Shadowbringers RDM Wishlist

[Archwizard]

So, I guess with the media tour long concluded and Shadowbringers a mere week away, some parting thoughts for this thread:

I guess a lot of us initially expected more from the changes, owing to the hype of it being the job's first expansion since introduction. Ultimately though, I think most of us can be satisfied that the devs took the opportunity to examine the job, see what works, and attempt to iron out the kinks before adding more to it. While we may disagree with the "how" in some particular cases, and feel disappointed at the lack of growth within the kit, this does mean the devs see the RDM experiment as at least an initial success.

Of course, if you examine the history of other jobs added in expansions, this doesn't preclude us from getting shiny new toys later on. So with that in mind, some hopes for future expansions:

• We have a glaring gap within our kit for an "Oh Sh!t" button. With SMNs now getting a barrier from their Titan-Egis, RDMs are the odd man out amongst caster roles in terms of survivability, particularly with our kit uniquely demanding closed-quarters for short periods. While we do have Vercure, it does cost us both time and resources to cast. While I don't wish for us to get a clone of Manaward or Earthen Armor (as at that point you may as well eliminate Titan-Egi and make Manaward a role action), I do hope we'll have this gap filled with a unique tool befitting RDM's lore and particular style of combat. Likewise, I don't think we should monopolize the field of self-healing and sustainability outside of a raid environment; self-sustainability should be more punishing for a DPS than a core healer (so that each retains their specialities and core efficiencies), but not impossible for someone like a BLM or improbable for a SMN.
• Given the simplicity of the base rotation -- and particularly with it being expected to remain unchanged from the four years since RDM's introduction -- I would not personally be opposed to "shaking it up" in an iterative fashion. With us fast-approaching level 80 content (and potentially 90 by the time this post becomes relevant), I believe there is room for the job to expand into a "easy to pick up, difficult to master" niche. In short: I hope the job becomes harder in future expansions, but in small ways that don't demand too much more from veterans right out of the gate, simply requiring a little more focus. We're the only caster job that has no real responsibilities or obligations within our rotation -- no DoTs, no phases or trances, no AI to micromanage, just building a resource that doesn't diminish and popping it when the bar fills -- and while I don't believe we need to be dumped with two mana-spending DoTs, an Enochian clone and a regular instant proc overnight, I encourage the devs not to be afraid to let the job grow beyond its simple beginnings, since there is still lots of room to create a skill gap within RDM long before we end up as stressful as other jobs. The usual trend of "one or two new additions to the core rotation per expansion" is a good balance.
• I implore the devs to reconsider the purpose of Corps-a-corps and Displacement. The addition of Engagement implies that they are oGCD DPS tools first and mobility tools second, but if our mobility is supposed be what sets us apart from other casters, then we need to be able to hold our mobility tools for use as-needed, rather than spend them at every opportunity for damage and not have them when we need to... move.
• I also think more time should be taken to explore the value of RDM's utility, particularly with regards to its trade-offs for damage. It can be frustrating and disheartening for players to be turned away from raid progression because their job's primary utility (Raising) is a safety net that nobody needs anymore, and their damage can't quite catch up. Now, if RDM had a similar potential to SMN provided players could bridge the skill gap within the job, that would be a different story since it would mean RDMs could still have great value in late stages of progression with practiced hands, but as of now our maximum potential is easy to reach and being held back by our volume of Raises. On a similar note, BLMs are inversely more frequent in the later stages of progression, but only because they could bridge a skill gap. While I don't mean to imply that the playing field between the jobs should be completely flattened, I hope that a more favorable balance can be found between them.
• While I am glad the change to Lucid Dreaming gives us more control of our MP, it's also somewhat disheartening, since it means that RDM's own method of recovering MP is now tied to the same manner as several other jobs via a generic role action, rather than each having their own recovery methods a la BLM and its UI phase. While we're in a functional position right now and it is by no means any priority, I hope this can be reconsidered for the sake of each job's identity in the future.
• Mostly for aesthetic and lore, but please tell me why we have yet to expand into the fields of ice and water magic? It's quite telling that we have two iterations of Thunder and Aero and none of Blizzard yet.

