside of the normal release cycle
• I already proposed a simple solution: using the scaling-tech already in place to scale every instanced group content up to lvl 80. Offer lvl 80 item drops, additional challenges + tomestones and people would be quite happy
• He, like me, is asking for additional challenging content outside the normal and very limited release cycle, and that additional content isn't taking anything away from you