I've kicked players for wearing the wrong gear!

[Chortle]

He should get gear from an npc before making a party suffer.

The game doesn't flat out tell you where these NPCs are tbh. I regularly have to google their locations and didn't even know you could purchase all levels of npc gear until I started leveling crafters.

[NekoNova]

Cool, so you have no problem with a Tank in level 15 Discipline of War gear running Arum Vale.

Good to know.

I don't. Either I pull out Titan when he dies, or I keep him alive as healer.
Been there, done that.
Aurum Vale really isn't the hell hole people make it out to be, not anymore.

[DumdogsWorld]

Aurum Vale really isn't the hell hole people make it out to be, not anymore.

Aurum Vale may or may not have been nerfed or whatever, but the real reason it isn't a hell hole anymore is because so many people are completely overgeared for it.

I always keep the party in progress option ticked when running roulettes. As a result, I can't tell you how many times I've joined runs through this dungeon, only for the other 3 party members to quit. I then sit around, waiting for 3 more people. Then we complete the dungeon without any of the original people who queued for it.

So yeah. There are still parties who can't get past the first boss.

To tie this into the topic at hand, a single party member wearing crap gear seems to be fine and dandy in the eyes of many because it doesn't affect the run much. But when running with random people, who can guarantee that the other 3 party members will be capable of carrying the 4th? What if you end up with 4 people all wearing level 15 gear in the Aurum Vale?

[MrKusakabe]

I am right now, in this very second, in a similar situation:

After I got my Red Mage to 70, I am going to play a bit on my Scholar, who is Level 62, only a bit short of finishing Heavensward (so the cat in red talks to me again...).
Now I read about the last instance being an item level 210 dungeon. Right now, I have 190 on my Scholar, but 230 on my Red Mage (both with mix and match gear because until I finalized my characters, I don't want to bleed my funds away for a few levels). I am really on the edge of spending x00,000 of gil - or use my red mage earrings and jewelry to get over that border.

So far, the wipe was not on my side, and I am doing fine to good, getting MVPs and all that, so I don't see a problem. If we struggle, I voluntary leave it. But before that moment when we constantly wipe - it should be okay, no?

More importantly: Are you really, like REALLY going trough all the people's gear in an instance? That is what makes me think what you would do with a parser...?

Personally for me, I don't think the issue is that I wouldn't be able to beat the content i I think the issue is that I don't want to carry people through the content.

I treat everyone undergeared like I do a tank that is undergeared. It's not *can* we do this, it's "why should I have to put up with you?"

Look, this is a very subjective way to look onto the matter. Imagine you are distracted, let's say the phone rings, or someone talking to you, and you die. I just see you died. Nothing else, no circumstance behind. You ran/stood into an AoE and you drop dead.
Can I now kick you too, because why should I have to revive people like you that can't even walk out of circles? Now you can insert this to any little detail, inconvenience,...

Not that I would do that, but until you are player #1 on the imaginary world rank list, why do you think you are immune to kicks out of the same reason? I rather have a floating threshold of kickings than this strict "He has the wrong ring on the left hand, dat nub, kick him!".

[Nezerius]

Right now, I have 190 on my Scholar, but 230 on my Red Mage (both with mix and match gear because until I finalized my characters, I don't want to bleed my funds away for a few levels). I am really on the edge of spending x00,000 of gil - or use my red mage earrings and jewelry to get over that border.

You could also buy gear with Poetic tomestones. i260 accessories only cost 180 tomestones each. Gil isn't the only way to obtain gear.

Look, this is a very subjective way to look onto the matter. Imagine you are distracted, let's say the phone rings, or someone talking to you, and you die. I just see you died. Nothing else, no circumstance behind. You ran/stood into an AoE and you drop dead.
Can I now kick you too, because why should I have to revive people like you that can't even walk out of circles? Now you can insert this to any little detail, inconvenience,...

You could kick that player, yes. You could also ask them what caused their death.

[Hash_Browns]

I am right now, in this very second, in a similar situation:

After I got my Red Mage to 70, I am going to play a bit on my Scholar, who is Level 62, only a bit short of finishing Heavensward (so the cat in red talks to me again...).
Now I read about the last instance being an item level 210 dungeon. Right now, I have 190 on my Scholar, but 230 on my Red Mage (both with mix and match gear because until I finalized my characters, I don't want to bleed my funds away for a few levels). I am really on the edge of spending x00,000 of gil - or use my red mage earrings and jewelry to get over that border.

So far, the wipe was not on my side, and I am doing fine to good, getting MVPs and all that, so I don't see a problem. If we struggle, I voluntary leave it. But before that moment when we constantly wipe - it should be okay, no?

More importantly: Are you really, like REALLY going trough all the people's gear in an instance? That is what makes me think what you would do with a parser...?




Look, this is a very subjective way to look onto the matter. Imagine you are distracted, let's say the phone rings, or someone talking to you, and you die. I just see you died. Nothing else, no circumstance behind. You ran/stood into an AoE and you drop dead.
Can I now kick you too, because why should I have to revive people like you that can't even walk out of circles? Now you can insert this to any little detail, inconvenience,...

