[Spoilers] Eden Feedback Thread

[NorthernLadMSP]

Absolutely love the new loot system. Hugely appreciated.

[whiskeybravo]

Just throwing my opinion out there:

Disappointed

I know there will be more to do in savage, but holy cow these fights are braindead. 99% reused mechanics and 50% reused bosses. As for the story, I can't find anything original. Now we're just our own wandering minstrel with new omega pet, but at least this one's not trying to kill us yet.

[Gula]

What's up with you people wanting story mode as difficult as savage?

It's an endless cycle. Omg this is too easy, omg this is too hard pls nerf, omg this is too easy. I wasn't there to witness the Alexander progression, but I've heard the stories. It's what happened when they tried to make it hard.

[Rufalus]

I like what they did with the battle choices. Eden Prime being first instead of last may feel strange to some people but we've had that other kind of boss hierachy before in Coil, Alex, Omega so it's time to do something different. FF VIII fans get the fan service they want right out of the gate. Remixing ARR primals is also a nice touch now that the original fights are old enough to evoke a touch of nostalgia in veteran players, while new players never got to experience those when they were challenging. People have been easily mowing down Titan overgeared for years but now he's back kinda as the boss of a savage raid tier to put some respect on his name again. And yes the story is super contrived again like Omega was. I guess that's the tradeoff we have to accept; lore gets moulded very conveniently for raids to allow a gauntlet of fan service bosses in pretty rooms.

[Renato]

So I was originally miffed on this idea, BUT there's three big things I loved about this.

1) We know Nomura did every boss design for Eden so this is a way for Nomura to show his own interpretations of the Primals from ARR. From a story perspective this makes so much sense since our variations (Nomura's redesigns) are going to look much different, even if we laugh at how we thought Titan had a go-kart.

That's cool and all. I see the appeal of how people could be excited about this because the designs are (for titan at least) are drastically different as well as most of the mechanics but this will literally make this the 4th time we've fought Titan. (Titan normal, Titan Hard, Titan EX and now Titan ShB.) And the 3rd Leviathan fight including Levi's Hard and Ex modes. This expansion for me is great because there was so much stuff that was new in the 1st...why go back to things from the past 3 expansions?

3) Most importantly to me, this is a chance for the new raid design team to put their spin on these ARR fights. Titan was a prime example of what the new team feels works for our current playerbase and it's just nuts. Taking the exploding rocks and putting them in new enviornments is just an good example of taking an ARR staple and changing it up.

I remember Yoshi saying this in an interview...that there was a new team or something like that. Once again, that's great and all. They did a really good job but why not just give them something new to work with rather then go back to old content in a completely new expansion?

It's an endless cycle. Omg this is too easy, omg this is too hard pls nerf, omg this is too easy. I wasn't there to witness the Alexander progression, but I've heard the stories. It's what happened when they tried to make it hard.

I felt like the fights were perfect. Challenging but not too difficult once you get the mechanics down. Same as every fight tbh. What makes the fights difficult, for me at least, are the ones with crazy amounts of memorization to the point where it just isn't fun for me. Which is why I don't do savage content. I don't want to watch a 20 minute long video guide and be expected to remember everything from it. lol. Fights like these and even Shinryu normal before it was nerfed were extremely fun to me.

[whiskeybravo]

I felt like the fights were perfect. Challenging but not too difficult once you get the mechanics down. Same as every fight tbh. What makes the fights difficult, for me at least, are the ones with crazy amounts of memorization to the point where it just isn't fun for me. Which is why I don't do savage content. I don't want to watch a 20 minute long video guide and be expected to remember everything from it. lol. Fights like these and even Shinryu normal before it was nerfed were extremely fun to me.

You don't perfect a fight by watching videos..

And it's convenient of you to mention Shinryu, a lv70 story trial that's more challenging than all 4 of these new fights combined.

I don't think they need to be savage level difficult, but these are braindead plain and simple. Leveling dungeons have more mechanics. They are not even close to Stormblood normal modes, you know, the ones where people actually died to things.

[Noitems]

That's cool and all. I see the appeal of how people could be excited about this because the designs are (for titan at least) are drastically different as well as most of the mechanics but this will literally make this the 4th time we've fought Titan. (Titan normal, Titan Hard, Titan EX and now Titan ShB.) And the 3rd Leviathan fight including Levi's Hard and Ex modes. This expansion for me is great because there was so much stuff that was new in the 1st...why go back to things from the past 3 expansions?