[Zyneste]

Showerthought: It's entirely possible to satisfy the devs' intent for Displacement, while also removing Engagement and keeping players from backstepping off a cliff.

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps. Have an even easier one though. Just move Engagement to level 40, so you get it at the same time as displacement. Have Displace Naturally have 200 potency.

I'd take any OGCD support at this point TBH, but I feel as RDM we should be focused on single target Healing/Mitigation, even on the OGCD. We can't ever really step into the party wide line outside of addle or we start to infringe on Ranged DPS territory. As a personal nitpick I'd rather not have any skill that affects the RDM's Damage or DPS utility. If its mitigation or healing, it should be for the sake of the mitigation/healing. Not for the DPS boost. See Addle while Bahamut is out why this is bad.

You would have thought with the introduction of VerAero/VerThunder into Holy/Flare, they'd make VerAero II/Verthunder II into VerWater/VerBlizzard, to give us actual AOE upgrades since VAII/VTII can be just considered a class tweak and not part of the expansion. I was never a fan of them, but with the new way Holy/Flare work in button placement, theres no reason not to have them.

[Archwizard]

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps.

Why not? BLM's Between the Lines ability runs on exactly the same principle, and the Verfinisher combo actions will similarly replace buttons for a limited window. All of the necessary components for implementation are already there.

[Zyneste]

Why not? BLM's Between the Lines ability runs on exactly the same principle, and the Verfinisher combo actions will similarly replace buttons for a limited window. All of the necessary components for implementation are already there.

Between the lines leaves an Area of effect on the ground. A visible buff with a timer as well. Its not user friendly going from Displacing from the boss to that random spot on the other side of the him 35+ yalms on a larger boss where you had Corpsed 10+ seconds prior.

Where did I corpse from again, inside or outside this aoe? Oh welp wrong choice there.

The way it functions now is fine. Engagement as a advance skill is where the problem is. If it was level 40, there wouldn't be an issue.

[Seraphor]

Except you have a job based on knowing exactly what your mana is after any spell you cast. You might as well just have a button that says 'Adds 24 white/black mana, 45 second cooldown' and it would accomplish the same thing but be clearer and less clunky.

And every job could just have one button that says "Deals 10,000 potency damage, 1 minute cooldown" and every job would be less clunky.
You ask why people keep wanting a DoT, but why are you so against a DoT? What have DoTs ever done to you? I already said a DoT for it's own sake would be unnecessary, but this would actually be a novel mechanic.

And "knowing exactly what your mana will be after every spell", when you're dealing with amounts of 6, 7, 9 and 11... good luck with that.

[Shurrikhan]

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps. Have an even easier one though. Just move Engagement to level 40, so you get it at the same time as displacement.

Honestly, though... why give Displacement potency anyways, instead of just a shorter CD?

Or why not, say, put three charges between both Corps-a-corps and Displacement, each on a 20-second recast, each at 200 potency? You get 100 ppm regardless so long as you don't hold either skill for over a minute. Want in? Okay? Want out? Okay.

You don't need to include a purely bloat skill just to deal with an issue that doesn't need to be an issue in the first place.

As for Displacement's own functionality, I'd just give it and all other back-step skills a similar QoL change: when you hold/lock your camera, you go directly back towards your camera instead of purely back away from the target, to a maximum deviation of movement perpendicular from the target.

[Archwizard]

And every job could just have one button that says "Deals 10,000 potency damage, 1 minute cooldown" and every job would be less clunky.
You ask why people keep wanting a DoT, but why are you so against a DoT? What have DoTs ever done to you?

Honestly, the only defense I've seen for this position that I haven't been able to refute is that people... just... hate DoTs. And just don't want to admit that their opinions are their opinions. 'Cuz then we'd call BS.

