Regarding that Finaland Interview...

[OurMom]

And how are you supposed to click on a door if you're not subbed? That was also part of the question.

Apartments don't demo if you unsub, so if you wanted to take a break like the guy is asking then you're fine.

You're treating the matters of the heart as if it was a fault.

I'm not but it's been how many years has it been? They obviously can not just implement more housing so if it's that important to you, go to where housing is available.

You can advocate that the only things in housing that matters should be utility

I don't know how many times I have to explain this, I'm not advocating for anything me listing those things are actual features of other games. Those are things where housing is legitimately needed and if everyone couldn't get it, it would be a problem and if a dev said what Yoshi said then, in that situation then yep he's definitely out of touch.

I fail to see how it's on people when that's basically one of the goals in mind when Yoshida created housing.

He didn't create housing for everyone to have one, he intentionally created housing for FCs and then said he was going to add separate personal housing.

[Skivvy]

He didn't create housing for everyone to have one, he intentionally created housing for FCs and then said he was going to add separate personal housing.

IIRC, personal housing was supposed to be separate from FC housing, but it isn't, and so we have the hot mess that we know as XIV's housing. I'm a big fan of instanced housing. Even with instanced housing, I've seen games that still allow you to have neighbors/friends in your instance (RIP Wildstar). As it is now, housing wards are pretty pointless. They're huge, and mostly dead - even on Balmung.

[JunseiKei]

IIRC, personal housing was supposed to be separate from FC housing, but it isn't, and so we have the hot mess that we know as XIV's housing. I'm a big fan of instanced housing. Even with instanced housing, I've seen games that still allow you to have neighbors/friends in your instance (RIP Wildstar). As it is now, housing wards are pretty pointless. They're huge, and mostly dead - even on Balmung.

Yeah, it was, wasn't it? I observed that FC houses weren't exactly selling hotly. Very few large houses (and when you have a large, active FC that actually did want to hang out, a small quickly became cramped feeling). There were more mediums than larges and they were an OK middle ground, but small houses were not really wanted for active and large FCs. Also, houses cost a lot back then. Not like now where gil rains from the heavens or legacy servers that kept their gil. A small was 5m - pretty hard to get back then when dungeons didn't drop any gil at all; 200k was considered rich. Larges were as high as 87m. I'd guess our current apartments were set up to be that affordable, separate personal housing, but because Yoshida didn't want the wards to stay as vacant as they were then, he just opened them up to FC and personal. That's just my speculation, though.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Yeah, it was, wasn't it? I observed that FC houses weren't exactly selling hotly. Very few large houses (and when you have a large, active FC that actually did want to hang out, a small quickly became cramped feeling). There were more mediums than larges and they were an OK middle ground, but small houses were not really wanted for active and large FCs. Also, houses cost a lot back then. Not like now where gil rains from the heavens or legacy servers that kept their gil. A small was 5m - pretty hard to get back then when dungeons didn't drop any gil at all; 200k was considered rich. Larges were as high as 87m. I'd guess our current apartments were set up to be that affordable, separate personal housing, but because Yoshida didn't want the wards to stay as vacant as they were then, he just opened them up to FC and personal. That's just my speculation, though.

Larges went up to 200 million, smalls were 15 on some servers.

[SenorPatty]

Apartments don't demo if you unsub, so if you wanted to take a break like the guy is asking then you're fine.

Houses do.



I'm not but it's been how many years has it been? They obviously can not just implement more housing so if it's that important to you, go to where housing is available.

Okay but I'm not vouching for that sort of suggestion. Nor did I mention it so I don't know why you're bringing this up to the discussion of people who already have a house, want to take a break from their sub but don't want relocate their belongings to an apartment.

You know, like Yoshida did.



I don't know how many times I have to explain this, I'm not advocating for anything me listing those things are actual features of other games. Those are things where housing is legitimately needed and if everyone couldn't get it, it would be a problem and if a dev said what Yoshi said then, in that situation then yep he's definitely out of touch.

You've repeated many times to others that other things in the game matter because they're needed but housing isn't. Again, what matters in the game, at some point, has a different value for everyone else. If you wan't argue fact for fact what is needed, we'd be stripping the game pretty barebone. You've repeated many times that it's on people if they have attachment to housing as if they were at fault. You're advocating that housing shouldn't matter because it's not needed.



He didn't create housing for everyone to have one, he intentionally created housing for FCs and then said he was going to add separate personal housing.

And why did he create seperate personal housing? Because it was requested. Why was it requested? Because people wanted it. What's an mmo company's main aim? To aim to please and go after their desires. I don't even know why I had to explain that.

At this point, I'm not even sure what you're trying argue here as you're pulling other argument points from just to supplement your viewpoint that housing's not needed. A lot of things in the game is not needed. Heck as you even pointed out, the game should've just run on msq and gear progression because that's what's needed to go further. But SE did not stop at just that because realistically, that would've failed. They added a boat load of stuff because like any smart gaming company that creates mmos, the more features you have in the game, even the optional ones, the more you can reel in and possibly keep. The responsibility to make sure those optional features are up to standards go to the ones who make it.

