Shadowbringers - How can we fix this?

[Nomuno]

I would like to start this thread by addressing Yoshi-P.

Yoshida-san,

I have played Final Fantasy XIV for a very long time and I've personally praised you on more than one occasions for bringing this glorious game back from the place it came from. To that end, I will always cherish the time I've spent playing, building friendships and bragging about how I feel this MMO has solved the itch that no other MMO has.

Thank You!

With that being said however, I feel like this recent turn of events has left me feeling a little put off by the changes that Shadowbringers has brought. I myself, have played every class up to level 60 at least and some even up to level 70 with Stormblood. I am very much aware of the so called player skill gap between newer and older players such as myself. I have even taken it upon myself to teach those players who have a lesser understanding just to bring them closer to my skill level. Apparently this is not enough to get away from the over casualization of the game.

I don't believe that it is right to essentially bring those players who have taken the time to learn the intricacies of their preferred roles and bring them down to only doing one thing. I'm referring to the healers specifically with this point. I for one was very much so looking forward to the days of seeing myself dole out 4k plus DPS as a Scholar. While this may not be as high as some other players it was a milestone in my own mind. However, with these changes I feel like we'd would be lucky to achieve 1k DPS while maintaining the parties health.

So let's look at this from the newer players perspective for a moment. It is entirely up to that player to determine how much or how little effort they want to put into a game like this. If they want to become better at the job that they play they will put forth that effort. Likewise if they only want to loaf around and just see the sites that's on them.

Taking away the complexity of any job isn't the answer to this conundrum. I am only bringing this up because through your work and the work of your entire team at Square Enix's headquarters in Japan. You have made an HUGE impact on the community at large. That same community that is driven to being the most welcoming of newer players and even returning players. I've never come across another MMO community that has been this "well behaved", most of the time. I can and will acknowledge the faults of the so called "toxic" players out there. Surely though they can't make up the majority of this community?

I'll leave this thread to that same community that I've been talking about. Let them be heard and with a lot of love and a little effort. We can make this expansion the expansion it needs to be.

Look, healers should be healing. Not worried that they do enough DPS. Sorry, I actually agree with the change

Healer complexity has gone down however... Kiss doing deeps good bye

Then play a dps? Stop clamoring about it

[Varushkin]

Look, healers should be healing. Not worried that they do enough DPS. Sorry, I actually agree with the change




Then play a dps? Stop clamoring about it

So you enjoy playing a class that, due to these changes, feels boring? I've seen players like yourself and if healing is all that you want from playing such a role then so be it. It's one thing to play like that in a regular dungeon but to me if the healers can help out in a raid like environment. ergo. primals, 24-mans and the 8-man content. I feel like it's worth feeling like you are pulling your weight on top of healing. Popping off one DoT and maybe spamming one spell like Ruin or Stone isn't enough for me.

[Varushkin]

I'd like to leave this link here in the forum to show what I'm talking about. This link will show the level of play that has been forfeited by "dumbing" down healer play to only healing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r5K4DcigfA

This singular video shows the level of play and complexity that I as a Final Fantasy XIV player love.

[NekoNova]

I'd like to leave this link here in the forum to show what I'm talking about. This link will show the level of play that has been forfeited by "dumbing" down healer play to only healing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r5K4DcigfA

This singular video shows the level of play and complexity that I as a Final Fantasy XIV player love.

Yeah, and that's not the kind of complexity you can enforce in a MSQ/casual run of the game.
Keep that stuff in Savage for people that do Savage.


I personally feel the changes to be good.
I picked up Summoner this expansion, and I'm enjoying the class.
I can keep up with other DPS, and I'm above the tank and healers.


Is my rotation perfect? far from it, and I hope to get better at it as I play more.
The first dungeon in ShB was challenging enough, and with a few tweaks here and there, they did a good Job.

[NanaWiloh]

Yeah, and that's not the kind of complexity you can enforce in a MSQ/casual run of the game.
Keep that stuff in Savage for people that do Savage.


I personally feel the changes to be good.
I picked up Summoner this expansion, and I'm enjoying the class.
I can keep up with other DPS, and I'm above the tank and healers.


Is my rotation perfect? far from it, and I hope to get better at it as I play more.
The first dungeon in ShB was challenging enough, and with a few tweaks here and there, they did a good Job.

Video to me amounted to this.. Spam dmg spell>refresh dot>use CD rinse and repeat yes yes very complex.

[PretzJG]

I'd like to leave this link here in the forum to show what I'm talking about. This link will show the level of play that has been forfeited by "dumbing" down healer play to only healing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r5K4DcigfA

This singular video shows the level of play and complexity that I as a Final Fantasy XIV player love.

If you are going by Momo Sama as he is the one recording this video, he did a total of 5k dps as a healer, was lowest dps for the whole group, and did nothing but spam Broil II and keep his Miasma, Bio II, and Miasma II up, and then mainly let his faerie do the healing, he only cast Galvanize and Succor a grand total of 2 and 3 times. They give a link in the video description for the parse breakdown. And you are saying you WANT more buttons to push for more complexity yet your "level of play and complexity that I as a FFXIV player love" is this simple rotation??

What you are whining about is that you are actually having to do your job and not just leave it to your pet. Look at classic WoW, a healer in there barely did any DPS and that was only if they were geared enough to have the extra time to spare to toss on a DoT. They haven't "dumbed down" healing, they have made it more about actually being the Healer instead of being the DPS who can use a Cure spell. Just like Tanks are actually Tanks again instead only being DPS who can take a hit, cause now they aren't trying to DPS Tank everything and are generating enmity with everything they do so long as they have the Tank Aura on. The only time a Tank doesn't have that aura on is if they are the off tank who is waiting till the tank swap. Also since they took out Diversion they HAVE to actually tank cause DPS and Healers can't reduce their own enmity generation unless they cut back on DPS or Heals. Healers SHOULD be casting mainly healing spells, if they can toss out a damage spell or DoT now and then, great, but keeping people alive if better for the DPS than trying to do the DPS yourself.

[Varushkin]

Have you read the rest of this thread at all? I double checked what you said about Momo and he wasn't the lowest the lowest was the AST.

All of the DPS that both the healers did in that video, if Yoshi-P and his devs are to be believed did nothing but contribute to the entire party. Let's remove the 10k DPS that both of the healers put out. That pulls their combined total output to only 43k DPS. That would most likely cause the entire part to wipe due to a hard enrage.

That is what I'm talking about with the gutting of our healers offensive capabilities. As I said before if Yoshi-P and the devs are to be believed in the regard that Healer DPS isn't accounted for in any content. That doesn't make up for the classes feeling as it has been described. Clunky, sluggish or gimped.

I simply want that capability back and on top of that I feel like if the devs were to put them back in a way to where "older" content feels a bit more engaging.

[Zazay]

Look, healers should be healing. Not worried that they do enough DPS. Sorry, I actually agree with the change

That's what you say. Then there is the huge majority who says that Healers should dps more. What is it now that you want from your healers?