Server of Freedom

[Vanitas]

Man I wish my brain worked like that.

[Gleipni]

What i meant by free speach,is to be able to talk about game related stuff without the fear to be ban,even more with the new ToS,not to talk about anything outside the game.

What come in minde is the "you can't completly reject someone opinion opinion" like what ? i should say nothing the BLm that play only ice and make MY play experience bad ?not only mine but the 3 other person in dungeon ? or7 in raid ?

that we cant say to someone that he is playing bad,we can just kick him without reason ?

For me,a server where you could tell to someone what you think about everything game related would just make the comunity better,people would just be frank and say whats wrong,because right now,you cant be honnest with people,you cant make any critic.

I want a server like to be able to say "you are playing it wrong you are a burden for the group" without having SJW telling i should shut up and carry him through

And,it would allow to separate "toxic" people from the rest,well,people that speak frankly,like this on other server,you wouldnot have those people.

[Vidu]

What i meant by free speach,is to be able to talk about game related stuff without the fear to be ban,even more with the new ToS,not to talk about anything outside the game.

What come in minde is the "you can't completly reject someone opinion opinion" like what ? i should say nothing the BLm that play only ice and make MY play experience bad ?not only mine but the 3 other person in dungeon ? or7 in raid ?

that we cant say to someone that he is playing bad,we can just kick him without reason ?

For me,a server where you could tell to someone what you think about everything game related would just make the comunity better,people would just be frank and say whats wrong,because right now,you cant be honnest with people,you cant make any critic.

I want a server like to be able to say "you are playing it wrong you are a burden for the group" without having SJW telling i should shut up and carry him through

And,it would allow to separate "toxic" people from the rest,well,people that speak frankly,like this on other server,you wouldnot have those people.

But you can tell someone that they should improve or are making mistakes - you just cant be a jerk about it? As long as you are polite, dont insult anyone and dont bring up that you've been parsing and that their numbers are sh*t, nothing is gonna happen to you, not even with this "change" in the ToS.

Even if someone reports you over some advice you gave, as long as that advice was presented in a polite, non insulting manner, you wont get banned or punished over it - I'm pretty sure the GMs can tell polite advice from harrassment.
You can be honest with people, you can critic them, you can give advice - you just cant be a jerk over it.

I dont understand why people dont get this... you're making mountains out of molehills, claiming you dont have "freedom of speach" when the only thing you dont have is the freedom to be a jerk.

[Gleipni]

But you can tell someone that they should improve or are making mistakes - you just cant be a jerk about it? As long as you are polite, dont insult anyone and dont bring up that you've been parsing and that their numbers are sh*t, nothing is gonna happen to you, not even with this "change" in the ToS.

Even if someone reports you over some advice you gave, as long as that advice was presented in a polite, non insulting manner, you wont get banned or punished over it - I'm pretty sure the GMs can tell polite advice from harrassment.
You can be honest with people, you can critic them, you can give advice - you just cant be a jerk over it.

I dont understand why people dont get this... you're making mountains out of molehills, claiming you dont have "freedom of speach" when the only thing you dont have is the freedom to be a jerk.

Doubt,i already tried to be polite,do it with tact etc...people just insulted me,gave me the "you dont pay my sub,i play how i want",there is a reason why i had that idea,and when you are in a grou of 8 in a raid,someone is not doing his job,burdening the group,you try to ask him,and he treat you like shit,no i have no patience anymore.

[Vidu]

Doubt,i already tried to be polite,do it with tact etc...people just insulted me,gave me the "you dont pay my sub,i play how i want",there is a reason why i had that idea,and when you are in a grou of 8 in a raid,someone is not doing his job,burdening the group,you try to ask him,and he treat you like shit,no i have no patience anymore.

People not listening and insulting you instead has nothing to do with the ToS or "Freedom of Speach" though - or do you assume that people would be more likely to take your advice if you'd be the one insulting them?

I totally get your frustration, but what you are proposing isnt gonna fix the problem of people not wanting to improve, not listening to advice and being a burden to the group. The only thing you'd achieve is being able to yell at those people and harrass them without consequens and that isnt a productive solution to the problem and wont help anyone.

You didnt thought this idea through, I'm afraid - it wont help with your problem in the slightest.
Just keep at giving polite and friendly advice and remove those who dont want to take it and start to insult you - heck, make use of the ToS yourself and report people who react in a harrassing way towards polite advice! Having "freedom of speach" and being able to either yell at people or tell them parser-numbers wont change the behaviour of those who dont want to improve - most likely, it will only make matters worse.

