Lack of End Game Content

[Mikhaill]

I love how a lot of people here are constantly going "Did you farm all mounts? Did you level X,Y,Z, did you play Mahjong or any other game
that only %.1 of players play? Glamour?" That is not end-game. That's side content you are free to do, and yes, there are tons of things to do.
He means what else is there to do other than the same song and dance we've done for the past 6 years.
After we reach max level, we do some raid, a trial, some Expert dungeons and chill for the next predictable thing they've laid out for us.
It's the same stuff all the time. Instead of wasting on resources just about no one does, they could try and expand the end-game scene somehow.

Not sure why everyone is getting upset by people want more to chew on?

On a personal note: I agree with it but I end up taking my leave for X amount of time until new stuff comes back or when I want to.
Endgame never all that it's cracked up to be lol. The real fun was climbing your way there because at the end, there's not much but
wait for resets lol.

[ElciaDeiLinus]

I love how a lot of people here are constantly going "Did you farm all mounts? Did you level X,Y,Z, did you play Mahjong or any other game
that only %.1 of players play? Glamour?" That is not end-game. That's side content you are free to do, and yes, there are tons of things to do.
He means what else is there to do other than the same song and dance we've done for the past 6 years.
After we reach max level, we do some raid, a trial, some Expert dungeons and chill for the next predictable thing they've laid out for us.
It's the same stuff all the time. Instead of wasting on resources just about no one does, they could try and expand the end-game scene somehow.

Except the ones that are bored are a 1% group that blows through content...

Like, if you don't think they should waste development time on things nobody does (and let's me honest, they spend far, far less time on things like gold saucer or even crafting than on everything that goes into making raid content and other endgame style content like BA)- then shouldn't you be complaining about how much time they spend on making all the savage, ultimates, etc...?

You've sort of hit the nail on the head though- because that challenge mode is something only 1% of players do, they aren't going to go all in on it like WoW does. They'd be more likely to put more time into it if far more people did it, but from the sounds of it even the intended audience only does it once then is bored.

[Klb600]

Except the ones that are bored are a 1% group that blows through content...

Like, if you don't think they should waste development time on things nobody does (and let's me honest, they spend far, far less time on things like gold saucer or even crafting than on everything that goes into making raid content and other endgame style content like BA)- then shouldn't you be complaining about how much time they spend on making all the savage, ultimates, etc...?

You've sort of hit the nail on the head though- because that challenge mode is something only 1% of players do, they aren't going to go all in on it like WoW does. They'd be more likely to put more time into it if far more people did it, but from the sounds of it even the intended audience only does it once then is bored.

The 1% huh....Ok show me the metrics for this. The people that are so against added content for those who would enjoy for some reason love using this figure as a shield. I in no way doubt that the people who want this stuff are the minority, but are they really as small as you claim? because with the amount of people suggesting more content of this nature and the amount of people I see on PF running savage and extremes, their group cant possibly this small? link me too some stats on this.

[CazzT]

The 1% huh....Ok show me the metrics for this. The people that are so against added content for those who would enjoy for some reason love using this figure as a shield. I in no way doubt that the people who want this stuff are the minority, but are they really as small as you claim? because with the amount of people suggesting more content of this nature and the amount of people I see on PF running savage and extremes, their group cant possibly this small? link me too some stats on this.

Instead of focusing on the actual number, how about accepting the reality that the people who would consume the content you you're asking for are a very, very small portion of the community. When someone refers to "the 1% who would enjoy it", they're referencing what happened with the Sunwell raid in WoW's Burning Crusade. A monumental amount of time was devoted to creating that raid, but only about 1% (and this is according to Blizzard themselves) ever actually downed the final boss. This is not a good way to utilize resources.
And I'm sure you're aware of this already, but only the devs and number crunchers at SE know actual numbers.

As for the number of people asking for more content, you have to consider several factors. What content are they asking for? How many are asking each specific content type? How many that are asking for one type are also asking for another that someone else is asking for? And much more beyond.
In regards to PF, that's a tiny fraction of the overall number of players.

You know no one has the info you're asking for. Because SE does not share it. So asking for it can only be seen as an attempt to dismiss the points being made.

[Hank_Hotspur]

I'm fine with this being an mmo I let my sub lapse during a lull of content. All other mmos pretend to have something always happening but that usually means logging in to do the same dailies every day or standing in your garrison all the time.

[Klb600]

Instead of focusing on the actual number, how about accepting the reality that the people who would consume the content you you're asking for are a very, very small portion of the community. When someone refers to "the 1% who would enjoy it", they're referencing what happened with the Sunwell raid in WoW's Burning Crusade. A monumental amount of time was devoted to creating that raid, but only about 1% (and this is according to Blizzard themselves) ever actually downed the final boss. This is not a good way to utilize resources.
And I'm sure you're aware of this already, but only the devs and number crunchers at SE know actual numbers.

