Gender locked race?

[Alesone]

Would he want to set people up with misplaced expectations though? I just find it hard to believe he didn't realize how risky it would be letting the playerbase think "oh, cool we're probably getting male Viera!" just to be told at the next fanfest, "oh hey, guess what? You're not getting male Viera. But you can have this entirely different race we thought up that you didn't ask for and didn't know anything about till right this moment instead. Please look forward to it."


Sounds like a recipe for disaster. I know SE fumbles a lot, but I'd think Yoshi himself would know better than to pull something like that. :v I could be wrong though, he could have done an oppsie. I just find it hard to believe.

He isn't setting people up for misplaced expectations, he's deliberately not dropped any hints that they're actually coming. He's either avoided answering all together, or pointed to lore that if anything, points to them not coming more so then them actually coming. If people are expecting male viera after everything then that's really not his fault, and I have a hard time finding the choice to be risky at all, it's no more risky than how they implemented Blue Mage or any other kind of questionable design decisions for other content.

Just because some people will be upset by the decision doesn't mean it's actually a risky business move.

Nobody asked for Au Ra either yet they're one of the most played races, so saying something like "here's a race you didn't ask for" doesn't really hold any weight. We didn't know anything of substance about the Au Ra either until april right before Heavensward launched either, all we knew was their name and what they looked like, a pretty low bar if you ask me.

[Lacan]

The only misplaced expectations are from those who picture Viera men as being completely different to how they're described. Furthermore, although this thread is very active it isn't at all a reflection of the overall community. From what I've seen elsewhere, most people don't feel strongly about the subject. Viera were always presented as a female only race and whilst it would be nice to see the men in FFXIV, there's no guarantee that it'll happen.

Furthermore, if Hrothgar are added then they'll serve as a counterpart to Viera. They may not be to everybody's tastes, though they'll have their fans. They may even end up being better than Viera men - which isn't a hard feat given how some players are picturing them...

Ultimately, so long as they're not child-like I'll be content.

I disagree with the notion that this isn't something the community cares about. People cared enough about genderlocks to get male miqote and female roegadyn added to the game with ARR. I see the same thing happening again if SE decides to launch ShB with two genderlocked races of all things. I get that you aren't very invested but plenty of other people are. You gotta keep in mind that a lot of people in the community aren't even aware of the leaks and that whether we'll get male Viera or not is up in the air. Once we know for sure we aren't getting them, you can expect to hear a lot more voices upset about it.

[Lacan]

He isn't setting people up for misplaced expectations, he's deliberately not dropped any hints that they're actually coming. He's either avoided answering all together, or pointed to lore that if anything, points to them not coming more so then them actually coming. If people are expecting male viera after everything then that's really not his fault, and I have a hard time finding the choice to be risky at all, it's no more risky than how they implemented Blue Mage or any other kind of questionable design decisions for other content.

Just because some people will be upset by the decision doesn't mean it's actually a risky business move.

Nobody asked for Au Ra either yet they're one of the most played races, so saying something like "here's a race you didn't ask for" doesn't really hold any weight. We didn't know anything of substance about the Au Ra either until april right before Heavensward launched either, all we knew was their name and what they looked like, a pretty low bar if you ask me.

I don't think you understand what risky means. :v If it is something that will upset a portion of the fanbase, that makes it risky. Whether Yoshi intentionally worded his answer in a specific way, you'd think he'd be aware of the fact people would expect male Viera as a result. Taking those expectations and giving them something else entirely is very risky.

The problem isn't that the race wasn't asked for. The problem is that people were expecting something else and they get Hrothgar as a substitute. Back when Au Ra were announced, people weren't expecting anything specific. The new race was entirely up in the air. We just had Yugiri to speculate about. Right now though, we know female Viera are coming, which begs the question: "where are the male Viera?" How Yoshi answers that question at the next fanfest is going to have a big effect on the community.

[Fland]

Furthermore, if Hrothgar are added then they'll serve as a counterpart to Viera. They may not be to everybody's tastes, though they'll have their fans. They may even end up being better than Viera men - which isn't a hard feat given how some players are picturing them...

No matter how good the Hrothgar is people will still demand the male Viera, and it won't stop until SE caves in. Especially if there is male Viera NPC in game. And I honestly can't think of any reason we won't be meeting one if we will go to the woods in 5.0 without it being sound forced or ridiculous, like there's fire that's somehow eradicated the entire male even though they survived a Garlean attack before, which surely involved some fire.

[Alesone]

I don't think you understand what risky means. :v If it is something that will upset a portion of the fanbase, that makes it risky.

That makes everything they do risky then. Because everything they add or don't add upsets some portion of the playerbase. Continue the typical patch content cycle? people get upset. Add new types of content? People get upset. Try something new with a new type of job? People get upset.

This decision (if it happens), is no more risky than half the other stuff they've attempted, and is in fact less so, because regardless of what the potential new male race is, people are going to play it, and probably a lot at that.

Whether Yoshi intentionally worded his answer in a specific way, you'd think he'd be aware of the fact people would expect male Viera as a result. Taking those expectations and giving them something else entirely is very risky.