I remember Yoshi saying this in an interview...that there was a new team or something like that. Once again, that's great and all. They did a really good job but why not just give them something new to work with rather then go back to old content in a completely new expansion?

My guess for both of these is that ARR currently is almost 6 years old (August 27th 2013), so from now I can consider XIV paying tribute to itself more a given. But the fact Nomura is doing these makes me consider that these primals are designed to be for the First, as if they came from it as opposed to the source. From what Eden has been about it seems like we're actually doing a reverse of what happened to the Burn. Using the primals energies through to revitalize the land with aether as opposed to constantly summoning and draining the aether from the source. The parallels are pretty interesting since many people were speculating what the Burn would look like now with flow from Azim heading back to it. So why not make it more personal with our actions directly affecting The Empty's nourishment through gameplay?

The primals themselves are FF staples , instead of coping out with the same designs they took a totally different angle giving Nomura the original design and I'm assuming the team designing the raid off his work. We know for a fact Nomura designed Gaia without knowing that XIV didn't have a hammer wielding job so it's safe to say with how busy he was that this would probably be the right train of thought.

[Paruza]

On fights, I felt the first fight was a little too unforgiving.

They really need to stop adding 1 shot mechanics to raids with uncoordinated groups, ..., I like to actually play the game.

Comments like those two are pretty disappointing. How many times did you wipe in these fights? 2? 3? 6? My guess is however bad your group was, you cleared the fight. Some very awful groups might disband, but even in the most extreme case, if you are nothing but a liability to your group, you'll still get carried by most groups in DF since the fights do not require everyone do be doing things correctly. These fights aren't even mandatory, they aren't part of the MSQ. This content is easy enouph that there's a pretty good chance you'll kill them on your first pull with a random group (maybe 40%). Do you really want content thats even easier than that? Wiping a few times is *fun*.

I think the raids are too easy. Every random group managed to get the kill after just 1 or 2 tries. This was nice content for one DAY, but not for 3 months. Too many mechanics are nonlethal and basically fluff damage to entertain healers that dont want to DPS.

The normals are always like that though, you just go in and gank them in one or two pulls. It's not content for 3 months anyway, savage comes out in two weeks. Not saying I disagree with you though.

personally I was a bit disappointed. In terms of mechanics the fights are pretty fun except for the first boss which was about as easy as a dungeon boss. But I'm not digging the aesthetics or story.

The fights also having older primals felt lazy instead of thinking of new ideas..

Yeah I agree, it's lazy, I felt like Shadowbringers was a step up in every other way so I was pretty pumped for savage. Once I played through the normals my interested sort of fell off a cliff. Hopefully they will at least be fun fights mechanically.

[Renato]

You don't perfect a fight by watching videos..

And it's convenient of you to mention Shinryu, a lv70 story trial that's more challenging than all 4 of these new fights combined.

I don't think they need to be savage level difficult, but these are braindead plain and simple. Leveling dungeons have more mechanics. They are not even close to Stormblood normal modes, you know, the ones where people actually died to things.

I agree with the watching videos thing but this playerbase, especially a large majority of savage raiders, are adamant that players at least know the fight before doing it and will leave the group after failure. I can count on one hand how many groups I've been in that actually stuck around with new players to learn a fight for a few runs before calling it quits and trying another day. Even when you spend hours waiting for players to join you in PF after stating that it's a learning party, they still leave if they fail. Repeatedly doing something is the best way to master it...in my experience with this game in the last 4 years of playing, it doesn't work so well.

But I disagree with everything else. Most of the leveling content had a few mechanics that you really needed to worry about while the fights here will kill you if you make a mistake. There was a lot of movement, a lot of attacks to watch out for. The first two fights not so much but the last two were pretty interactive. Going in new with a PUG, we died numerous times during the Leviathan fight and that Quake attack down the middle. It's a quick cast so if you're not expecting it, you will die. I think we died 3 times on Titan.

Like I said, the fights aren't hard but they're challenging enough for the first 4 raids of the new expansion for people who don't normally do savage content. I'm sure the next ones will up the ante a bit.

[Gula]

instead of coping out with the same designs they took a totally different angle

Titan already existed by another name though. They were re-using XIII's assets hard this expac from mobs to MCH mecha being a modified trash mob from a junk yard.



Side note. Tinypic is shutting down. RIP fast uploads.