Please let PS4 parse our dps like pc

[Granyala]

I agree that calling a person "trash tier" is entirely uncalled for and most certainly does not help the case of making parsers more accessible.
She seems unwilling to listen and apparently cannot be convinced but insulting her crosses the line into unprofessional behavior.

It is the time to let the matter rest because all it does is drive this further off topic. We all said our piece, the point of any discussion is not to convince the other at gunpoint (no matter how misguided they are) but to lay out the facts, talk about them and eventually let everyone come to their own conclusions.

I must also point out that using logic, factual arguments and hard data in order to disprove a hypothesis is NOT "harassment".
People really need to stop throwing this buzzword around.

[Taramin]

The big issue is the fact that all this is over her comments in a different thread. That your crusade dragged into this thread -about parsing- of all threads, to attack her outlandish claim in the other thread, call her trash and a liar over multiple pages, multiple posts, using -PARSES- as the evidence.

IDK about her opinion, I can see without going to FFlogs that's she's not great, just by her admission via post history of not caring about/doing healer dps.

Her being wrong isn't the issue, it's the lot of you coming into this thread and doing the VERY THING Yoshi doesn't want people to do with parsers.

This thread is now damning evidence against the case for legal parsing.

And yes, name calling, and multi-page forum-wide witchhunts are "Harassment". Maybe not in your mind, but it is in SE's forum ToS.

[Avidria]

The big issue is the fact that all this is over her comments in a different thread. That your crusade dragged into this thread -about parsing- of all threads, to attack her outlandish claim in the other thread, call her trash and a liar over multiple pages, multiple posts, using -PARSES- as the evidence.

IDK about her opinion, I can see without going to FFlogs that's she's not great, just by her admission via post history of not caring about/doing healer dps.

Her being wrong isn't the issue, it's the lot of you coming into this thread and doing the VERY THING Yoshi doesn't want people to do with parsers.

This thread is now damning evidence against the case for legal parsing.

And yes, name calling, and multi-page forum-wide witchhunts are "Harassment". Maybe not in your mind, but it is in SE's forum ToS.

My problem with this is that a handful of people using parsers as evidence should not be a case against the parsers themselves. You don't necessarily need a parser to tell when someone's doing something wrong, and you definitely don't if they're doing something very wrong. I've seen plenty of players who thought they were good when they were actually average at best and godawful at worst - both in this game with no parser, and in several other MMOs I've played.

Parsers are a tool. One that can be extremely useful when used correctly. I won't deny it can be used as a tool to harass, but in most cases that kind of bad behavior likely would've been present anyway. People who are inclined to be rude are always going to be rude - all the numbers can do is prove them right, or sometimes even prove them wrong. Had more than a few times in WoW where someone tried to complain at me or a group member, only to have a parser linked to show them that the person they were whining about was more than pulling their weight. Good way to get those types to quiet down fast.

What happened in this thread was a silly debate that went too far, but that's no fault of any parser.

[Mavrias]

This thread is a perfect example of why parsers will never be allowed. People take wildly incomplete, random data and harass others with it. The ToS will always be in favor of fair and cooperative play. It feels good to be on the right side. To those in the thread who rally against this toxicity: keep up the good fight.

Alright, so lemme further sumarize this "random incomplete data" using your best posted Titania run You (and the scholar) had over 30% overheal each. Drastically lower cpm, which to a degree is understandable as you dont have as many oGCDs to press as a dps would. There is no above average damage taken from your party. The only death is from the monk who died once from eating 3 frost runes (with zero heals received between hits.) The only information about that run fflogs cant give me is your gear level. But, I could make the argument that if you were drastically undergeared to cause that much disparity you shouldmt have been in the party in the first place.

[RayneLittlewinkle]

I agree I hope they can implement a tool that would allow PS4 players to keep track of how they are doing. But also an option to disable it if no one really cares about their DPS.

[Misutoraru]

The big issue is the fact that all this is over her comments in a different thread. That your crusade dragged into this thread -about parsing- of all threads, to attack her outlandish claim in the other thread, call her trash and a liar over multiple pages, multiple posts, using -PARSES- as the evidence.

IDK about her opinion, I can see without going to FFlogs that's she's not great, just by her admission via post history of not caring about/doing healer dps.

Her being wrong isn't the issue, it's the lot of you coming into this thread and doing the VERY THING Yoshi doesn't want people to do with parsers.

This thread is now damning evidence against the case for legal parsing.

And yes, name calling, and multi-page forum-wide witchhunts are "Harassment". Maybe not in your mind, but it is in SE's forum ToS.

