Its ffxiv combat really so slow and boring?

[KaldeaSahaline]

I'd just like to ask people who play other MMOs how "build-based" systems are better than this. Because, from what I've heard of these "build-based" MMOs like WoW (which you get one class per character and from what I've heard you have to uproot everything to re-build), if you are not the optimal build people refuse to play with you essentially.

Build based systems are superior (IMO) if they're well designed/thought out, but if they aren't there are issues that muddy the waters.

Your WoW example is nothing more than a hyperbole though. I pick whatever talents I want and I do some of the hardest content in the game, successfully. No one kicks me, I get invited to pugs no problem, and do organized events with no one telling me how to play.

WoW does have less freedom to switch around roles/class than FF14 does, and that is a strength in FF14s column for sure, but it's not completely uproot. A lot of content is account bound in that if you unlock XYZ on your main, it's automatically unlocked for any and all alts and each class has multiple specs you can switch between on a single character. Again, still more restricting than FF14, but not some crime people make it out to be.

FFXIV is meant to be the pace its at so you can think about your rotation and avoid mechanics instead of mashing attacks out every half second. Plus, they already stated that the faster they made GCD the more they'd need to curtail the beautiful animations of the spells and effects. WoW's animations are crap because they need to dissipate before the next GCD. FFXIV prides itself on being a visually stunning experience. But yeah, mashing out hotkeys while dodging attacks would make FFXIV almost feel like a fighting game or an action game than an RPG.

Think about your rotation? I don't understand why people always cite this as a reason for the 2.5s GCD. If you're "thinking" about your rotation you're already playing sub-optimally. It should be muscle memory ESPECIALLY with how binary 99% of the rotations are.

While FF14 has absolutely beautiful animations, better than WoWs for sure (which are not nearly as awful as the game has gotten older), I'm not sure it has to do with the GCD TBH.

Quicken the GCD and it makes each individual GCD feel less impactful. When you're casting Flare/Deathflare or whatever [insert huge damge GCD] much faster than you are currently, they feel less important than "ive been building up to this huge attack for 30 seconds, time to unleash it!" vs "i can do this move every 10 seconds, no biggie".

So by this statement if you were to increase GCD to 5s would it make them MORE impactful?

That's absolute hogwash. None of these GCDs feel impactful in this game because they're binary. They don't do anything fancy, they just do damage. They don't have much if any synergy. They're simply mash on CD with next to no decision process elements.

I'm talking about PING, not a specific persons point of view.

And I'm sorry. You are objectively, factually incorrect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwaz_aAih-A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meDtc3QqQeI

Say that when you start playing on the high-ping side (like, 300-400 PING). You most likely never tried that. Go ahead and try playing the likes of Titan (it's Weight of the Land is particularly nasty) on a Japanese or European server. Can you do it?! Yes, absolutely. But you'll see how much worse you will do simply because of PING difference. In a game that is made to minimize that.

And don't tell me that I could just play on European servers. I could, but if I would, I'd never even start playing. I came here upon a friends invite and that friend was playing on NA servers...starting early on in 2.0 I believe. It's simply not a choice.

It is a choice. You made the decision to sacrifice significant performance to play with friends (and I get and respect that). I'm going to say something that might ruffle some feathers, but with all due respect, you shouldn't be catered too. I don't think anyone should be designing systems with the idea of having people from the other side of the planet into account until infrastructure is there to support it. It's a stupid limitation to put on yourself. It's why every major game puts servers in major areas to mitigate this. If you have 300ms to an NA server you don't belong there. Simply put.

Your BNS examples are hardly what I consider egregious btw (20% slower speed fro 8ms to 160ms). Again, if you had 300-400MS on BNS NA you don't belong on that server. Simple as that. Find one closer.

[Aerlana]

Think about your rotation? I don't understand why people always cite this as a reason for the 2.5s GCD. If you're "thinking" about your rotation you're already playing sub-optimally. It should be muscle memory ESPECIALLY with how binary 99% of the rotations are.

Missed this non-sense when i did answer... ty ^^'
Also, we could have a gameplay where we really have to think about the next skill. But yes you are right, the rotations on FFXIV are so simple and obvious (reading clearly each skill and you already understand the rotation without any guide...)

While FF14 has absolutely beautiful animations, better than WoWs for sure (which are not nearly as awful as the game has gotten older), I'm not sure it has to do with the GCD TBH.

WoW melee animation are mainly basic hit. not long work. For cast animation, on the last years they did work on all classes, and i really like most of new work (mainly the healing spell of the priests <3)
And casting animation are more worked than the melee (instant) mainly because large part are really limited by 1,5 sec or more (depending of cast time)

if you shorten the GCD of FF from 2.5 to 1.5, you have to do animation staying in those 1,5 seconds... It is a real reason, but... When you fill the game is boring, it can be as beautiful as the most beautiful thing in the world... it stays boring (at least... we have time to see those animation :-° )
Prefer "crap" animation and not sleeping while pushing buttons personnaly (and... FF as nice animation, with some of them making really strange moves to character... so not so wonderfull...)

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Missed this non-sense when i did answer... ty ^^'
Also, we could have a gameplay where we really have to think about the next skill. But yes you are right, the rotations on FFXIV are so simple and obvious (reading clearly each skill and you already understand the rotation without any guide...)