And truth is, I totally get that. DoTs are tedious to manage; timers in general are stressful. And don't even get me started on multi-dotting.
RDMs don't have to fight against decaying resources or stances (just proc effects that are overly long for most purposes), and that's a fairly large part of the appeal. It's the reason I swapped to RDM off of BLM, 'cuz I didn't take the stress of having to fight the Enochian timer and the DoT and the boss at the same time very well.

Of course, RDM doesn't have an Enochian or Trance, and the DoT was only a pain for BLM 'cuz their GCD usage is so tight that even popping TC during AF was a loss -- not really RDM problems.
And most people don't seem to get that once you get into the swing of things, a DoT is basically no different behaviorally than a cooldown attack on the GCD. I mean, you generally lose damage as long as a CD goes unpopped (unless it has charges, then only when it's at max), just like you lose damage as long as a DoT remains off the target. Just a different spot on the screen to look at, and something you can't macro onto a "pop all oGCDs" button.

Between the lines leaves an Area of effect on the ground. A visible buff with a timer as well. Its not user friendly going from Displacing from the boss to that random spot on the other side of the him 35+ yalms on a larger boss where you had Corpsed 10+ seconds prior.

Where did I corpse from again, inside or outside this aoe?

Ignoring for a moment that nothing says those markers couldn't be added:

Still sounds preferable to the current iteration, where blindly pressing the button yeets you into the unknown, including off ledges or into exactly the same danger areas you're talking about.
At least in my proposal, you know where you jumped from was safe less than 10 (not 10+) seconds ago (same risk as Raising), and I doubt you'll be doing a 35+ yd jump if the target isn't actively being kited (since you had to cast and Corps within 25).

Unless you think it's harder to remember a relative location for up to 10 sec (more likely 5) than it is to gauge 15 yards on the fly?

Honestly, though... why give Displacement potency anyways, instead of just a shorter CD?

Or why not, say, put three charges between both Corps-a-corps and Displacement, each on a 20-second recast, each at 200 potency? You get 100 ppm regardless so long as you don't hold either skill for over a minute. Want in? Okay? Want out? Okay.

You don't need to include a purely bloat skill just to deal with an issue that doesn't need to be an issue in the first place.

As for Displacement's own functionality, I'd just give it and all other back-step skills a similar QoL change: when you hold/lock your camera, you go directly back towards your camera instead of purely back away from the target, to a maximum deviation of movement perpendicular from the target.

In case 1: because the devs want to compel you to actually use it. As we've discussed before, there is no DPS penalty for casting in melee range, so in a world where Displacement provides no DPS boon, it'll just be flat out ignored except for the rare occasions bosses have "point-blank death radius" or "someone stand here" mechanics. It would be treated as niche at best and bloat at worst, unless there becomes a reason it's preferable to cast at range.

I do love your charge-based proposal. However, I would be concerned with its interaction with Manafication, and once again, the erasure of Displacement if Corps-a-corps becomes a safer alternative.
The only real way I can think of to make that work would be to give Corps-a-corps a minimum range so you can't just point-blank it... and even then there's nothing stopping you from just Displacing and zipping back in the whole fight (not that there's anything preventing that now, I suppose), or depending on the range... just taking a step back and Corpsing.

But if anything, the number of proposals we've come up with in this thread show precisely your point, that a QoL adjustment to Displacement would have easily prevented Engagement from being made.

[Shurrikhan]

I do love your charge-based proposal. However, I would be concerned with its interaction with Manafication, and once again, the erasure of Displacement if Corps-a-corps becomes a safer alternative.

Just have Manafication give a single charge. We generally don't need to backflip-rapid-escape from our melee combo. Or give it none. It was only added to Manafication for QoL convenience that would already become superfluous upon giving them multiple charges.

The only real way I can think of to make that work would be to give Corps-a-corps a minimum range so you can't just point-blank it... and even then there's nothing stopping you from just Displacing and zipping back in the whole fight (not that there's anything preventing that now, I suppose), or depending on the range... just taking a step back and Corpsing.

I don't really see the point, so long as we're going to make it any sort of obligatory APM component at all. Animation-wise, its effectively Shinten. What's wrong with stabbing someone you'd already be close to without having to rush up to them first? You could give it distance-based damage and make a bigger deal out of its tether bit in its animation, but... why bother?

