White Raven earring given out at The Rising event 2018

[Penthea]

I think you have to take the situation with a little bit of context. 1.0 and 2.0+ are essentially different games, so crossing rewards over is always going to be a little bit funky.

How? Have the earrings somehow disrupted the balance of the game? Are some classes gaining an advantage from having them? I think you'll find the answer is no.

Also FFXIV has a history of collaborating with other franchises that have entirely different game mechanics so your argument is weak at best.

[Darrcyphfeid]

Well I have in another game. I still have some stuff in WoW that is no longer obtainable (or at least was not up until I stopped playing, can't speak for now) and generally I am against exclusivity that renders it impossible to gain something after a certain time. I prefer to watch players enjoy something than greedily hang on to my old trophies.

I'm not advocating for the removal of content and, thus, the inability to obtain items. I'm advocating for not devaluing people's work through means such as this Rising event and allowing people to make an absolute mockery of the fights via undersized party toggle.

The fights would still be there. You could still access them. You would merely have to, you know, earn them. And Square would have to stop totally screwing up the feel/viability of less-than-level cap job. But one step at a time.

I understand this but some 1.0 players are saying things like "we are the true supporters of the game" and not "we killed that boss and now it looks like you did too". Some of the 1.0 players here are more interested in reminding the rest of us that we somehow matter less than getting SE to rename some loot

Barring being put into timeout for 9 days, I've been here since the start and have kept loose tabs on the goings on. I will not claim to have read every post in this thread.

I will say, however, that it was not the Legacy players that started slinging mud. The first was absolutely the non-Legacy players with their repeated insistence that Legacy players should just go away because the ARR+ people were all XIV needed, and that ARR would have happened even if the Legacy players didn't stick with 1.0 so "hey, you're not special, go away." It was ludicrous and infuriating. There's nothing inherently wrong with the second quote.

SE could rename the "new" earrings because their databases would still have logs showing when something was looted, but obviously doing something like this would take a lot of time and money. So whether they think it's worth doing it or not is another thing altogether.

This is a common theme with them. I'm probably risking another ban with their vague "don't disparage Square, XIV or the forum" ToS entry here, but seriously: They never think things through. It's always, without fail, them messing something up and then spending stupid amounts of time and resources trying to fix it to the state it should have launched in. See also: Both iterations of Diadem 1.0, and both Anemos and Pagos.

Don't put ultimate and the earrings in the same basket. Ultimate is in a class of its own. At most the earrings can be compared to savage or ex loot.

Relative difficulty wasn't my point there, but whatever. The point is that you do not convince people that something is going to be or remain an achievement while you're still going around devaluing the achievements already in the game (/of the past).

And for the record I am heavily against making the tattoo and the chocobo (and any other items gifted specifically for being part of 1.0) being made available for 2.0+ players. They were awarded solely based on participation of the game in that era. It would be a disservice to 1.0 players to unlock them for everyone else. But I repeat the earrings do not come under this because they are boss loot, not something SE gifted to every 1.0 player.

The area you draw the line confuses me, to be perfectly honest, but it is what it is.

I'm under no illusion that they won't eventually give away more items despite this most recent statement.

[Penthea]

The area you draw the line confuses me, to be perfectly honest, but it is what it is.

How is this confusing? The earrings are boss loot, the tattoo and chocobo are awards for participating in 1.0 in any manner. The way they were obtained isn't the same so they should not be treated in the same way.

Or is it confusing because you think every 1.0 item should be treated with the same exclusivity as the tattoo? :P

[Darrcyphfeid]

How is this confusing? The earrings are boss loot, the tattoo and chocobo are awards for participating in 1.0 in any manner. The way they were obtained isn't the same so they should not be treated in the same way.

Or is it confusing because you think every 1.0 item should be treated with the same exclusivity as the tattoo? :P

I think because we weigh the values of the White Ravens and Legacy Brand on entirely different scales.

For me, the Legacy Brand is a cheap trinket just given to any character that was created prior to a certain date. Could've been a lv1 character that logged in for 3 minutes, got to the scene with Leviathan or whatever, and their computer melted so they could never log in again until ARR hit the PS3.

Whereas the White Ravens required actual commitment (and a subscription...) to the experience that was 1.X.

So for the former to be completely off-limits, but the latter is fair game, throws me for a loop.

[Alleo]

I love the statements of some people.

