Issue with TBN

[TheRealQuah]

You just stated the issue with TBN yourself. It is the only short mitigation CD of all tanks that is not, and should not be used for fluff mitigation. Just as Cabalabob said a post above, DRK does not get anything for any missing fluff mitigation. GNB has HoS and Camouflage, WAR RawI/Nascent Flash and ToB, PLD Sheltron and passive block, and every single one of them is FREE. DRK Dark Mind is NOT fluff mitigation, and every other CD has a long recast or role action, and doesn't do any better than other tanks mitigation tools.

DRK got the short end in terms of fluff mitigation... (and unfortunately DPS again, too.)

DPS difference between tanks is around 5%. It's so small it's not really a consideration to take into effect.

TBN is a unique skill, that makes DRK incredibly strong as an MT. Can we not advocate for homogenising jobs even more than they already are, just because people don't understand how to use their toolkit correctly.

[Reynhart]

Whatever we thought about every job and every skill, there's still a concept that risk should be tied to a reward.
TBN always come with a risk, but it offers absolutely no reward. So, give it a reward by making Dark Arts crit your next Edge/Flood on top or replacing the mana cost.

[Typhoria]

Reworking Dark Arts probably would be the best option and make TBN require Dark Arts to use and remove the mana cost.

For example: After taking 50% of your health in damage (damage while shielded still counts), you gain Dark Arts. TBN would be self use only, with no cooldown, just dependant on Dark Arts.

This way if TBN is fully consumed, you would have met half the threshold for another TBN already.

Add a new ability that is cast on others.
Dark Heart: Apply a 20% health shield on a target, if this shield is consumed the Dark Knight generates Dark Arts. 20s CD.

[Nedkel]

Whatever we thought about every job and every skill, there's still a concept that risk should be tied to a reward.
TBN always come with a risk, but it offers absolutely no reward. So, give it a reward by making Dark Arts crit your next Edge/Flood on top or replacing the mana cost.

Wat.
You get a shield and you get a chance to use the damage move.
Its twice as efficient than normally using MP for damage abilities.

You risk for a reward straight forward.

[ValentineSnow]

So, people claiming it's fine that TBN can't mitigate fluff. Can you tell me what exactly makes TBN good then?

It's not really any stronger than the other tanks mitigation tools on tank busters (120k damage tank buster would be mitigated about 24k by sheltron while TBN gives about 29k shield). It has a shorter recast, but what good is that when you can't actually use it in that time?

You can say it's not a problem that TBN is less readily available than the other tanks mitigation, but why should it not be as readily available when it offers no decent advantages for it?

[waterboytkd]

Whatever we thought about every job and every skill, there's still a concept that risk should be tied to a reward.
TBN always come with a risk, but it offers absolutely no reward. So, give it a reward by making Dark Arts crit your next Edge/Flood on top or replacing the mana cost.

I think this is the important point. The MP cost means you're giving up an Edge/Flood for TBN. No other tank is giving up its offense just to be able to use its defense*. If you use it correctly, it breaks even. Risk for no reward.

Considering DRK is also bringing up the rear in the dps department, I think this is a fine suggestion. Another would be you get two stacks of Dark Arts, not one. The idea being: MP you could otherwise spend on offense gets spent of defense, but if you spend it wisely/best, you will actually get a boost to your offense (an autocrit Edge/Flood, or 2 Edge/Floods).

*The only exception is Paladin's Clemency, but that's not a "normal" part of their defensive kit. It's more of a panic button. If things are going south, Paladin can give up some damage (a significant amount, tbh) to bring some strong healing to the team. But if everything goes according to plan, a Paladin never casts Clemency.

[TheRealQuah]

So many people have an opinion on DRK that don't have it at level 80 and haven't played it in endgame content.

[Reynhart]

You get a shield

Something that other tanks have without any risk at all, and completely free.

and you get a chance to use the damage move.

A move that you could have used instead of TBN.

DPS wise, TBN is at best neutral. There is no "reward" at all.

However, if we want something less straightforward than a Crit buff, we could have Dark Arts only last for a set duration (Like 10s) and, while Dark Arts is active, you gain a slight speed buff. Of course, Dark Arts will wear off if you use Edge/Flood so you'd have to make sure you don't need to refresh Darkside during the duration of Dark Arts.

[TheRealQuah]

I think this is the important point. The MP cost means you're giving up an Edge/Flood for TBN. No other tank is giving up its offense just to be able to use its defense*. If you use it correctly, it breaks even. Risk for no reward.

Considering DRK is also bringing up the rear in the dps department, I think this is a fine suggestion. Another would be you get two stacks of Dark Arts, not one. The idea being: MP you could otherwise spend on offense gets spent of defense, but if you spend it wisely/best, you will actually get a boost to your offense (an autocrit Edge/Flood, or 2 Edge/Floods).

If you use it correctly, you drastically reduce the damage that you take. So you need less healing. So healers can an extra couple of GCD's on DPS.
Though I do kinda agree that Dark Arts should also guarantee a Crit Direct hit.

[TheRealQuah]

Something that other tanks have without any risk at all, and completely free.

A move that you could have used instead of TBN.

DPS wise, TBN is at best neutral. There is no "reward" at all.

However, if we want something less straightforward than a Crit buff, we could have Dark Arts only last for a set duration (Like 10s) and, while Dark Arts is active, you gain a slight speed buff. Of course, Dark Arts will wear off if you use Edge/Flood so you'd have to make sure you don't need to refresh Darkside during the duration of Dark Arts.

Which other tanks have a 25% shield on a 15s cooldown exactly?