If you feel Yoshida isn't out of touch because, as you like mentioning, it's on people for valuing optional content in the game and him making apathetic statements that further riles up people who value that content, then you and I have nothing further to discuss. If you want to explore and/or discuss realistic suggestions that could be made to housing in the game, other than trying to redirect players into leaving their houses to go to an apartment, I'm right here.

[Vahlnir]

At this point, I'm not even sure what you're trying argue here as you're pulling other argument points from just to supplement your viewpoint that housing's not needed. A lot of things in the game is not needed. Heck as you even pointed out, the game should've just run on msq and gear progression because that's what's needed to go further. But SE did not stop at just that because realistically, that would've failed. They added a boat load of stuff because like any smart gaming company that creates mmos, the more features you have in the game, even the optional ones, the more you can reel in and possibly keep. The responsibility to make sure those optional features are up to standards go to the ones who make it.

If you feel Yoshida isn't out of touch because, as you like mentioning, it's on people for valuing optional content in the game and him making apathetic statements that further riles up people who value that content, then you and I have nothing further to discuss. If you want to explore and/or discuss realistic suggestions that could be made to housing in the game, other than trying to redirect players into leaving their houses to go to an apartment, I'm right here.

Perhaps I didn't get my point across correctly. But your entire post is basically what I've been trying to argue.

[Aerlana]

He didn't create housing for everyone to have one, he intentionally created housing for FCs and then said he was going to add separate personal housing.

And ... he didnt do a separate personnal housing. we wait again after this promise (one of the quote in my signs...)

Originally, personnal housing was intend for 6 month after FC housing (so for 2.3)
When the patch was soon, he said he had to delay personnal housing (no matter ok. really) and gave us personnal room instead of. (so personnal room ARE NOT personnal housing)
2.38, personnal housing did came in servers. and this time, housing died. not enough houses, amny FC dont have their own. And in HW release, 3x12 ward... 2 years after in SB release 3x12 ward... 4.1 yay, 12 more wards and burning forums due to the bullshit...
Then now... 4.2 came with now 4x18 ward and the promise to get more ward as patch will progress... (4.3 and 4.4 no ward... )


Appartment are NOT the personnal housing, was never announced this way, was a cheap way to solve people wanting house...



THe personnal housing was promised to be not "with" FC housing (other ward, other system like instanced, i dont know we never knew what was in his mind). And he did change his mind "to get living neighborhood" Simply, he did consider if there were FC housing wards, and personnal housing wards, the second kind would be empty from any life, and he did want to avoid it, so he did add the personnal housing in the already existing ward (1=>6) and added ward either for FC and personnal. (just 4.2 did a small change on it.)
*look at the 72 ward* ... Yeah, right, neighborhood are really living ...


But, at least now, he admits that the destroy system of houses are for people paying subscription...

[Kirsten_Rev]

But, at least now, he admits that the destroy system of houses are for people paying subscription...

In fairness to Yoshi-P, they really don't have a lot of choice right now. Under the current system, it's essential that SE ensure at least a nominal level of turnover so that people on crowded servers don't feel completely cut off from housing.

My greater issue, personally, is not with the demo system - it's with the general responses by Yoshi-P, and what I perceive to be a relative lack of empathy and understanding. I have to question whether or not he understands that owning a house is a major goal for a lot of players, a goal that they are not able to properly achieve, particularly if they are seeking medium or large plots. Implicit in this, of course, is the fact that players who do own medium or large plots already can feel trapped into their subscription, because they likely won't be able to get a plot back in the future.

To make matters worse, empathy is free. It doesn't cost a dime for Yoshi-P to respond sympathetically to housing or Glamour concerns, or to acknowledge player perspectives. Consider if his response had been the following:

"I understand that homeowners feel trapped into maintaining their subscription when they may otherwise let it lapse. I want to assure them that we don't like the demolition system either - but we have to ensure some level of turnover so new players get a chance to own a house, too. Rest assured, we're always evaluating the various systems within FFXIV, and if we have an opportunity to expand housing availability enough for everyone to own a home who wants one, we'll be discarding the demolition system right away."

Speaking personally, this response would have been aces for me. Despite committing to nothing, it would have assured me that Yoshi-P understood. I'll settle for that. Most people, provided they understand the desires of their customers, will eventually work to meet them. I have no doubt that Yoshi-P would as well. But it seems that at every turn, he demonstrates that he doesn't even know what we want, what our pain points are - and that's a much more problematic situation.

[Aerlana]

In fairness to Yoshi-P, they really don't have a lot of choice right now. Under the current system, it's essential that SE ensure at least a nominal level of turnover so that people on crowded servers don't feel completely cut off from housing.

i was one of people really anjoying this reboot, full of hope. There were many promises, or even more some commitment. And it makes a shining future for the game. During ARR i did a lot of defense for FFXIV... the only thing i did not defend was atmas... For all other, i did say the game, the team, their leader needed time to fix themselves... But most promises and commitment was broken, or cheated.


