Healer identity in 5.0

[Gemina]

snip.

I wouldn't call the current state of our healers descent by any means. Functional? Sure. But in a good or even descent state I would have to strongly disagree. Healers aren't even really healers in this game. They are support DPS, and their offensive toolkit is totally braindead. Identity is a strong issue with AST and is currently making any kind of balance impossible; WHM has too many issues to even list here and would need its own thread. All the while SCH is sitting on a throne, legs crossed at the top of the hill saying, "Sup?"

This role has traversed so far beyond the original intent. The amount of ogcd heals is ridiculous, and if they were eliminated, reduced, or given much longer CDs healers would spend more time actually healing. Obviously, they need their offensive toolkits in order to do solo content, but to spend over 90% of their time DPSing in PvE and still call them healers is just crazy. When Yoshi talked about a restructure to healers, I have good feeling of what the man's intentions are.

A big reason why old content at min ilv is much more challenging is because the majority of ogcd heals are stripped away and/or they become much more reliant on hard casted restorative spells. Now having to heal 90% of the time isn't necessarily the answer either, but it needs to be MUCH higher than 10%. Getting to that 50/50 ratio between healing and DPSing would be a comfortable ratio for most healers I believe, and during that 50% that is DPSing they can most certainly make it more interesting than just spamming your filler spell.

You are correct that perfect balance is not really possible. It's a hanging carrot. But healers can most certainly be more balanced than they are currently. Because when WHM has no distinctive advantages over the other two healers things are not only unbalanced, they are unfair. Ramping up WHM DPS is not the answer. Making it easier is not the answer. Adding a 4th healer is most certainly not the answer. The only way to truly balance our healers is rebuilding them from the ground up. I totally agree with Yoshi and we cannot keep up the pure healer/barrier healer set up. Since he has pointed this out specifically, expect it to go away. I think they will still have strong and even more integrative DPS kits, but we will no longer have as much time to use them in group PvE.

[Feidam]

I agree. Healers need to go back to actually having to heal at least 50% of the time in a dungeon. I also like the idea of having to actually cast heals. I miss the days where ogcds were the I need extra healing now, not the standard heals.

[NocturniaUzuki]

Well, I also have no problem with a full ground-up rework of healers, honestly. I just don't think it's terrible the way it is, either.

To put my feelings on the matter into a very short form:

I want healer DPS to remain simple (some change is fine, but no complex rotations please).

I want oGCD usage to still be relevant, but have the damage threat amped up to require actual GCD healing (so we agree 50-50 sounds good to me).

And I want healers to have unique identities which aren't hampered by a pointless attempt to balance everything perfectly.

[Gemina]

I understand what you're saying. I personally really enjoy playing WHM, especially in dungeons and alliance raids. It's a lot of fun. But I still recognize it's flaws and know that it could be so much better than it is right now.

I also agree about no complex DPS rotations. This is a DPS role dynamic that I prefer not to see for healers in this game. It also applies to tanks to a lesser extent but their role with aggro management doesn't apply in the same way a healing requirement does because even when acquiring enmity, they are still causing damage. Just less of it. When I talk about a more interesting means to DPS for healers I'm simply talking about making it more interesting than it is currently. Abilities like Assize is a perfect example that I would like to see more of. WHM is my favorite healer to DPS with. They have Assize which causes damage and heals. They have Holy which causes damage and stun, which in turn mitigates damage. And they have Aero 3 which causes damage and inflicts DoT. Their AoE is solid, and it's their single target that suffers, which in an 8-man scenario is felt the strongest. They can only cast Aero I/II while on the move which is a clipping issue, and if stationary using Aero I/II is a DPS loss.

When it comes to ogcds, I don't really want them pruned, but I think their CD timers need to be increased. Especially for SCH and AST as the healers stand right now. This would give WHM an advantage over them by giving WHM the ability to reduce their ogcd timers and/or the ogcd timers of their co healers. There really is a lot they can do to stitch this thing up, but it just requires the actual time and resources they've been neglecting to give the healer role and it appears it has finally come to pass.

90% DPS uptime NEEDS to go away, and I think Yoshi knows this. Let our healers actually be healers. They have this flexibility because not only is healer DPS not factored into clears, they literally have around 30-40% leeway when it comes to adjusting the healing requirement, which allows them to diversify our healers.

