Would you raid if there was no ilvl?

[azura84]

I think I should have worded my question better, when I said no ilvl restrictions, I meant as if gear progression wasn't a thing so raiding was always on skill alone. But I think the answer would have been the same.

Item level has never been a stat to base the "this pointy stick is better than that pointy stick" by, stats on each weapon vary and BiS is not so simple as just getting the weapon with the highest ilvl, although it's a good basis if you're not interested in trying to learn the stats. Really all Ilvl does is, as you said "the answer is the same", it applies a way for the game to restrict/filter matchmaking as we discussed.

[HyoMinPark]

I think I should have worded my question better, when I said no ilvl restrictions, I meant as if gear progression wasn't a thing so raiding was always on skill alone. But I think the answer would have been the same.

For me personally, my answer would be the same—I would not raid with randoms if it was just based on skill alone, simply because I find the overall skill level of the playerbase to be fairly low. So I would do as I stated earlier: find friends or a static to run the content with. Which is what I tend to do now for Savage because I have less time to play now, so I can’t spend hours wiping in 10S or 11S because people are dying too much or failing to meet enrage; Extremes I try to bring at least 1 or 2 of my friends so I can have 1 or 2 other good players in the group with me.

[AxlStream]

iLvl can already be bypassed if you're in a full party. What's your point? Would I use DF to do Savage and Extreme? HELL NO! DF is the place where my Warrior is 2nd DPS in Suzaku normal. Don't want to see it in Savage.

[LineageRazor]

iLvl can already be bypassed if you're in a full party. What's your point? Would I use DF to do Savage and Extreme? HELL NO! DF is the place where my Warrior is 2nd DPS in Suzaku normal. Don't want to see it in Savage.

OP addressed this:

I think I should have worded my question better, when I said no ilvl restrictions, I meant as if gear progression wasn't a thing so raiding was always on skill alone. But I think the answer would have been the same.

So, basically, like Palace of the Dead or PvP. You can go in wearing whatever you want or nothing at all; your stats are determined entirely by the content you're participating in. If your party's wiping to enrage, better gear won't solve the problem, because gear has no effect.

I doubt this would have an effect, positive or negative on my participation in Savage or Extreme content. I'm more in it for the interesting fights, rather than for the equipment drops - but at the same time, it's nice that less-skilled individuals can "catch up" by improving their gear. Since I depend on a team to progress, armor-as-a-crutch makes it easier to find folks capable of clearing the content.

[Magnedeus]

Wipes. You would get lots of wipes.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

As someone who does enjoy joining random pugs just for the fun of it, the absence of an ilvl would indirectly have me raid more since most PFs wouldn't have a two coffer demand nor would we have the silly loot restriction system we currently do. That being said, the sheer amount of people who would join parties while being woefully under prepared would be astonishing. I've seen people queue in with dungeon gear or others who think Savage is just a slight bump up from Normal Mode. If the pool diluted too much, I can't say I'd have much fun anymore.

[Marxam]

As someone who is currently forced to pug through content, working on o10s clear, ilvl is poor representation of skill and more of a representation of daily log-ins. I've been in groups with people who have higher gear than me yet seem to under perform, examples include dying often, getting hit by mechanics, etc. I understand that a lot of people carry their friends through content but I unfortunately don't have that luxury. I'm a solo player in a really casual FC that want's to do end-game hardcore content for the glamour but don't have the friends or like minded players to do so. I also like my FC so no reason to quit either.

I only raid for glamour and since the rush of doing hard content is non existent, given the amount of scripted, team jump-rope, raid design, the only real rush I get is from skipping mechanics or seeing things like phase pushing. I've pug'd through Deltascape and plan to do so in Alphascape. The fact that I raid for glamour means that ilvl has no impact on me but does affect my progress when I have to sift through tons of garbage PF groups. No ilvl's would probably see that number increase as well as the number of people that have been carried. While I hate how ilvl works now I doubt SE is willing to put in the work to find a better solution.

[JunseiKei]

Out of curiosity after a discussion with a friend, if there was no ilvl barring you from entering any current end game content - extreme trial or savage, would you be attempting it more frequently, less frequently or not at all and why?


If the rewards were mounts, titles, minions, gear with different status or tokens you could exchange for other gear of same ilvl would you still try to push such content?

The encounters would need to completely change before I'd consider this. As it were, without an ilvl, a 10-minute enrage would probably not work. Without a means to pinpoint a way behind failed enrages if it were kept (this is not a pro-parser statement), then you cannot even try to rectify the issue. However, this doesn't mean I particularly want to have a 10 minute fight stretched into 20-30 minutes or more because enrages were removed and it simply became a fight of attrition.

The ilvl guarantees that the content you are in, you have a chance of clearing (even if they die a lot - people do learn mechanics/fights at different rates). If the ilvl is done away with, what's the chance of someone bringing in a weathered weapon (ilvl1) and trying to clear it? I bet at least one person would try it.

So, in all likeliness, no. I'd probably drop out of raiding completely or only continue with a select few called a static. If there's no gear, I doubt my current static would even want to do it, though.

[Sunako]

Yes, if dps checks would be similar than with current bis gear. Allow few deaths and still can clear the content. Ultimate theoretically is already like that, all you just get shiny weapon and tittle and it not matter even if your ilvl is 400 there.

[MomomiMomi]

This would slightly improve my desire to raid.

Gear progression is pointless in this game. Gear rewards are boring, because they have little to no longevity. It's been a major complaint of mine about this game for a long time now. I prefer vanity rewards over gear. Glamour, mounts, minions, housing, and unique crafting materials to make said things.

That said, the biggest obstacle to me raiding is actually people. I don't have enough people to do these things regularly with, and so I must PUG. That's not only less fun, but also kind of dreadful at times.

Plus my internet connection's been garbage these past couple of months. That's not helping.