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  1. #41
    Player ManuelBravo's Avatar
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    Apr 2012
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    Milpitas , CA
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    2,142
    Character
    Shinigami Zetta
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Vstarstruck View Post


    I simply see my self is honest. If someone appears to be twisting things and make things sound better then what the situation is, it may be to blind defending or something. I do not see my self as "over-dramagzaion" I am just trying to express how I see what is going on, and I am not sure how else to say "You are just defending it for the sake of defending it without real rational reasoning. It just seems you just accept whatever is given to you. Such concepts are ok when it is a gift, however when you have many people paying for something, and you tell people just accept it, this is unfair to them. Thus this runs in why it appears people are simply white knighting. I may say blind to reflect the idea they are not seeing past "place is great because I find it fun" Such acts does not improve the game and without improvements you can't increase appeal to different personalities. Maybe SE can't do changes because servers can't handle having too many subs?
    Talk about an understatement, being can't even understand simple perspectives of other people.

    First of you should really think about how you response and perhaps step back and realize that you are dramatizing your responses. Just stick with facts and cut the extras. Express your self that way and perhaps you may get more people to agree with you and not feel that that your missing the whole point.

    Second; it's not a matter of accepting what is given to you, it's more of getting logical response about new content. Think about it, many people like Eureka, many people hate Eureka, yet I think that for being content that has been out less than a month and thinking its terrible because it's not to their liking is childish. At the very least try it out for a month. Some of us have already almost completed all of it's current content, including myself, so it really is not hard, SE has made XP adjustments based on feed back. Regardless of what a company does their will never be a 100% acceptance rate on content. If you step back and look at the bigger picture all companies change based on feed back. As an example take relics. All games MMO's / RPG's have some type of endgame weapon. Over the years online one have gone from extreme to a joke. Why do you think that is? The bottom line, to make money. Some of us enjoy hard content, and get upset when the company over nerfs something that is already easy enough. Again every person sees it differently and are entitled to speak out. No one is defending for the sake of defending without real rational reasoning. Now lets look at what makes a STRONG argument;

    A strong argument is a non-deductive argument that succeeds in providing probable, but not conclusive, logical support for its conclusion. A weak argument is a non-deductive argument that fails to provide probable support for its conclusion. ( hence drop the dramatization )

    This is basic to any company along with terms work smart not hard. Just like in any other business a company that works and achieves 100% every time will have a hard time next time. A company understands is not in their best interest to add too musch stress to their staff, it's not smart specially for programmers. ( If you have ever been to a fan fest Yoshi makes fun of this during Q& A ) company that gradually works with staff and their clients have a better chance of survival. While the company will never have 100% satisfaction it has to gauge what percentage is being affected the most. The current housing issue is an excellent example of this. SE has to gauge, optional service, or expanding content. in another words a priority list.Changes take time, I do programming and the grinding ours to make sure to get it to run smooth is no easy task. So please stop with the needless stuff, if your going to express yourself at the very least express your self on your perspective and drop the dramatization in it.
    (2)
    Last edited by ManuelBravo; 03-31-2018 at 12:07 AM.

  2. #42
    Player
    Ronyx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    Gridania
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    394
    Character
    Karse Farrence
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 72
    Eureka is the worst thing they had ever made and I'm playing since 1.0.
    (3)

  3. #43
    Player ManuelBravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Milpitas , CA
    Posts
    2,142
    Character
    Shinigami Zetta
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Ronyx View Post
    Eureka is the worst thing they had ever made and I'm playing since 1.0.
    Eureka is one of the best things I have played and I've been playing since beta, it is a nice change of pace from dungeons, easy tomes, some grinding aspects are a bit of a hassle but nothing too difficult. It's a bit too easy of content and wish they would of focused more on relics, kind of sad that people don't like it even after it has been nerfed, has not even been out for a month, and sometimes it gets irritating when people can be lazy at times and still get things done if they know how it works. Guess it sucks when people really don't understand it and just say it the worst with out really going into detail. Maybe SE would improve it more if it got more feed back just like they did when people mentioned the low XP and the loot boxes than vague comments with no specific reason.
    (2)

  4. #44
    Player
    Kinazu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
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    123
    Character
    Kinazu Langurag
    World
    Alpha
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    Eureka is one of the best things I have played and I've been playing since beta, it is a nice change of pace from dungeons, easy tomes, some grinding aspects are a bit of a hassle but nothing too difficult. It's a bit too easy of content and wish they would of focused more on relics, kind of sad that people don't like it even after it has been nerfed, has not even been out for a month, and sometimes it gets irritating when people can be lazy at times and still get things done if they know how it works. Guess it sucks when people really don't understand it and just say it the worst with out really going into detail. Maybe SE would improve it more if it got more feed back just like they did when people mentioned the low XP and the loot boxes than vague comments with no specific reason.
    It's good that you enjoy it, but it seems that a lot of people are unhappy with what Eureka turned out to be. And I for one am disappointed with it as well, to some degree.