As for the number of people asking for more content, you have to consider several factors. What content are they asking for? How many are asking each specific content type? How many that are asking for one type are also asking for another that someone else is asking for? And much more beyond.
In regards to PF, that's a tiny fraction of the overall number of players.

You know no one has the info you're asking for. Because SE does not share it. So asking for it can only be seen as an attempt to dismiss the points being made.

No, because the actual numbers are very important. If you are going to dismiss people with 1% when in fact you could be referencing 30%. if possibly 30% then that is a very large share of the capital. too condense it down to "1%" is a straight up lie with no further argument needed. So yes, I would like the specific number so people can stop throwing around factually incorrect data.

So asking for it can only be seen as an attempt to dismiss the points being made.


like how people are condensing it down to "1%" to dismiss the points of the opposition?

[CazzT]

No, because the actual numbers are very important. If you are going to dismiss people with 1% when in fact you could be referencing 30%. if possibly 30% then that is a very large share of the capital. too condense it down to "1%" is a straight up lie with no further argument needed. So yes, I would like the specific number so people can stop throwing around factually incorrect data.

exactly like how these people are condensing it down to "1%" to dismiss others.

You will never get the specific number unless you get a job at SE working in specific departments or SE gives us some numbers.
No one is dismissing the calls for more content. People are pointing out that adding content for a small group is not good business when you could make content that the majority will enjoy. That's not being dismissive, that's stating reality.

[Klb600]

You will never get the specific number unless you get a job at SE working in specific departments or SE gives us some numbers.
No one is dismissing the calls for more content. People are pointing out that adding content for a small group is not good business when you could make content that the majority will enjoy. That's not being dismissive, that's stating reality.

stating "1%" with no real data is not reality, no matter how you look at it. like I stated you don't know how large that share is, yet you make baseless assumption. even if its not 50:50, when possibly 20-30% is a large share, and are still owed a return. So yes they still have a voice in this

[Mikhaill]

Except the ones that are bored are a 1% group that blows through content...

Like, if you don't think they should waste development time on things nobody does (and let's me honest, they spend far, far less time on things like gold saucer or even crafting than on everything that goes into making raid content and other endgame style content like BA)- then shouldn't you be complaining about how much time they spend on making all the savage, ultimates, etc...?

You've sort of hit the nail on the head though- because that challenge mode is something only 1% of players do, they aren't going to go all in on it like WoW does. They'd be more likely to put more time into it if far more people did it, but from the sounds of it even the intended audience only does it once then is bored.

I was actually talking about the useless stuff that is in the Golden Saucer such as Mahjong, Verminion and other stuff which is the %.1 I was talking about.
Not savage, because that is part of end-game.
Eureka/Diadem/Pagos whatever you wanna call it, is also a mess and should just be tossed all together.

[Hawklaser]

Except the ones that are bored are a 1% group that blows through content...

Like, if you don't think they should waste development time on things nobody does (and let's me honest, they spend far, far less time on things like gold saucer or even crafting than on everything that goes into making raid content and other endgame style content like BA)- then shouldn't you be complaining about how much time they spend on making all the savage, ultimates, etc...?

You've sort of hit the nail on the head though- because that challenge mode is something only 1% of players do, they aren't going to go all in on it like WoW does. They'd be more likely to put more time into it if far more people did it, but from the sounds of it even the intended audience only does it once then is bored.

Since you want to go on this route of the once and done... Outside of your favorite Mount, how often do you use each of every single mount you have collected? Outside of your favorite Minion, how often do you use each and every singe minion you have collected? Outside of your favorite glamour set, how often do you use other glamours on a regular basis? How often do you play all of the Gold Saucer mini games outside of your favorites and for the challenge log completion? How often do you use a title other than your favorite? How often do you redesign your house, if you happen to be one of the lucky ones to have one?


Also part of the reason less time gets spent on things like mounts, minions and the like is scale. Just to keep it simple, going to go with a minion for this example. Realistically, all a minion is a cuter version of a mob, or some other model with a very basic follow script. It takes some work by the art team to put together the 3d model and give it the correct lighting meshes, maybe some light AI adjustments by the programmers to add a little personality, and ensure it works with the terrain around it. And it is pretty much done. Now lets look at a basic boss encounter. First there is building the AI script and tuning the boss stats. Then there is also the 3d modeling and lighting for the boss itself, as well as the arena. Then testing everything together to make sure all the parts work together correctly when players are fighting it and all actions done by it are applied to players correctly, and its actions are applied to players correctly. Then there is the actual play testing phases to ensure it is feasible for the intended content level. That is all for one boss. This compounds for an entire dungeon/raid.

This all still comes back to a universal problem all content creators face. It takes more time to create content than it does to consume it. The odd thing though, is gamers are just a little more vocal about it not being produced fast enough for them. TV, Movies, and literature, people are often more content to wait out the production cycle. So until a way is found to slow down gamers consumption of content in an ethical and enjoyable way, the lack of challenging end game level content will be a perpetual problem in persistent theme park MMO game.