That's how I see things. It might not be the best approach, but at least it's thinking outside the box.

[Felien]

The up time healing on dng and non savege instances for me is ok, because the players levels are all over the place. A tank should do a big pull and use some cds, but since the jump potion, healers having a lot of ogcd and PoD/HoH been a great way to level up. Is more normal they not use a single cd, because now we can brute force their mistakes. And when they know what to do I become a green dps.

But raids are now: no healing at all, then a healer check, back to dps and repeat ( sometimes just need a medica and a succor to top everyone because the game hp recovery do the job). And with the new CS (I don’t like it, but is ok for me this way) there is no risk to go hammer on dps. Plus bosses auto ataque do not much dmg anymore.

The healing today is base on the mistakes of your party members not on the instance. Now we are the green dps.

[Reiryuu]

Someone please provide a source where he specifically says this. I'm not finding anything.

It was said in the Naoki's corner #1, https://www.twitch.tv/videos/399663821 Time stamp ~4:59:00

They talk about job changes and they talk about Paladin and oath stance may be getting some changes, then the woman mentions WHM, they joke about Yoshida sitting between two white mage players and he Hmms and Haaas a bit after saying he's a black mage and then he says 更に使いやすくなるんじゃないかな I guess they'll become even easier to play/use. だっと思います (or so I think/At least I think so). The girl is actually happy with this response. 白は最近ね石しか投げないよね　He then jokes about how all WHMs can do now is throw rocks -_-;

That sounds more like he is joking around and not revealing the whm changes vs seriously stating they are making the whm easier.

He is definitely not joking around when he says the part about making the white mage easier to use. But, yes, he's really not revealing anything by saying that. But the tone of his voice is serious, so it is a serious answer. It's not a sure answer maybe he's not fully sure of the details himself, as he does say "or so I think" afterwards. But this is basically an ask me anything discussion about jobs, so he is being serious before the jokes about the rock throwing.

Sorry about the edits. I've been playing it back and forth a few times to make sure I'm hearing what he's saying correctly and trying to get more of the context but that's all there really is.

Surely he means easier to cast & moving (and maybe more protect/barrier abilities to avoid to only play the "reactive" way). If not, I don't see what it could be.

It could mean just about anything and it really depends on who is the one "using" the whm? Is it going to be easier to use it in a raid? Easier for the player to control? We assume the latter and I'm sure that's the answer that's implied, but what that involves, it's anyone's guess really. It could be wonderful, it could be a hot pile of garbage it could just be... "meh." We won't know till May and that's a long time to let anxiety build up again to explosive levels should the news not be good.

[Feidam]

It was said in the Naoki's corner #1, https://www.twitch.tv/videos/399663821 Time stamp ~4:59:00

They talk about job changes and they talk about Paladin and oath stance may be getting some changes, then the woman mentions WHM, they joke about Yoshida sitting between two white mage players and he Hmms and Haaas a bit after saying he's a black mage and then he says 更に使いやすくなるかな I guess they'll become even easier to play. He then jokes about how all WHMs can do now is throw rocks -_-;

That sounds more like he is joking around and not revealing the whm changes vs seriously stating they are making the whm easier.

[Ceasaria]

Surely he means easier to cast & moving (and maybe more protect/barrier abilities to avoid to only play the "reactive" way). If not, I don't see what it could be.

[tesni_g]

Surely he means easier to cast & moving (and maybe more protect/barrier abilities to avoid to only play the "reactive" way). If not, I don't see what it could be.

I'm really hoping it's this, and that perhaps something is getting lost in translation. When I heard "easier to play" I thought, what? mash 1 button over and over again until I win?

But "easier to use" could be something along these lines, where the job has tools to navigate every encounter.

[number473]

Whatever the changes that they decide to make, there needs to be a long discussion and explanation about what they are going to do when they go over class changes in May. There's no way I (and I think many of us) are going to be satisfied with them spending 5 minutes covering the whole of what they want to do with healers and brushing it off like it's no big deal. And I really want to hear about what they are thinking and what they are trying to do with the changes that they are making.