    For something that had a 6 months delay I expected something more. Especially when few small QoL things are missing from the get-go:
    - An option to exchange multiple crystals at once (How did this go by unnoticed in the first place? The amount of currency we need is extremely high compared to any other type of content. I shouldn't be sitting 30 minutes in front of my screen clicking "next" all the time.)
    - A true level sync. (I can't help my lowered-level friends out because they gain 0 EXP when I am in a party with them.)

    Eureka is currently really solo-unfriendly, and that's fine. But why would they make it party unfriendly as well? I'd go in a lot more, and potentially enjoy it a lot more if I actually could help out my friends. But I can't.

    Besides the listed above QoL changes, I'd love to see these as well:
    - No "sharing" exp across a party. (Because let's be honest, if someone else tags a monster it'll devide the exp over all the people that tagged it. So in general it's not that great to have a full party because you'd get less EXP per monster. Let a monster just give a flat amount of EXP depending on the person's level. Or make it a hard tag: The party who tags an overworld monster first gets the full benefit.)
    - More tradeable/sellable items. (I'm really sorry but why did everything had to be untradeable in the first place? It's not rare. It only claims a lot of inventory space. Why didn't they think of making it stackable? We'd get loads of it anyway.)

    May it get too easy because of this? Maybe. But obtaining the relic shouldn't be a test of skill. It's just a grind, it always has been. And I agree, a grind it is; but for FFXIV to be claiming to cater to casual players, Eureka is in my opinion, doing anything but that. For people who work a full week and don't have a lot of time per day Eureka is a mess. Sure, they can do it in small steps but there are more people leaking out of Eureka than there are currently going in. Like others have said before, sometimes getting people to spawn Pazuzu is already a pain and Pazuzu is even needed to get your weapon done. Even if you'd increase the EXP gained and buff the crystal drops, you still need to get to the end levels of Eureka and that will take a good chunk of hours. Enough hours to justify it being called a grind.
    As for the more "hardcore" players Eureka isn't even worth the timesink besides getting a shiny weapon. Maybe later down the road when it comes closer to the ilvl you get from Savage, but that'll be only at the end of the expansion. I know they can't give us Savage-tier relic equipment this early, but I think an other step to bump it up to 365/360 respectively would already help a lot in that regard. Sure, it may then conflict with the Alliance raid gear, but then everyone would have more options as well.

    At the end of the day, Eureka turned out to be an other Diadem with even less to do. For something that we're supposed to farm a lot that just doesn't justify its current state especially considering the delay. I expected a lot more out of it: (Daily) Quests, Challenge Log entries, additional crafting and gathering content tied to it and something innovative. Something new. You may argue that the Magia board is just that, but the only thing it does (and the hard level scaling) is adding artificial difficulty.

    And as I said before, it's bleeding players already. Sure, it won't exactly die any time soon but how are people who join fresh at 5.x going to do the Stormblood relic? Unless they revamp pretty much the entire thing at the end of 4.x/launch of 5.0 they can't. It's not solo friendly enough and by then there won't be a lot of people wanting to do it anyway. As the people who wanted to have already completed it and probably don't want to enter ever again.
    And if they do decide on changing it down the road that'd also mean less resources to something else as well. What're we going to sacrifice then? A raid tier? A new Alliance raid? Another dungeon? For what's it worth I currently won't give Eureka a pass. Simply because we lost more (of the same) content for a huge (and pretty much brainless) grind that's again, more of the same.

    Also, you said it got nerfed, but I kind of have to disagree with that. The only things they've changed so far are:
    - EXP (and loot) gained from chains
    - Lockbox prices

    As for the EXP gained I wouldn't call it a nerf. I don't know how much the increase is but it's probably minor. Yet again, it won't effect the grind a lot because the amount of EXP needed is still the same. Unless they change that I wouldn't call it a nerf at all. Just an "adjustment".
    The lockboxes are something I couldn't care less about. It wasn't needed but it's a nice change for those who want to obtain something worth more out of it. Or plainly something they can use to improve their stats. I wouldn't go as far as saying it's a nerf either because you get a lot of boxes anyway.
    As for the real nerfs: I doubt that they won't come until we're halfway through the second part of Eureka. And the only thing they could probably "nerf" about it anyway is:
    - Amount of crystals needed per upgrade decreased
    - Amount of crystals drop per fate incerased
    - Crystal exchange amount increased

    I don't see them changing the EXP needed values because if we have to level more in the second part it needs to be counted throughout the entire board. So doing that would also nerf the second stage indirectly. Unless every instance of Eureka will have their level seperated (which I can't see being received well) I doubt they'll change the EXP values.
    (5)
    Last edited by Kinazu; 03-31-2018 at 01:35 AM. Reason: Typos and clearing small things up.

