Omega and future raid concerns

[Maero]

I actually preferred Omega over the other raids. Nothing can and will never compare back to Coil that was the very best.

[HyoMinPark]

if no one is willing to compromise then this seems to be more of a problem of a community not willing to share their toys with the other which goes to back to a point why I think there is some form of dishonesty going on here. I think what I've offered as a solution is pretty sound that doesn't step on anyone.

I don't throw the word dishonesty around very lightly, and I've seen my fair share MMOs on how they all ended up destroying themselves because the community didn't want to compromise on anything.

Re: compromise-- The Savage raiders have already compromised enough with the more casual/non-raiders. Our content has gotten progressively easier throughout the tiers to be made more accessible to the general playerbase: the first two Savage floors in Deltascape and Sigmascape have been complete jokes. Even the third floors are no Cruise Chaser, and Creator was the easiest tier of Heavensward. Even Extremes are easier than they used to be. Why should raiders and hardcore players that want challenges be the ones constantly making compromises just because others want the content they get without putting in the time and effort for it?

As I said before when you brought up Shinryu and Nidhogg: people were demanding both story mode fights be nerfed so as they required little more than a thought to them. Do you not think they'd do the same to normal mode Neo and God? Neo's Grand Crosses would probably be removed, as well as God's Forsakens (and probably Heartless Archangel would be removed as well), and that would basically leave them as nothing more than shiny striking dummies. I'd rather not see the fights so hollow, because sure the Savage ones have harder hitting mechanics and slight mechanic variences from normal mode, but they aren't really skeletons or shadows of their Savage self. I don't think the general playerbase would take kindly to Grand Crosses or Forsakens considering the past trend of crying for nerfs in fights that don't need it, and those are the mechanics that keep the fights interesting.

Savage is supposed to be hard; it's supposed to be difficult. Hence the name "Savage". If it's too mentally taxing for you, then that's fine; I have no issue with people who cannot mentally handle the demands of Savage. But that's not really a reason to have fights like Neo or God Kefka taken away from the raiders. That I do take issue with. Especially since they've already given up the difficulty of their original content so that more people can raid easier.

Yoshida has already said Savage won't be getting more difficult; not even a progressive difficulty from one tier to the next. Inb4 "You have Ultimate now"--yeah, and they're taking away the possibility of one in 4.51. (And still people ask for Ultimate to be made into a "normal mode" fight, or to be easier, or to be just outright removed from the game.)

And you know what? I work full time, have little time to game, and don't have the time to invest in savage. Not everyone's circumstances are the same. As an Aussie on JP servers, there is an added layer of difficulty to it all as well.

I was going to school full-time and still managed to clear Deltascape Savage during that while keeping up with my studies and getting high marks. Same with Sigmascape, save God--I was out of class by the time I cleared him if I recall, or in the middle of finals. That was all either me doing Party Finder (rarely) or just meeting with a static for 3 hours a night, two nights a week.

Plenty of people I raid with work full-time jobs or have families or go to school full-time, and they still find the time to dedicate to Savage. Yeah, you may clear at a slower pace, but they still dedicated the time to it because they wanted it. Same thing with high latency (since you mentioned your server situation). It's all about finding workarounds instead of using these things as reasons why you should get things.

[Dzian]

Personally the issue with raiding is it's lifespan. And the general gear itemization doesn't help.
Games are my hobbie and as a gamer I love challenges and will generally try and beat most games I play on the max difficulties sometimes for nothing more than a trophy that says I did it.. It's a hobbie so always something I want to be better at. To many peoplen ts just a part-time they don't care.

Raiding however I just don't bother. Because it's so temporary and so short lived it's just pointless. There is no worthwhile return on the investment. I raided in ARR. Cleared coils with no static or no hard core commitments entirely casual. Might decide I got a couple of hours might try t9. Throw up a pf holla at some ls friends see if they want to come and have a blast. I might try again the next day or in 2 weeks. It was entirely when I could be bothered. So the notion of needing statics and stuff is just wrong.

The big issue since 3.0 has been that raiding is just pointless on so many levels. The story isn't there. The gear isn't needed and isn't even good enough for entry into the next tier. It's so predictable you can guarantee when 4.4 lands there will be I380 crafted gear which blows 370 away. Especially these days where the stat jumps between ilevels are getting bigger and bigger.

The issue with vertical games is the reward has to be worth the effort and that's just not the case with raiding. Which i think is a big part of why xiv is considered so easy. Because the rewards are all so cheap, temporary and worthless and ultimately unnecessary. There's nothing in game you need i370 for. And when patch 4.4 lands you'll want i380 to start the next tier. So what is 370 actually good for.???