[Penthea]

Doubt,i already tried to be polite,do it with tact etc...people just insulted me,gave me the "you dont pay my sub,i play how i want",there is a reason why i had that idea,and when you are in a grou of 8 in a raid,someone is not doing his job,burdening the group,you try to ask him,and he treat you like shit,no i have no patience anymore.

Regardless of how correct you are in how they should be playing, you are not their teacher, parent or boss. Just because you think you're better at the game doesn't give you the right to tell someone what to do and expect them to be okay with it. You don't pay their sub. They don't have to listen to you. Especially if you give advice they didn't ask for.

Similarly they don't pay your sub, so you are not obligated to deal with them. If they're not receptive to what you're saying then just leave the group or kick them, if your patience is as thin as you claim. Don't waste your time with someone who won't listen. Problem solved. Move on.

I really hate using this word in this context, but this is some serious snowflake stuff. "I can't criticise people without being at risk of them not liking it and then be rude to me. We need a special server so I can tell people what to do without any backlash." And what's hilarious is you claim this server is for freedom of speech, but it's freedom of speech only on your terms, because judging from your first post people wouldn't be free to tell you to buzz off if they don't want to listen to what you want to say.

[TheMightyMollusk]

If someone isn't listening to polite advice, they're not likely to listen to rude advice, either. Throwing some F-bombs or insults into a statement does not make it suddenly more compelling.

[Sigma-Astra]

People were asking for rp server, so why not freedom of speech?

I mean, a server where we could freely speak about parse, have some constructive critic without getting insult, or with the new TOS, get ban.

Just an idea,tell me the pro and cons.

I don't think you understand what "freedom of speech" actually is or means. You're already expressing it here and now. Freedom of speech means that you are free to express any sort of opinion without censorship or restraint by the government within certain limits.

It does not mean that you get to be a butt inside of an MMO without dealing with the potential consequences of being a butt towards other people nor does it mean that other people should treat your opinion as the holy grail.

We all signed the ToS to play XIV, we have to play by their rules. They don't owe us anything and unfortunately, it's either keep the ball in their court, or they restrict you from playing the game which is looked upon as a luxury service.

[Gleipni]

I don't think you understand what "freedom of speech" actually is or means. You're already expressing it here and now. Freedom of speech means that you are free to express any sort of opinion without censorship or restraint by the government within certain limits.

It does not mean that you get to be a butt inside of an MMO without dealing with the potential consequences of being a butt towards other people nor does it mean that other people should treat your opinion as the holy grail.

We all signed the ToS to play XIV, we have to play by their rules. They don't owe us anything and unfortunately, it's either keep the ball in their court, or they restrict you from playing the game which is looked upon as a luxury service.

I never said,they owe the game,it was just an idea,but seeing all the people butt hurt,seems like its just a dead idea

[Vidu]

I never said,they owe the game,it was just an idea,but seeing all the people butt hurt,seems like its just a dead idea

No one is "butt hurt" - you were asking for Pros and Cons for your idea and it seems that the majority of people here found more Cons than Pros.

To sum some up in a little list:

Pros
- we could talk openly about parsing (even though obviously no one never ever is parsing)
- People could roleplay as cursing pirates in Limsas shout chat

Cons
- ...in a way we can already talk openly about parsing - as long as we make sure it stays in a group of friends/people we know
- harrassment, insults, sexual advances... all of those things would suddenly be "okay" and non-reportable
- we are already able to speak freely, as long as we keep common courtsey in mind and stay polite and friendly
- not giving friendly advice, yelling at people and insulting them wont make them take your advice

It seems to me - specially after your answer to my post - that you came up with this idea under the missconception that once such a server would be established everyone would listen to your advice when there is actually no connection between people taking your advice and some sort of freedom in your way to express said advice, specially because right now you have every freedom to give advice, you just cant get rude.

Actually, I feel a server were anyone could just say anything without consequences might actually be rather hurtful to your goal here. It stops people in no way from disregarding your advice with the same stuff (or worse) than they have been so far.
You also need to consider that servers usually share datacenters (unless you want a whole datacenter without rules or isolate the server), so in any instances... what rules apply? Is it only okay for the people from Freedom to curse? Is everyone allowed to curse? Is no one allowed to curse? Can we just kick the Freedom-player if we dont want to listen to their obscenities?

Sorry, the only good thing that can emerge from this are cursing pirates in Limsa.