Not that I would do that, but until you are player #1 on the imaginary world rank list, why do you think you are immune to kicks out of the same reason? I rather have a floating threshold of kickings than this strict "He has the wrong ring on the left hand, dat nub, kick him!".

Are you comparing making a mistake to the very basics of having decent iLvl gear for the dungeon?

[SamSmoot]

I don't think purposely wearing the wrong gear should be considered a "playing it your own way."

Besides, it's not like they get kicked for just being ignorant. It's usually their toxic responses that lead to the rest of the party agreeing with it. For example, it could go something like this.

"Hey black mage, why are you wearing strength acessories?"

"They increase my hit chance.".....

One thing WoW did a few years back to eliminate this confusion was to remove do-nothing stats from character sheets.
For example, STR just doesn't show up any more for my Shaman, but if I played a warrior, it would be there.

[Xtrasweettea]

I don't. Either I pull out Titan when he dies, or I keep him alive as healer.
Been there, done that.
Aurum Vale really isn't the hell hole people make it out to be, not anymore.

In 5.0, Titan cannot be targetable by enemies. So, you will need to make a new workaround for this.

Also, yes, Aurum Vale isn’t really a hell hole, it is my favorite ARR dungeon. I used it in my response since it does cause some pains for people.

You may be ok with carrying, but most are not. If the tank cannot tank, there is no reason to have that tank there.

Remember, when you are in a party, you are outsourcing certain duties to other people that can do those duties better than you (in theory). You outsource healing to the healer in the group, since your healing as a SMN is next-to-nothing. The healer outsources most of their DPS responsibly to you, the SMN, since you can execute DPSing better and more efficient than a healer DPSing full time. It would make no sense for a healer to be DPSing full time and making the SMN main heal if both are in the same party.

So, why would it be ok, for you as a SMN, to take over the tanking role, by insourcing that duty from the Tank? You want to be able to freely DPS as a DPS class, which you insourced those responsibilities from the healer and tank. If you now insource tanking, what does the purpose of having that tank around?

It doesn’t matter if it is Aurum Vale with level 15 DoW Gear of Doma with 260 Gear, if you have to completely insource another person’s role, because they don’t have the gear to help do their role, there is no reason for that person to stay in the current party.

Carrying the weak link, due to gear, does nothing more than allow that person to move to the next dungeon in line, thinking everything is fine. That person will run into someone who will kick them, and they will wonder why it was OK for the X number of dungeons be geared as they are, but not now at this higher level dungeon.

[Enjuden]

To all the player who think kicking people who wear under 10 level difference is wrong

I never had a problem doing any of the roles in that dungeon with augmented shire gear pulling from boss to boss with said gear. What's the issue with that dungeon specifically?

Edit: I'm dumb

[JackHatchet]

I am right now, in this very second, in a similar situation:

After I got my Red Mage to 70, I am going to play a bit on my Scholar, who is Level 62, only a bit short of finishing Heavensward (so the cat in red talks to me again...).
Now I read about the last instance being an item level 210 dungeon. Right now, I have 190 on my Scholar, but 230 on my Red Mage (both with mix and match gear because until I finalized my characters, I don't want to bleed my funds away for a few levels). I am really on the edge of spending x00,000 of gil - or use my red mage earrings and jewelry to get over that border.

I feel like you glossed over the two times I went into detail explaining about the questioning process, and how I only kick people who are jerks or walls (Don't respond). You're a good person who looks out for the team. You mentioned you had gearing issues, and you went through the effort to explain that. I can understand that, and you'd get a pass! I'd have to be some kind of jerk to kick you for being a decent person.

What I'm saying (again), is that when I notice people with weird gear. I ask them "hey, why are you decked out in strength accessories on your black mage? That doesn't make sense!" And the response are often "screw you, strength increases my hit chance with spells," or "STR increases the armor percentage on my gear."

Then when I try to correct them--they get hostile and combative. Yes, I know not everyone wants to be critiqued on their terrible gear choices, but since their terrible gear choices are as much my problem as they are their problem. It's my problem, because it LITERALLY affects my game-play. Therefore, I am entitled to have an opinion on it. So I give my opinion, and if they're jerks--I don't sit there and haggle with them. I just kick them. And my party members almost always agree. Therefore I feel justified in my actions. No one wants to party with some self-absorbed bumble-weasel who thinks str means whatever it is they want it to mean.

I play to have fun, and I want to play with fun people. So if they're fun. And they communicate--I can (and will) carry them. It'll be a good ol' time, even if we wipe. But if they're jerks, or they're spewing toxic profanity--then I not only show them the door--I gladly push them out.

---------

As for the guy who says he doesn't see this often. Sure, these things don't often happen organically. You need a compassion for this kind of thing. I'm like the Thanos of kicking people out of groups. But not every group has a Thanos. So you experience only what you encounter or bring to the table. -shrugs-