So longevity is what I'd like to see addressed going forward and actual value to the rewards. I used to be quite proud of my final witness title for example. But it's worthless now you can duo your way through most of coil. Undermines the value of the title.

Just not worth raiding with the current longevity and itemization systems.

Kinda sad when a psn trophy for smashing a game on extreme difficulty holds more value than clearing savage raids.. Because the psn holds its challenge. 2 years from now that trophy is just as hard to get thus it holds its value. 2 years from now that savage raid is rofl stomped this its meaningless.

[Rogatum]

Might not be popular opinion but Neo-Exdeath and God Kefka were fairly lack luster compared to older tier savage fights in terms of difficulty, but the enjoyment factor for me personal was awesome. I personally would not be against if they had a watered down version so other players can get albeit a watered down experience of those encounters. More options has never been a bad thing in my eyes.

[AxlStream]

This thing again? Look it's simple, if you want to see the fights, get off your behind and clear savage. Savage raids are the easiest they have ever been, the possibily of Ultimate and final form fights have been added to incite more players to do savage. They litterally rolled out the red carpet to everyone for SB.

[BillyKaplan]

More options has never been a bad thing in my eyes.

Only it factually is. Development is a zero-sum game, you can't have them developing this kind of thing without giving up on something. We already lost a dungeon every other patch for Ultimate and who knows what more, to stress the point.

[Awha]

Only it factually is. Development is a zero-sum game, you can't have them developing this kind of thing without giving up on something. We already lost a dungeon every other patch for Ultimate and who knows what more, to stress the point.

Not trying to assume what the person meant, but way I saw it was adding options for different types of players is not bad thing. Sure overall less content will be released but if more options were created it would allow for more people to experience what content we have. At the very least that is how I read more options are not a bad thing.

If that is what they were trying to say I agree to a degree. If they release a mode that is easier for players to take part in that uses the assets from unique encounters they get more bang for their buck so to speak when it comes to resources spent. I am no game designer, but I do not think it would be all that hard to make target dummy versions of those fights to please the players that wish to them. I have yet to clear any ultimate fight, but I have been enjoying my time in them, and a part of me is understanding as to why others would like to at the very experience a taste as to what they are like.

[Kaliesto]

These comments are becoming slightly antagonizing toward players that are "not them", and getting really defensive every time someone points out a flaw about these recent savage raids. This is a waste of time, what people are asking isn't much and this is acting like we're trying to destroy their sacred cow when this is not the case.

Don't come blaming us if there is not enough players doing these X-Scape Raids when it reaches that point. Some of you can say excuses excuses excuses, but it sounds like every time we point a flaw you all make a excuse for it.

[PyurBlue]

I don't think there is a problem if easy mode versions of Savage content are introduced. Players seeking a challenge can just ignore the easy mode. Have both the regular Savage and the easy mode unlocked by the normal raids, then it's just a matter of player choice on which to take.

That said, not everything in the game needs to accessible in terms of difficulty. I can see why people might be upset with the time requirements for Savage, although if you're not going for gear the time requirements are drastically reduced.

[Tsubaki75]

These comments are becoming slightly antagonizing toward players that are "not them", and getting really defensive every time someone points out a flaw about these recent savage raids. This is a waste of time, what people are asking isn't much and this is acting like we're trying to destroy their sacred cow when this is not the case.

I'm still not sure you are getting what savage raids are, there is a reason a smaller percentage of the player base does it and a reason why there are phases that are only in savage. You can't just lower outgoing damage and the amount of necessary damage to make a fight easier. Raids are a combination of not only damage but mechanics, adding neo or god kefka to a normal mode format will do nothing but fill the fourms with more plz nerf salt because ppl simply fail at mechanics (cough...titan, steps, nidhogg, thordan, seph, shinryu...cough). This game is filled with casual content, and hard content has been made easier so more ppl can access it, what more do you want.

Don't come blaming us if there is not enough players doing these X-Scape Raids when it reaches that point. Some of you can say excuses excuses excuses, but it sounds like every time we point a flaw you all make a excuse for it.

There will be plenty of players to do the content don't worry about that. And no one is making excuses, the content simply is not for everyone and shouldn't be. It isn't a flaw it's designed that way. If someone wants the experiance of the story or whatever they can either commit to learning and doing the content, or wait till they are grossly over-leveled and cheese it. At the end of the day everyone has access to the content, it's a choice if they want to do it or not.