First SE would not have answered if it had not been enough complains. I mean they barely communicate with us at all so them posting something means that at least the complains got to them and felt the need to answer it. I would just hope that they would answer to us much more with other topics too.

Second: Funny how people are seemingly not fans of FF14 if they complain about earrings (which is probably not about the glamour itself but about a broken promise and because it was thrown out into such a easy event..heck the OP even stated that it would have been fine if they had been replicas.) but as soon as its something minor that they care about themselves its fine to complain.

Examples:

-Bunny outfit for men
-More female than male glamours
-Bad campaigns for EU players
-Limited PVP mounts

You could easily argue that people should get over those too because they are just minor complains and are just digital goods that should hold no importancy over someone. Yet we had those discussion and SE reacted to a lot of those too. (And before someone gets it wrong. I was posting for those things too. Because I can understand that even if I dont want something or are not angry about something, others can be and have the right to post about this...without being verbally put down.)

Please just remember that once in the past you probably also had something that was minor in other peoples eyes and yet still talked about it because this is a forum were everyone can say why they like/dislike something without being attacked for it. And I am quite sure that you would have hated to be taken down too. If you disagree with something you are allowed to post but maybe without taking the poster itself down..saying how someone should stop playing, are no true fans or will be the downfall of the game (overdramatic much?) since the devs dared to answer it are no ways to argue..

Anway I hope the devs learn from this and start to hold true to their promises...and if you need to break them at least try to find a solution that would make the least amount of people angry. Or heck ask the players how they would want it to get some intel before you do it. With that a lot of anger could have been avoided.

[Lambdafish]

Or is it confusing because you think every 1.0 item should be treated with the same exclusivity as the tattoo? :P

I'm going to say this because Darrc didn't:

The way you phrased this is the entire problem with this thread. Darrc wanted nothing but a reasonable debate, with different viewpoints and considerations taken into account. It's clear that he didn't accuse you of anything or disrespect your opinion. You on the other hand are making up assumptions and accusations to shut down his opinion. He never ever said the thing you are accusing him of, and it completely destroys your argument and comes across as childish. Come up with something actually tangible that supports your argument rather than slandering people for no reason.

It's ironic that the people in defence of the rising are the ones making the outlandish arguments and acting like the sky is falling, just because some people asked to be respected by the devs

[Penthea]

Whereas the White Ravens required actual commitment (and a subscription...) to the experience that was 1.X.

So does getting any other boss loot while the content is current. The earrings are not unique in this aspect. Getting HW loot now is not the same as getting HW loot in HW.

For me, the Legacy Brand is a cheap trinket just given to any character that was created prior to a certain date. Could've been a lv1 character that logged in for 3 minutes, got to the scene with Leviathan or whatever, and their computer melted so they could never log in again until ARR hit the PS3.

While this is true it does not change that the tattoo, the chocobo and cheaper sub fee are awards for playing 1.0 in any manner. Those gifts acted as both an apology and the hope that players would give them a second chance in 2.0. These should be completely off-limits because the intentions behind their creation are incredibly unique and have an extremely specific purpose.

The earrings however are boss loot. Their intended purpose and creation are not unique. They only hold significance because they are from 1.0, not because the manner in which they were obtained was vastly different to nearly any other loot in the game.

I understand that the earrings were more difficult to earn but this doesn't make them the same as actual legacy rewards. But many here act as if they are.

I don't think the model of the earrings should be off-limits for the reasons stated above, but I disagree with the name having no discernible difference with the originals from 1.0. That was definitely a mistake on SE's part. Personally I'd like the earrings no matter what they were called. I wouldn't be offended if they were called replicas instead.

[InkstainedGwyn]

If you're only doing the content because of the rewards and you don't enjoy the content itself, then I think that's something I'd step back and look at. I wouldn't want to play a game that I didn't have fun playing. My FC is currently farming all of the wolves, because it's fun to clear current content and succeed at it. And yet we'll still go back and unsync these mounts for new players who don't have time to commit thousands of hours to the old stuff as well as joining us for the new stuff. It doesn't take away my enjoyment now of my legendary kamuy for people to get it later, and in fact it's always fun to go back and faceroll things that were difficult the first time around. I did the thing, I had the mount for a year or more before folks who are waiting for unsync will get it. I'm not saying content needs to be nerfed but when it's not current? Sure.

