Living Dead

[Izsha]

[QUOTE=DaulBan;4666514]snipQUOTE]

I did forget about Exdeath lightning. But in the history of the game, there are only a handful of tank busters that would 'beat' this immunity making the default "Immunity on a 2 min CD" and therefore absurdly powerful.

I wasn't talking about using CDs AND an immunity. That's utterly stupid. The example was of a multi hit tankbuster that you 'could' survive with CDs (because a tank buster has to be survivable...) is easily replaced by your proposed Holm-bene move. Even one powerful enough to barely survive throwing STRONG mitigation at it (50%+) would be easily taken point blank by yours, despite listing multi hit busters as a 'downside'. And do so better than holmgang. If a multi hit is powerful enough to eat 200% of your HP (including the overkill that triggered it so really OVER 200% HP), then traditional mitigation would require 3-4 CDs to survive comfortably and nothing actually hits THAT hard in this game as of now. The idea that regular (read not shared/weird thunder mechanic cheese) multi hit mega busters is a downside doesn't hold water when nothing strong enough to kill through this even exists.

The worst case scenario for yours is matching holm (surviving with very little HP after a multi hit buster). The best case scenario is the equivalent of holm+bene (survive and end 100% HP after ANY 1 hit buster, which is nearly all of them) on a 2 min timer. Which is ludicrous considering multi hit tank busters are pretty rare and have never been that strong to eat 2x HP bars. They are even less common once shelltron was introduced as it only takes 1 hit. The only downside is inability to cheese shared multi hit busters which is highly unusual/rare and oddly specific.

You made a holmgang that is WAY better than homgang, put it on a 2 min timer (by accident or not), and expected it to just be fine? Even at 3 it would set a new precedent for the most powerful defensive action in the game.

[DaulBan]

snip

I'm not saying that the ability wouldn't be really good because you're right, for 99% of the high damage mechanics in the game it would work just fine. However, in the scenarios where it does not work it will be absolutely terrible. A12S Holy Scourge/Chastening Heat combo, Dualcast lightning, these might not be common but for DRK should they be a major part of a fight they would render my version of LD useless.We live in a world where Sheltron is on a 25s cooldown and mitigates 30% of any hit you take, and the single thing that stops it from being absolutely balls to the wall nuts is that A it might get eaten by an auto if the boss has an untelegraphed cleave (A9S, A12S, Last Kiss) and that even with Bulwark you can't be certain you're going to block 100% of the hits you could take from Akh Morn and similar attacks. On every single hit telegraphed tankbuster you get 30% free mitigation as a Paladin assuming you have gauge, which you should. Every 90s then you have 50% mitigation on a single hit from just Rampart/Sheltron with no party benefit, or 60% with reprisal. If you're using Sentinel every 180s you get 80% mitigation.

That of course isn't how mitigation works in the game, the real values a bit lower than that but you get this gist. If PLD can have ~80% mitigation every 180s with 2 CDs (one of those being sheltron) and a reprisal we're already at a frankly insane amount of mitigation. DRK is in a similar spot with DM and TBN where if you go full turtle on magic you can 30% mitigation from DADM and an additional 20% HP from TBN. It's a mana sink but there you go, another insane method of taking a TB that reduces your incoming damage astronomically.

We already live in a world where on-demand mitigation has never been higher but the job that has the most difficulty handling mechanics is DRK when everything is physical. At two minutes the ability is busted, sure, but for me personally 180s being a Holm+Bene instantly isn't too insane when we already have things like 80% mitigation PLD wandering around blithely. Is it OP? Sure, but there are a lot of mechanics in this game that are OP and given that Holmgang, as I said, doesn't break anything in the game, I doubt that a 180s Living Dead with my description would substantially change how the game works. Debuffs that apply on hit will still exist, tank busters will still be around, DRK would just have one of the best defensive kits in the game which would not hurt tank balance anyways.

If anyone thinks this version of LD is OP, they're right, but the concept of the magical block is already OP enough to make mitigation in this game kinda dumb. There's obviously a range on how long the cooldown can be up to 5 minutes. That said as far as I'm concerned the game is already in a state (and has been since block could handle magic damage) where the tanks already have a plethora of incredibly strong mitigation options regardless.

[Kabooa]

Ill let you in on a secret. Pld using Shell(30%)+Sentinal(40%) gives the pld 172% effective HP. .

1.0 - (1.0 * .3) = 0.7
0.7 - (0.7 * .4) = 0.42.

At 0.5, this is a 100% increase in effective health (Taking 50% less damage, means your current health value is effectively doubled).

Paladin using SHell + Sentinal is approximately 238% effective HP.

TBN + Wall

1.0 - (1 x .3) = 0.7. This is approximately 144% effective HP.
TBN is 20% more health.

1.44 + (1.44 x .2) = approximately 173% effective HP.

"Healing" tax

Assuming two tanks with 60k hp each.

At 238% EHP, the paladin has an effective total of 142,800
At 144% EHP, the Dark Knight has an effective total of 86,400 + 17,280 (shield)

Throwing a tank Buster that won't kill either, but still require healing: 80,000 raw damage.

Paladin EHP / HP: 62,800 / 26,386
Dark Knight EHP / HP: 23,680 / 16,444

If Magic Buster

Add approximately 16% to the Dark Knight totals for DM and another 44% if DA DM.

Also, due to the way multiplicative reductions work, even if it's the same 'total' (30 + 40, 20 + 20 + 20 + 10, 50 + 20, etc), the less chunks it comes in, the better it is. Adding up to 70% mitigation effects is less powerful than a singular 70% mitigation effect. This is why the Sentinel number seems to absurd. 40% is better than 30% + 10%, and almost better than 30% + 20%, and why Shelltron, with its ability to scale, dumpsters TBN in single hit Scenarios.

[Izsha]

Snip

Accidentally had a * instead of / in my spreadsheet. Threw off everything. Math is hard. Deleted.