  5. #45
    Player ManuelBravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
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    Milpitas , CA
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    2,142
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    Shinigami Zetta
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kinazu View Post
    It's good that you enjoy it, but it seems that a lot of people are unhappy with what Eureka turned out to be. And I for one am disappointed with it as well, to some degree....

    You have very good valid points and I see where your coming from. However there are some points I do disagree with. In general you make very good and valid points so I will focus on the ones that I disagree with to an extend.
    Multiple crystals and loot boxes turn in,
    yes that needs to be addressed. After doing all anemo relics ( have crystals and feathers on last 4 just have not turned them in ) and saving loot boxes it has become an issue. I agree 100% that this needs to be improved. The firework update has been address...now it's a gear issue -.- with no de synth option or sells for 1-5 gill. ( another example SE will not always meet 100% satisfaction yet they did try )

    Solo unfriendly I disagree. Even when it came out I soloed do to more xp than in party until level 5, then on and off while looking for NM parties. There was a boost on xp for going solo and duo is actually really good when going on same level and above level mobs. Before as solo I was doing 100-500xp chains. Mixed with a few NM trains took me about 5 days being in eureka about 4-6 hours a day ( took time off for new content). So from my perspective I disagree to an extend. From my perspective those that understood the xp factors and how to speed them up yes the patch is a NERF meant for solo players.

    The whole XP penalty makes sense if people try to be helpful and really only mess up your chains so when I solo I shout and explain to pls not attack mob I'm focusing on. people were very supportive once I mentioned why.

    The level sync with friends? you could still help to spwan NM faster, just don't be in the same party so they can get Xp properly or become outside healer. Once Fate pops join them. So there are ways around this issue.

    Lastly; while it may seem like another diadem is the same format as the outside world playing solo. Just instead of spawning fates they are timed. Diadem you had star rank nms I would have love to see this in Eureka as unique NM's not fate ones for an xp boost. Once the next chapter of Eureka comes around they probably will increase the xp, after all they have nerfed most of the older content to an extend that is too easy and actually feels boring, tome anyways.

    I would like to complement you though, you make good valid point and at the very least they are logical and make sense.
    (0)
    Last edited by ManuelBravo; 03-31-2018 at 01:45 AM.

  6. #46
    Player
    Kinazu's Avatar
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    Oct 2016
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    Limsa Lominsa
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    123
    Character
    Kinazu Langurag
    World
    Alpha
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    I would like to complement you though, you make good valid point and at the very least they are logical and make sense.
    Thank you! I've tried my best to relay the points that I wanted to make. Hopefully I'll do it right this time as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    Multiple crystals and loot boxes turn in, yes that needs to be addressed. After doing all anemo relics ( have crystals and feathers on last 4 just have not turned them in ) and saving loot boxes it has become an issue. I agree 100% that this needs to be improved. The firework update has been address...now it's a gear issue -.- with no de synth option or sells for 1-5 gill. ( another example SE will not always meet 100% satisfaction yet they did try )
    Glad that you agree with me on this one. Though the fireworks were never a problem for me personally. (I love to collect prisms so they were welcome in my case.) My problem has always been the gear and housing items. You could make space in your inventory for the fireworks and be done with them, simply because they stack. Whereas gear and furniture doesn't and everytime you loot one of either it'll eat one part of your inventory until it's full. I think that part needs some adjustments. (And it would help out in the long run as well if we got stackable furniture.)

    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    Solo unfriendly I disagree. Even when it came out I soloed do to more xp than in party until level 5, then on and off while looking for NM parties. There was a boost on xp for going solo and duo is actually really good when going on same level and above level mobs. Before as solo I was doing 100-500xp chains. Mixed with a few NM trains took me about 5 days being in eureka about 4-6 hours a day ( took time off for new content). So from my perspective I disagree to an extend. From my perspective those that understood the xp factors and how to speed them up yes the patch is a NERF meant for solo players.
    I may have looked at it from a different perspective then. When I started Eureka I noticed that I only got around 10-30 EXP while killing a monster solo, while I needed 1.000 EXP to level up. I didn't like what I was seeing so I joined a party and we hunted monsters about 4-5 levels higher than ourselves. This gave me a lot more and I had a blast with the chatter as well.
    Of course this isn't for everyone and we all leveled differently. Althought I still fail to see how this was a nerf to solo-players, I'd be happy if you could enlighten me on that point.