This is why I am so against it
There are toxicity in community even without any sort of parse, but make it official, it like giving a gun to bad guy.
Yeah, it is a tool which would be very helpful when use in the right way, but also very harmful when use it in the wrong way, and my experience told me, it alway got miss use, and I see the bad outweighs the good

[Taramin]

My problem with this is that a handful of people using parsers as evidence should not be a case against the parsers themselves. You don't necessarily need a parser to tell when someone's doing something wrong, and you definitely don't if they're doing something very wrong. I've seen plenty of players who thought they were good when they were actually average at best and godawful at worst - both in this game with no parser, and in several other MMOs I've played.

Parsers are a tool. One that can be extremely useful when used correctly. I won't deny it can be used as a tool to harass, but in most cases that kind of bad behavior likely would've been present anyway. People who are inclined to be rude are always going to be rude - all the numbers can do is prove them right, or sometimes even prove them wrong. Had more than a few times in WoW where someone tried to complain at me or a group member, only to have a parser linked to show them that the person they were whining about was more than pulling their weight. Good way to get those types to quiet down fast.

What happened in this thread was a silly debate that went too far, but that's no fault of any parser.

I know, but they aren't doing anyone any favors. I'd LOVE to have a sanctioned parser. I used it in WoW this expac when I dabbled in raiding above LFR for the first time since Cata. I went from trash to decent almost overnight.

If we could get say, a parser that only is available in pre-made high level duty parties, and some AoE markers added to the Stone Sky Sea dummies, we'd have some really great tools for personal improvement. Right now we have a third party website where people can give you grief for your performance in that one Rabanastre you got roulette'd into at 3 AM while you had a head cold in vendor gear 2 years ago.
I don't hate FFlogs, I hate what people are doing with it.

[Avidria]

I know, but they aren't doing anyone any favors. I'd LOVE to have a sanctioned parser. I used it in WoW this expac when I dabbled in raiding above LFR for the first time since Cata. I went from trash to decent almost overnight.

If we could get say, a parser that only is available in pre-made high level duty parties, and some AoE markers added to the Stone Sky Sea dummies, we'd have some really great tools for personal improvement. Right now we have a third party website where people can give you grief for your performance in that one Rabanastre you got roulette'd into at 3 AM while you had a head cold in vendor gear 2 years ago.
I don't hate FFlogs, I hate what people are doing with it.

Anyone giving you grief for one bad parse that isn't worth listening to anyway. Nothing but a silly waste of time at that point. What are they trying to prove, and to who? Honestly. Either way, immature people using the tool the wrong way shouldn't be a reason to write the tool off entirely.

Frankly, I'd take anything at this point. I used dps meters for more than a decade in WoW, and it was a huge help in tracking my progress and improvement. I absolutely hate not knowing how well I'm doing quantitatively - I hate hate HATE not knowing if it's me that's holding the group back, if it's me that's the reason we didn't make that DPS check. Yeah, that's a me problem, but it's a frustrating one that I've only really had to deal with here. Most other MMOs I've played, I've mained a healer or stayed out of actual endgame and it wasn't a problem. Here I'm stuck trying and hoping or relying on somebody else, because heck if I'm taking the risk of getting banned because I care about how well I'm doing. Hearing they don't care as long as you don't talk about it in game isn't enough for me to chance it frankly.

Give me a way to measure how well I'm doing. An actual, good way to measure it. That's all I want.

[Kleeya]

I am not sure that adding aoes to the dummies would be that good of a thing. People would become good at dpsing the dummy and avoiding his specific aoes, but it would change once in a real fight with way different patterns. Each time i try a new extreme or savage i have to relearn progressively where i can dps effectively or not depending of what is happening. Some different mechanics around the dummy will not help me that much for that.

For me the dummies are just for knowing if you can put out a sufficient dps, and if you have progressed when killing it faster. And once in the fight it is up to you to see where and when you can go ham on your damages. It doesn't need a parser to know that launching a 10 seconds burst phase one second before the boss goes invincible is not a good thing.

[Ramesses]

To parse or not to parse... this discussion has been flogged to death, revived and then some.

However, I'll say it yet again for the umpteenth time... people who take other players' parses and post them onto third party sites like FFlogs without their permission might want to exhibit extreme caution. I'm still predicting that one of these days in the very near future, one of you will unknowingly parse an SE employee in-game, post their parses online without their consent, and they will unwittingly find it.

The repercussions and carnage that will ensue will be the stuff of legends.