How would an optional, official parser be toxic?

[Penthea]

By the way, here is a prime example of toxicity, and it isn't coming from the parse users. Remember how I accused your stance of coddling? This is precisely why. Some idiot says mean words to someone, and we need to wrap them in blankets and ban the parsers because they may, possibly, potentially, unknowingly get their knickers twisted. We can't have anyone's feelings hurt! You have just described a safe space.

And? Some moron acted like a jerk, only making themselves look foolish. Who cares? You laugh and move on with your life.

You are actually acting as if considering the abuse of a tool is a bad thing, simply because the tool can be useful. It appears you do not care of the negative affects a parser can have because you are able to laugh it off if it's directed at you. Not everyone is you. Not everyone is confident in their ability, and not everyone understands the game enough to know if they're being wrongly accused of poor performance.

Some people come to the game to escape and/or relax. Not to be worried about some jerks who are synced down giving them crap for playing a class they're learning or trying to gear up. You may think wanting to prevent this is wrapping people in a blanket, but it's granting a measure of fairness to people to not be judged by a mere glance at some numbers when the reasons for their damage output could very well be completely unrelated to the buttons they're pressing, or justified considering their lack of experience.

Additionally parsers may make lvl sync problematic if sprouts see that their dps cannot compare to lvl 60+ synced players. They may think they are actually doing something wrong when they're not simply because the parser makes it appear so. In a sense the game would be doing parser abuse on its own by potentially making unsynced players look bad.

But apparently looking at the bigger picture equates to swaddling the game in bubble-wrap.

[Legion88]

Some people come to the game to escape and/or relax. Not to be worried about some jerks who are synced down giving them crap for playing a class they're learning or trying to gear up. You may think wanting to prevent this is wrapping people in a blanket, but it's granting a measure of fairness to people to not be judged by a mere glance at some numbers when the reasons for their damage output could very well be completely unrelated to the buttons they're pressing, or justified considering their lack of experience.

Additionally parsers may make lvl sync problematic if sprouts see that their dps cannot compare to lvl 60+ synced players. They may think they are actually doing something wrong when they're not simply because the parser makes it appear so. In a sense the game would be doing parser abuse on its own by potentially making unsynced players look bad.

1.) Initially no one asked for parsers in leveling content, only for dummies, ExTrials and Savage. Only Anti-Parser-People are bringing this up, despite the repeated cases of Pro-Parser-People not wanting this in the "casual" and leveling content.

2.) Common sense should tell people that an unsynced person is always inferior to an synced person due to the synced person having all main and sub stats synced at the possible cap.

3.) People just wanting to relax, having some fun time and escape reality have a whole bunch of content they can enjoy, "casual" content. If they decide to leave their house of "casual" content and should be prepared for the rough weather awaiting them their.

[Penthea]

1.) Initially no one asked for parsers in leveling content, only for dummies, ExTrials and Savage. Only Anti-Parser-People are bringing this up, despite the repeated cases of Pro-Parser-People not wanting this in the "casual" and leveling content.

Maybe in this thread but in general a lot of people who want parsers want it in all content. Saying this from my experience in other threads relating to parsers. I agree that parsers are only really relevant and useful at max lvl, especially in savage or ex. But if SE introduce them for that content, players will demand it in the rest of the game too.

2.) Common sense should tell people that an unsynced person is always inferior to an synced person due to the synced person having all main and sub stats synced at the possible cap.

Common sense is sometimes a result of experience. A sprout might not realise exactly what lvl syncing does and therefore would not understand why their dps is so low by comparison. Additionally common sense can be in short supply. Only got to have a look in alliance raids to see proof of this. A lot of people leave their brain at the door when they start gaming.

3.) People just wanting to relax, having some fun time and escape reality have a whole bunch of content they can enjoy, "casual" content. If they decide to leave their house of "casual" content and should be prepared for the rough weather awaiting them their.

I agree but as I said before a lot of pro-parser players want parsers in all content, so this would include the casual content. I understand wanting to be able to analyse your performance from the beginning, but due to class balance while lvling and the fact that the content is intended to be casual, I feel parsers have no place there.

[Speaks]

snip

Not who you responded to but I would like to make a note of something as a Savage/EX content player.

Whether you know it or want it, right now you are already being parsed. Your runs are already being uploaded. I have my "abacus on my desk" running at all times. I can already see if you are good or bad.