I'm sorry, but I disagree with this completely. If rotations were so simple and obvious, you wouldn't have so many people failing to do the most simple of DPS checks.

It's easy to say the game is easy and the rotations are simple when you don't do anything more than dungeon content.

[Nabian]

I took a break from playing this game to play WoW (where the combat has a 1.5s GCD). When I returned to FFXIV I almost felt like I was lagging in combat due to the differences in GCD time. After playing for a day or so that feeling went away and the combat in FFXIV feels normal again.

I think it just depends on what your used to. I like the combat in FFXIV because it doesn't require break neck reaction times to be proficient. Is it slower than other games...sure; but it still feels fun and enjoyable to me so who cares?

[Darrcyphfeid]

I'm sorry, but I disagree with this completely. If rotations were so simple and obvious, you wouldn't have so many people failing to do the most simple of DPS checks.

It's easy to say the game is easy and the rotations are simple when you don't do anything more than dungeon content.

People fail DPS checks in dungeon content all the time, too. And they fail in PotD all the time as a group of four when it's entirely possible to solo through that well under cap.

It doesn't mean that the basic rotations aren't braindead simple, it just means a good portion of the playerbase doesn't care about the game enough to push a button every ~2.5 seconds.

For most jobs the only parts of the rotation that aren't obvious are the timings for throwing up buffs for synergy in a raid scenario. That constitutes 90% of minmaxing in this game, with the other 10% going to things like optimizing substats (BiS gearset) and deciding the best approach for minimizing the time tanks need to be in defense stance. Jobs like MCH and SMN are less straightforward.

[Kirsten_Rev]

I'm sorry, but I disagree with this completely. If rotations were so simple and obvious, you wouldn't have so many people failing to do the most simple of DPS checks.

It's easy to say the game is easy and the rotations are simple when you don't do anything more than dungeon content.

I'd suggest that in either case, people still aren't 'thinking' about what they're doing. They're executing a rotation from muscle memory - sometimes it's the optimal rotation, and sometimes it's a crappy one.

I also think it's easy to make the case that FFXIV's GCD is still too fast to really put thought into it. I mean we've got, what, 25ish skills per Job? With 2.5s to decide which one to use? Yeah, there's not much conscious thought going into that. For FFXI, a case could be made - people could often see their moves coming from several seconds away, giving them time to both figure out which ability to use and ready it - but not FFXIV.

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I'd still argue that a faster GCD wouldn't matter, though. As long as optimal performance in combat relies on what is, in essence, a pre-determined rotation best committed to memory, the combat is going to be boring, at least for me. There absolutely has to be some decision-making element involved, and I don't think it can be purely movement-based. I think had SE presented me the template for the combat back in 2013 - active and dynamic movement with pre-determined ability rotation - I'd have considered it an idea worth trying, but today, I'd say it didn't work out, and a change needs to be made. Monster mechanics simply aren't random and dynamic enough to shoulder 100% of the responsibility for keeping me reacting in combat, for keeping me entertained.

[KaldeaSahaline]

I'm sorry, but I disagree with this completely. If rotations were so simple and obvious, you wouldn't have so many people failing to do the most simple of DPS checks.

It's easy to say the game is easy and the rotations are simple when you don't do anything more than dungeon content.

Rotations are simple and obvious. People aren't failing simple DPS checks because of complex rotations. They're failing them because they don't care or understand the concept of ABC. Everytime I look at someones logs who asks for help, or look at meters to see why my teammates are doing damage that wasn't acceptable in HW, let alone SB, it's ALWAYS, consistently the same reason.

People don't push buttons. Full Stop.

Sidenote - It's a little ironic giving a person a hard time because they don't do savage, when you haven't even cleared a single raid tier this expansion according to Lodestone.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Rotations are simple and obvious. People aren't failing simple DPS checks because of complex rotations. They're failing them because they don't care or understand the concept of ABC. Everytime I look at someones logs who asks for help, or look at meters to see why my teammates are doing damage that wasn't acceptable in HW, let alone SB, it's ALWAYS, consistently the same reason.

People don't push buttons. Full Stop.

Sidenote - It's a little ironic giving a person a hard time because they don't do savage, when you haven't even cleared a single raid tier this expansion according to Lodestone.

Haven't really cared to finish them, lack of drive more than performance. My raid group stopped after 2nd forsaken prog, and I found someone I've been spending my time with.

If I wanted to clear it I could.

I at least don't complain about content or concepts I have know knowledge or experience in.

I also didn't even specifically say savage. They haven't even done omega sigma normal or lighthouse... (not that these are hard either. Didn't see most of the 4.0 extremes done either)

[OurMom]

It's easy to say the game is easy and the rotations are simple when you don't do anything more than dungeon content.

You do harder content and it's still the same 1>2>3 (some classes it's just 1..1..1.1.. proc) with more dodge.

The rotations are easy and they were made even easier in SB. People are bad because there's no real punishment in this game for failing mechanics and because the community can't actually call out bad players.

It's not slow at all. It's traditional tab target MMO gameplay.

What other mmos have a 2.5gcd? I've played tab target mmos without a gcd and ones with at most a 1.5gcd