If you do enjoy the fights and you're just against people getting old stuff that they didn't have to do the same way as you did, I say get over yourself. Games change. Nobody's against them tightening the post-Praetorium content slog because we understand that when a game gets longer, it gets more daunting to get through (although I bet that if there was a shiny reward for completing it some people would complain). Things don't need to be handed out, but making it easier to get old stuff leaves time to focus on new stuff. And it's still not "a quick run". RNG is still a thing to contend with. We spent 3h last night on Ifrit without one mount; Susano usually gives his out faster than that.

And if we're taking the "things should never get easier route" I'm going to have to say that this whole game needs to be cancelled. I played my first MMO on dial up, so it's a travesty that people are able to get their video game entertainment quicker and easier than I did. And if you ordered that pizza online, you're cheating. Real people order delivery on the phone. God, I hate these people who just turn on netflix, in my day you had to go to the Blockbuster and rent your movies in 3-day chunks!

And for those of you saying that this is why people expect everything to be handed to them, even to nerf new content, no. That's been a thing since time began. People were begging nerfs in original WoW, in EQ1, in City of Heroes and Guild Wars. And old games didn't actually sync you down, if I recall - I'm pretty sure that when I played vanilla my friends and I would just run through lower level dungeons to get random loot for newbies. (It's been a long time since I played, though, so I'm fully admitting that my memory is fuzzy.) I remember that SWtOR only introduced level sync late, though. Until then you could do low content at high levels any time you wanted. So don't act like this whole "cheesing lower level stuff" thing is some new lazy trick.

[Rogatum]

I have to agree with Yoshi-P, I am also a player that tends to value the experience over the reward, the reward itself is just a bonus. Think the divide came about due to this difference of mindset, and at the very least he acknowledged such difference. Now does that mean they will act on it in the future? Only time will tell, personally I take such statements with a grain of salt since words are meaningless without actions.

[Miste]

Coming from someone who claimed that people are just envious of those who have "an achievement that they don't", this is an interesting statement.

I said that because I have come across people in-game with that attitude, it was not a direct reference to this thread, just the type of behavior another poster mentioned.

I was replying to someone else about it based on what they posted and decided to share those experiences of people being salty (you are using the word envious, if you look at my other post I never used that word). I even explained in my next post that it was not a direct comparison to what is going on here, nor did I claim everyone in this thread is envious, but I guess maybe you didn't see it.

If you misunderstood then I apologize for not wording it better.

I don't think that's a matter of opinions. This whole matter has become so big because some people didn't want others to get an item that they value, period. Feel free to romanticize everyone's personal reasons, but it won't change that simple detail.

I am not romanticizing anything.

I am saying you don't know everyone's reasons or how they feel about this, cause you don't. That isn't an opinion, it is a fact that you don't know. I am not saying you are entirely wrong, some people might be exactly what you say they are, but you aren't just covering them in this blanket, you are covering everyone.

I don't think we have to discuss whether or not it can be rude to claim someone just wants to brag or show off, do we? It is a negative, and most people will feel affronted by such an accusation about their personality.

You can have that opinion if you want to, but I don't know why you would reply to me talking about disliking drama when you already participated in said drama and went out of your way to blanket statement people with 'you should just admit all you want to do is brag and feel special.'

people tend to need things that can give them bragging rights in order to feel special. At the very least, I hope they can admit that much.

You said you don't like drama, but then you go into a thread you consider drama and post this.

Does that sound like you are going to get a good response? Or more drama? Sounds like more drama since you are making a blanket statement about everyone. Just my observation.

And then you blanket statement again in a reply to me:

this drama does boil down to people wanting to feel exclusive and special. The good memories and the satisfaction of having accomplished something won't work for them; they want to own things that no one else owns, and they want it to show. It's that simple.

So yeah...like I said, to me your last 2+ posts in here are just using these blanket statements to fan the flames and just results in more drama.

Um, I apologize if I offended you in any way, But I think you're somehow trying to twist and turn the focus of the real conflict that happened here, putting the blame on the people who disapprove of it. It wasn't me who made Yoshida apologize; I merely stated my disappointment about the fact.

I'm not offended.

I am not twisting anything. If you disapprove that is fine, anyone who disapproves it is fine to have that opinion. I just do not like your blanket statements you decided to reply to me with after I replied to Lambda, and saying you dislike drama but then somehow being unaware that you are just adding to it too.

Also I'm not sure what Yoshida apologizing has to do with me? I also never accused you of "making him apologize"? I mean to be fair no one can make someone else apologize, he could have ignored it like SE does with 95% of other forum stuff, but I guess they chose not to.