And if I am in a dungeon run and my "abacus on my desk" shows that you are not doing anything, you may be kicked. Does it happens frequently? Not at all. But I would like to point out a "difference in playstyle" is already a legitimate kick reason AFAIK.

This game has genuinely tight hard enrages on many of the more difficult fights. Not soft enrages like you often see in WoW either, where you may be able to survive a good bit past the enrage with a decent healer. This game straight up kills everyone in the raid instantly and makes you start over if your rDPS is not high enough.

And since parsers are officially not allowed, you know what that means when I see a 2k DPS SAM in Suz EX? They are getting kicked. Immediately. With no reason or remark given.

I would like to ask them "Hey, is something going on I noticed your DPS is really low. Do you need help or perhaps you are overworked for the content? Maybe you need more ilvl? Can I make suggestions on aligning your rotation? Do you have raid food active?"

These are things I do for people in my static because they know I use my abacus. They know when they do poorly and if they need to pick up the pace so that everyone in the group can pass the DPS check. These are things I cannot do for anyone outside my group, nor would I ever risk mentioning or suggesting I parse.

Because of course I don't, that would be my trusty desk abacus.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

You are actually acting as if considering the abuse of a tool is a bad thing, simply because the tool can be useful. It appears you do not care of the negative affects a parser can have because you are able to laugh it off if it's directed at you. Not everyone is you. Not everyone is confident in their ability, and not everyone understands the game enough to know if they're being wrongly accused of poorperformance.

Some people come to the game to escape and/or relax. Not to be worried about some jerks who are synced down giving them crap for playing a class they're learning or trying to gear up. You may think wanting to prevent this is wrapping people in a blanket, but it's granting a measure of fairness to people to not be judged by a mere glance at some numbers when the reasons for their damage output could very well be completely unrelated to the buttons they're pressing, or justified considering their lack of experience.

Additionally parsers may make lvl sync problematic if sprouts see that their dps cannot compare to lvl 60+ synced players. They may think they are actually doing something wrong when they're not simply because the parser makes it appear so. In a sense the game would be doing parser abuse on its own by potentially making unsynced players look bad.

But apparently looking at the bigger picture equates to swaddling the game in bubble-wrap.

No. I am acting like accentuating the negative aspects and presuming they will overshadow any and all positives is a bad thing. Which, is it. Likewise, what I said is we shouldn't ban a beneficial tool because some people had their feelings hurt. I don't doubt people will take offense. That seems to be the unfortunate norm nowadays. But you don't promote borderline censorship because some people can't handle someone saying mean things to them online. If taken to its logical extreme, I could tell spam you right now. Should we remove the tell feature? After all, I am misusing it to cause harm. And we have established even the mere prospect of hurt feelings is enough reason to overlook any other benefits said feature might provide. Obviously, that would be absurd. You would report and/or Blacklist me. So what does that differ when a parse is involved? Why wouldn't you take the exact same recourse?

Fantastic. They can stay out of harder content. Why should other people have to cater to the whims of someone else who wants to "relax" whilst wasting the time of their party who may not share their same leisurely perspective? Since to mention, Leveling in a separate post. I am specifically referring to EX Primals and Savage. Even if a parse ever did become commonplace, people aren't going to care anymore than they already do about trivial dungeons. You'll see people more vocally point out a lack of Healer DPS or AoE but nothing in the realm of "omg, Samurai sucks for dungeons!" It just isn't going to happen enough to be worth mentioning. Regardless, people advocating for parses generally want them in harder content, not dungeons. And that's where the issue lies. I don't appreciate someone wasting my time because they couldn't be bothered to learn a proper rotation yet still chose to join a Suzaku EX farm party.

Common sense still prevails. Even a sprout ought to pick up quickly a max level player is going to do far higher damage. In fact, it opens up an opportunity to ask. Shock horror, I know, but people are surprisingly more helpful than this forum likes to give credit. Furthermore, an in-game would likely be something people have to turn on themselves. Therefore, a new player wouldn't even see it until later on. Could someone heckle them about low damage? Sure. They can do so right now. I know someone in this very thread who bailed on a dungeon because someone claimed they were new. No parser. They just didn't want to deal with a new player.

You aren't looking at the bigger picture. What you've said can essentially be boiled down to "someone could have their feelings hurt!" Hence why you're bubble-wrapping the game.