I mean, if you really wanted to make Corps and Disp optional for damage but integral into the kit, you'd just roughly standardize Red (Black + White) Mana's potency efficiency, alike to Samurai's Kenki efficiency. Its made roughly as efficient as your full combo; you just need to buff Enchanted Rip, Zwerch, and Redoublement to even potency increase steps from normal ppgcd as allowed by their Red Mana consumption. Once you get Verflare/Verfire, buff Displacement and Corps by almost the difference, leaving it again just slightly inefficient. There, now you have mobility at minimal cost, and your burst timings are more manipulable, and of course your overall potency is compensated for the 7 potency per second lost.

Or, hybridize: do something more with that Acceleration mechanic. Let RDM "Rush" certain of its cooldowns at Red Mana cost. Assuming, say, every point of Red Mana is worth 5 potency (e.g. if you brought the combo down to 65 or whatever), rushing the (dropped to 100, for easy numbers) potency of either would cost you up to 20 Red to cast again after having literally just used them. Again, they'd lack the further MP generation of Verflare/Verholy, their guaranteed procs, and later Scorch, however, so they're always technically less efficient. Buff them faintly with each further step so their inefficiency remains about the same, so you never feel locked out of your mobility tools.

Personally, I'd love to see the 2-3 Charges and/or the Acceleration.

[Kabooa]

And truth is, I totally get that. DoTs are tedious to manage; timers in general are stressful. And don't even get me started on multi-dotting..

Personally I just find them boring. DoTs are the least imaginative way to add timing constraints to a job. It's all potency in the end. Why not have something -not a DoT- that effectively achieves the same thing. (A singular action that deals greater potency but gated so you don't just spam it)

For example, what we don't have or have too little of.

Delayed Burst - A back end ability that ticks down and deals damage. Like wildfire.

VerFreeze
Spell
30s Recast
Effect: Inflict the enemy with creeping cold for 15 seconds. After 15 seconds, the enemy suffers a flash freeze, taking 450 Ice Potency damage and generating 13 Black Mana.

Trigger Burst - Similar to Delayed Burst, but requires Activation and Detonation

(Since Black Mage stole the ability name)
Mana Surge
Weaponskill
Effect: Inflict latent aether onto an enemy for 45 seconds. If latent Aether is present, deals 100 potency damage, generate 2/2 mana and refreshes Mana Surge's duration. The potency increases by 40 and Mana generated by 1/1 for ever 3 seconds that pass. These bonuses are reset to 0 when Mana Surge is reapplied.

On-Hit Damage - Additional damage to every applicable attack

Biting Blade
Trait
Effect: Upon using Contra Sixte or Fleche, your Weaponskills deal an additional 40 potency per hit for 9 seconds.

Environmental Damage - Creating a foreign object / effect to further interact with the enemy.

VerFlood
Spell
Effect: Create a flood of water 10y behind you that travels 20y forward. The wave deals 180 water potency to enemies it strikes. The wave gains 80 potency for every 5y it travels, and travels 5y approximately every 6 seconds. Enemies can only be struck by flood once per 10 seconds. Only one Flood may be active at a time.

Amplifiers - A foreign object / effect you can target to cast spells into that enhance the overall effect.

Rose Nexus
Ability
Recast: 120s
Effect: Places a Rose Nexus at target location for up to 20s. Rose Nexus is targetable by your spells, storing 110% of the potency of the spells used upon it. Upon absorbing 5 spells, Rose Nexus detonates, causing enemies within 5y to take the stored potency as damage.

[Shurrikhan]

Rose Nexus
Ability
Recast: 120s
Effect: Places a Rose Nexus at target location for up to 20s. Rose Nexus is targetable by your spells, storing 110% of the potency of the spells used upon it. Upon absorbing 5 spells, Rose Nexus detonates, causing enemies within 5y to take the stored potency as damage.

This basically sounds like Impact's animation applied rightly. Nice.