    Now from a different perspective altogether: Let's say Eureka stays exactly as it is now for the entirety of Stormblood and 5.x. How are you supposed to solo it then?
    Sure leveling may be doable and you can slowly get Protean crystals. But what about the Anemos crystals? If you were alone in an instance I doubt you'd be able to take any fate on solo, unless you tried really hard and are playing as the right job. And then I'm not even talking about Pazuzu. Unless there'll be a complete overhaul it's likely that people who want to do this after a couple of expansions will just not get the chance to do it.
    I don't want them to make it more solo-friendly as of now, but I am worried for those who want to do it when we reach future expansions.

    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    The level sync with friends? you could still help to spwan NM faster, just don't be in the same party so they can get Xp properly or become outside healer. Once Fate pops join them. So there are ways around this issue.
    While I could do that, I still see it as an issue that I have to go out of my way to help my friends, whereas I kind of expect me to be able to play with my friends and help them out on any level being in End-Game Content. Why do we have end-game content in end-game content? Seems a bit far fetched to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by ManuelBravo View Post
    Lastly; while it may seem like another diadem is the same format as the outside world playing solo. Just instead of spawning fates they are timed. Diadem you had star rank nms I would have love to see this in Eureka as unique NM's not fate ones for an xp boost. Once the next chapter of Eureka comes around they probably will increase the xp, after all they have nerfed most of the older content to an extend that is too easy and actually feels boring, tome anyways.
    To be fair it is an other Diadem, with just less stuff to do. Like I said, they could've added some stuff to make it more attractive and give people more things to do. Sure, they will change stuff when the next chapter of Eureka arrives, they will add new stuff to keep us busy that's a given. I just honestly think it should've been there on release in the first place. A lot of what we see in Eureka is pretty much copy-paste and reskinned/recloured models that we've seen before. Maybe one, two or three new models and a few new particles and attacks. But other than that it doesn't add anything new. (Daily) Quests are as much copy-paste as what they did now as well. Why didn't they add them?
    I just don't understand why they made it an other Diadem in the first place. When people have been crying for it not to be an other Diadem. I appriciate the effort the devs put into this, I really do. The map looks great and the music's good like always (albeit a tad too slow for my taste, I'd have liked something more adventurous) It just doesn't add anything new. And at this point people are getting a bit fed up with the ongoing treadmill. Sure, it's nice knowing that you can skip a few patches and easily get back into action; but every now and then you need to give your players something new to keep them busy/happy.
    The devs tried Diadem, but it didn't succeed. Then we got Diadem 2.0 which lasted for a good month but it followed the same fate. So why did they decide to release a Diadem 3.0 (so to speak). I'm pretty sure that "3rd time's the charm" wasn't what they were hoping to achieve.

    They have released some new and interesting content over Heavensward though:
    - The Aquapolis is a good example and they even took it again with Stormblood by adding the Canals and later on expanding it to the Lost Canals.
    - The Palace of the Dead; It was well received and a lot of people enjoyed it because it was fresh, enjoyable and a new take on our dungeon system. We know that Stormblood will get its equivalent of it as well.

    These two show that they can do it and that it can be build upon as well. It just surprised me why they repeated Diadem 3 times at this point.
    (1)
    Last edited by Kinazu; 03-31-2018 at 02:58 AM. Reason: Typos and minor clean-up.

  7. #47
    Player
    Laerad3993's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
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    472
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    Aisha Clan-clan
    World
    Behemoth
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    Pugilist Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Ronyx View Post
    Eureka is the worst thing they had ever made and I'm playing since 1.0.
    Diadem was far worse than Eureka. I’ll also throw in the Atma grind, and Alexandrite/Books from 2.X.
    (0)

  8. #48
    Player
    Thayos's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    601
    Character
    Thayos Redblade
    World
    Hyperion
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    Gladiator Lv 80
    I bet Eureka will be lots of fun when the crowds die down and SE implements a level sync. In fact, SE could keep the content viable simply by adding new glamor gear and mounts to be gained with new types of crystals!

    Please, SE, make it happen!
    (0)

  9. #49
    Player
    Yeol's Avatar
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    Jan 2016
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    1,309
    Character
    Dr Yeol
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 100
    I would say people are not hating Eureka, because it is not fully released yet. They are hating on the first step of the relic.
    Once the final step of the relic is out (Should be at the end of Stromblood) then you can decide whether Eureka as a whole was a fail or not.
    (2)

  10. #50
    Player
    Synrin's Avatar
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    Jan 2016
    Location
    Gridania
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    632
    Character
    Mel Az
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 80
    Not to OP, just a general thougt;

    The current issue with Eureka, Anemos is YOU.

    The players, the player base, all of us. That is its LARGEST ISSUE. People unwilling and unable to communicate or co-operate.
    People who don't give a flying crap and set other players back. People who make other players' experience a nightmare.

    Or do people on these forums expect SE to fix their attitude as well? Please, take a look in the mirror in the morning. Thanks.

    /rantover
    (2)

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