Housing... it is full of trick, broken promises, the content you can get if you are lucky.
The "destroy system" was a COMMITMENT not a simple promises "but this is a thing of the past " he said, it is hard words. he did really show those things as bad things to do.

Yes, in the current case, it is needed. But the "turnover" is not the main reason, in this finaland interview he did a link between "no sub" and "take appartment". and finally the promises before 4.2 to get more wards in other patches, where it is? Lets go to nothing until 5.0 or 5.1? Why not adding any single ward during HW also?...

And finally, the destroy system should been avoid. How? make a REAL delay to personnal housing. Yes i am happy to get my two houses (stop, i have 2 account è_é). But when i see all the shit ...
I mainly thing about Free Companies... which cant get houses even with the destroy system... (prove this system doesnt do his work )
They did knew how much houses they could add. and simple mathematics did allow them to know it wouldnt be enough for FC + personnal... they did a real, big mistake. With no reason, no excuse.

If we did get appartment in 2.38 instead of houses. most matters around housing wouldnt exists... I wouldnt cry if he said "we dont have ability to release a personnal housing where each player gets 1 house. we prefer delay this to an unknown patch where it will be avaible. please understand. But here is some appartments in addition of personnal room." Sad but... better than what we have now...

Consider if his response had been the following:

I speak not a lot there, more on french forum. and i say one thing there many time :

The matter of FFXIV is not "the cash shop in subscription MMORPG" "the treadmill" "eureka is diadem" or many other things.
I dislike all those things are just symptom of one big matter : the way Yoshida considers the game and the customers.

And those interviews, all the time we facepalm ourself while reading the latest stupidity he said like those... it is just the proof that all other thing i did list (and other i didnt thing while typing) are just different symptom of one ill...

And now imo they just want to stick with this system because otherwise it would look like they have made a mistake..but this will only get worse.

One time will come the game will stagnate (not a lot new player all time) and they will add more and more wards. And so, not a need to destroy system. The matter is : it won't erase years of shittyness ! Like raubahn Xtrem in SB pre-release, i am sure they did nothing else than waiting the people go to sleep... the solution came itself (and then, pippin Xtrem did short show. and another on other patches... ...)

But for housing, during HW, (2 years with NO wards added ! ) i many time said the matters was personnal housing, and i would applause a cancellation of it. YES players/customers would be angry to not being able to use houses anymore. yes. me first, i have two account from ARR and both did get houses. But prefered loosing this, to see all player on the same line, seeing all FC getting houses. And getting improvment on appartment (doing size x3. or being abe to get different size. )

I continue, today, to find this better that what we have. I did stopped one of the houses, and would cry to loose my M houses... but would take the biggest appartment instead of. (it could be even appartment with stairs...)

[Alleo]

But for housing, during HW, (2 years with NO wards added ! ) i many time said the matters was personnal housing, and i would applause a cancellation of it. YES players/customers would be angry to not being able to use houses anymore. yes. me first, i have two account from ARR and both did get houses. But prefered loosing this, to see all player on the same line, seeing all FC getting houses. And getting improvment on appartment (doing size x3. or being abe to get different size. )

I agree with a lot of your points but them taking out personal houses (and taking them away from people) would have been a catastrophe. (IMO) Heck even when they for a short amount of time introduced the new housing rules they did not take away the houses from those that owned too many.

For me they should introduce private instanced housing. With all the sizes and zones available. It would be awesome if we could buy a L house in each zone since its instanced thus people could own quite a lot of houses, while at the same time the wards still exist but instead of taking the houses away they just stop people from buying more private ones for the future and maybe give a compensation for everyone that switches their private house from wards directly to an instance. On top of that give FCs access to workshops in some city states and gardening plots in Gridania for everyone to use.

This way a FC does not need a house to get access to all the things behind it, people can all have as many big houses as housing zones exists. (Right now that would be like 4 large houses) And they would not lose it and have a huge gil sink on top of that. I would gladly give up my personal and FC house for that. But I would not give them up for something like an apartment.

I wish people who complain about having to stay subbed because they are bored/hate the game would just unsub already and give someone who still loves the game a chance at homeownership. SE makes the terms and we either abide by them or we disgree and take our money/time elsewhere.

I am quite sure that those that complain that the timer is bad if they want to take a break are just exactly wanting that: A break. Which means that they plan to return to the game. I mean we are not talking about a timer that is 90 days long or more, but something as short as 45 days which amounts to a bit more than one month breaks. Seeing how a patch takes at least 3 months to come out than this is way too low. Someone could have played the game for years constantly, own a house but just want to take one break between two patches. They simply cant..because that would be too long and they will lose their house that they have might used quite a lot and had planned to use it again after the break. Why would someone else deserve it more than them?