Of course he's aware people expect and want male Viera, just like he was aware of people who were expecting and wanted a Samurai tank, or a Dark Knight DPS job. All his decisions will break some people's expectations, he's certainly aware of that when/if he made the decision to potentially genderlock Viera.

And again, it's really not "very" risky.

The problem isn't that the race wasn't asked for. The problem is that people were expecting something else and they get Hrothgar as a substitute. Back when Au Ra were announced, people weren't expecting anything specific. The new race was entirely up in the air. We just had Yugiri to speculate about. Right now though, we know female Viera are coming, which begs the question: "where are the male Viera?" How Yoshi answers that question at the next fanfest is going to have a big effect on the community.

People expected Blue Mage as a normal job and got a limited job instead. And as I mentioned before, people expected some jobs to be certain roles, or expected certain jobs to only get different jobs instead. This is the way of how the game goes.

It will have a small but loud effect on the community, and the majority of players will go on their way as if nothing changed. People seem to be grossly overstating the effect this decision would have.

[Theodric]

I disagree with the notion that this isn't something the community cares about. People cared enough about genderlocks to get male miqote and female roegadyn added to the game with ARR. I see the same thing happening again if SE decides to launch ShB with two genderlocked races of all things. I get that you aren't very invested but plenty of other people are. You gotta keep in mind that a lot of people in the community aren't even aware of the leaks and that whether we'll get male Viera or not is up in the air. Once we know for sure we aren't getting them, you can expect to hear a lot more voices upset about it.

A fair few people said the exact same thing about Eureka, BLU and the server split. It didn't take long for those controversies to die down. Not getting Viera men may be a deal breaker for some, though I'm not convinced that it's going to blow up as badly as some here are suggesting.

[Lacan]

A fair few people said the exact same thing about Eureka, BLU and the server split. It didn't take long for those controversies to die down. Not getting Viera men may be a deal breaker for some, though I'm not convinced that it's going to blow up as badly as some here are suggesting.

Eureka, blue mage, and the server split aren't as big a deal as this. You obviously want to downplay it and I won't try to convince you otherwise, I'll just say wait for Japan fanfest.

No matter how good the Hrothgar is people will still demand the male Viera, and it won't stop until SE caves in. Especially if there is male Viera NPC in game. And I honestly can't think of any reason we won't be meeting one if we will go to the woods in 5.0 without it being sound forced or ridiculous, like there's fire that's somehow eradicated the entire male even though they survived a Garlean attack before, which surely involved some fire.

You get it at least. XD Trying to explain why this is a big deal to people who just don't care to begin with is a wasted effort. If they can't see the kind of shit storm this will result in by now they'll just have to see it for themselves I guess.

[Theodric]

Eureka, blue mage, and the server split aren't as big a deal as this.

I strongly disagree with that assessment. This thread, for instance, has over two hundred pages and yet most of it is just back and forth debate between the same handful of posters. This forum isn't a great representation of the overall community since only a small portion of players actually post here in the first place. Many more players post on the FFXIV Reddit page, yet there's no active threads there regarding the issue. All the discussion there surrounding Viera men died down pretty quickly. It's not the make or break scenario for as many players as is being implied here.

As I've said earlier, I think gender locked races/jobs are a silly design approach. Yet I also think people are setting themselves up for disappointment given how Viera men are described within the game itself. If they aren't added, Hrothgar will mitigate the backlash significantly. With any luck, they'll be designed nicely - and may even be much more interesting than Viera men altogether.

[Gwenorai]

No matter how good the Hrothgar is people will still demand the male Viera, and it won't stop until SE caves in. Especially if there is male Viera NPC in game. And I honestly can't think of any reason we won't be meeting one if we will go to the woods in 5.0 without it being sound forced or ridiculous, like there's fire that's somehow eradicated the entire male even though they survived a Garlean attack before, which surely involved some fire.

Don't forget that if the Viera is genderlocked; then Hrothgar would have simply been added due to the developers - or rather Yoshida and possibly Yasumi - not wanting male Viera seen because of the idea that rabbit men are weird; a backwards viewpoint in this day and age. So, we're going to have a race right off the bat - unlike Viera; where males were considered and we have evidence of this - that was created to be genderlocked straight out of the gate. Any lore they add for Hrothgar is going to have them be with that imagery in mind.

That's what really boils my parsnips - creating a 'limited' race because of one archaic view that needs to bugger off. I'd be less steamed if Hrothgar wasn't genderlocked - least it's less half-arsed and not some sort of repeat of Gelka.

[Lauront]

Whether or not one agrees with the devs' views, it is their game ultimately. I don't think such views are inherently "backwards" - they simply represent a different value/preference set. I would prefer that they don't gender lock the race, as I don't like gender locks as a rule, but if they do not want male Viera added to the game, that is their choice. Those who feel strongly enough about it will unsub, the rest will grumble and continue playing since there's other options that meet their preferences.

Now, would I be over the moon if they added Viera to my tastes? Yes, absolutely.