Why going back 10 years doing Korean Farming Content?

[NovaLevossida]

People asked for it. They wanted some XI type of content. Here it is enjoy.
Eureka is exactly what I thought it's gonna be.
Relics were always about grind and they will always be.
At least now we got a new pretty big map and some Lore to grind in.

This is not XI content. This is XI's Valkurm Dunes exp parties. This is XI content:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4612918

What Eureka is... is what people specifically asked them not to do: Diadem 3.0.

[aeoncs]

Even then, about players communicating desires with clarity, the single most stated sentiment on the forums while they were developing this content was "don't make it Diadem."

...yeah. :/

And it's not. Eureka is actually fun to explore and offers you a lot of freedom in how you want to level/progress. It's really not Eureka's fault that most players choose to play the AoE 'em down game instead of trying out different things. As ChocoFeru said, it's not even the fastest way to level, not even close. Also, some of the NMs actually do have kinda fun mechanics that will easily wipe a horde of players if a large part of them choose to ignore said mechanics.

That being said, if you want to have ANY fun in Eureka, you have to go in with a group of friends, ideally 6+. Figure out stuff and explore together to find the most fun way for yourselves to progress through it. If you give it a chance, it can be fun, despite some obvious shortcomings.

The concept itself has great potential as well, unlike Diadem. There's a lot to be built upon and if we give them proper feedback instead of xx "wah wah korea grind boring" threads, they might actually do it. But to offer that kind of feedback, people would have to give the content a fair shot instead of immediately jumping on the hate bandwagon.
While Daily/Weekly quests would be a nice addition, I think what Eureka really needs is more interactive content - Fates that are more than NMs and make you interact with the world, I'm thinking of GW2-style events here. Since they've started working on jumping puzzles, they could also add a few and reward players with crystals and/or lockboxes for succeeding. I mean, they don't even have to come up with entirely new stuff, they simply have to take a look at some other MMORPGs and work with that.

[NovaLevossida]

And it's not. Eureka is actually fun to explore and offers you a lot of freedom in how you want to level/progress. It's really not Eureka's fault that most players choose to play the AoE 'em down game instead of trying out different things. As ChocoFeru said, it's not even the fastest way to level, not even close. Also, some of the NMs actually do have kinda fun mechanics that will easily wipe a horde of players if a large part of them choose to ignore said mechanics.

That being said, if you want to have ANY fun in Eureka, you have to go in with a group of friends, ideally 6+. Figure out stuff and explore together to find the most fun way for yourselves to progress through it. If you give it a chance, it can be fun, despite some obvious shortcomings.

The concept itself has great potential as well, unlike Diadem. There's a lot to be built upon and if we give them proper feedback instead of xx "wah wah korea grind boring" threads, they might actually do it. But to offer that kind of feedback, people would have to give the content a fair shot instead of immediately jumping on the hate bandwagon.
While Daily/Weekly quests would be a nice addition, I think what Eureka really needs is more interactive content - Fates that are more than NMs and make you interact with the world, I'm thinking of GW2-style events here. Since they've started working on jumping puzzles, they could also add a few and reward players with crystals and/or lockboxes for succeeding. I mean, they don't even have to come up with entirely new stuff, they simply have to take a look at some other MMORPGs and work with that.

It truly is Diadem though. I am however giving it a bit of time to see if it gets more interesting, but it is truly at its core Diadem. However, I'll be waiting on player reports and findings to see if it gets any "better." I'm not sure that I personally want to do it any more at the risk of non-stop combat potentially giving hand cramps or carpal tunnel syndrome-like pain.

That said, the potential argument holds no merit. That was used to excuse Diadem both times ("it's the foundation for something better they can build off of!") which led us to Eureka being only slightly less bland than Diadem. They've had three tries to get this right and not make it a boring slog.

[Stanelis]

I don't understand how this took a 1.5 years of development and no lessons learned from why Diadem was a disaster both times it launched. It'd be one thing if I understood why they did it. But the only thing I can take away is that they themselves just don't understand.

It makes perfect senses when you take into account the fact that FFXIV's marketing ("please look forward to it") is built on Yoshida's empty promises. Eureka was the big stormblood carrot to make long term players look forward the expansion. Once the content has been delivered and as it is, as alway, a poorly designed half assed mess, you re loosing the carrot.

[Binahel]

And it's not. Eureka is actually fun to explore and offers you a lot of freedom in how you want to level/progress

Fun to explore?
Did you explore the area? it's just a small isle with no surprises - just a few houses. I explored it all and there is nothing special but a NPC that gives a buff.
I also saw various NM and so far they're just blue fates with nothing special.

Freedom in what sense?
You MUST go with people of the same level, forced to get better exp on an endless chain. this is not freedom - you can't do it in any other way if you want to get the crystals. Sure, you can solo at a low speed but that's not what I would call freedom. I really fail to see the freedom in a content that locks you being in party and chaining 1 mob after the other.

I am hoping this is just the tip of the iceberg anyway.
Maybe we are doing something really wrong and that's why we did not get to the wonderful and innovative part the devs promised to us.

[aeoncs]

It truly is Diadem though. I am however giving it a bit of time to see if it gets more interesting, but it is truly at its core Diadem.

It's really not. But suit yourself.

That said, the potential argument holds no merit. That was used to excuse Diadem both times ("it's the foundation for something better they can build off of!") which led us to Eureka being only slightly less bland than Diadem. They've had three tries to get this right and not make it a boring slog.

And each and every time all the general forums did was complain and whine, instead of offering actual feedback and suggestions; well, that's at least true for 90%+. I'm not trying to excuse the devs taking such a long time to release content like that, I'm just saying that each time it happens, we as the community can at least try to help it improve.

[aeoncs]

Fun to explore?
Did you explore the area? it's just a small isle with so surprises - just a few houses. I explored it all and there is nothing special but a NPC that gives a buff.
I also saw various NM and so far they're just blue fates with nothing special.

We did and our FC group had a lot of fun doing so. Searching and finding the spots Krile mentioned, looking for and optimizing secluded farm spots, just trying to see anything and everything. And idk what kind of NMs you've been doing but saying that they're "just blue fates with nothing special" makes me wonder if you truly did more than the 1-2 starting ones. Especially NumberJ and Callisto come to mind thus far.

Freedom in what sense?
You MUST go with people of the same level, forced to get better exp on an endless chain. this is not freedom - you can't do it in any other way if you want to get the crystals. Sure, you can solo at a low speed but that's not what I would call freedom. I really fail to see the freedom in a content that locks you being in party and chaining 1 mob after the other.

Freedom in the sense of having multiple ways to progress. First and foremost, it's nonsense that everyone in the group has to be on the exact same level and getting people to catch up into a somewhat reliable range is super easy.
You can absolutely solo or at least duo farm and keep the chain going easily. You can also choose between AoE'ing mobs of your own level and taking on way higher level mobs one after the other - AoEing gets you considerably more crystals while highlevel mobs get you levels faster - THAT is freedom, no matter how you slice it.

[Vidu]

We did and our FC group had a lot of fun doing so. Searching and finding the spots Krile mentioned, looking for and optimizing secluded farm spots, just trying to see anything and everything. And idk what kind of NMs you've been doing but saying that they're "just blue fates with nothing special" makes me wonder if you truly did more than the 1-2 starting ones. Especially NumberJ and Callisto come to mind thus far.

You've got a point there - looking for the spots Krile mentioned was fun.
Exploring the new areas was fun aswell.
I'm glad I have some of both left to do because you know what the problem here is? Thats a one time thing. After that it looks as if its gonna be killing mobs... waiting for the NM to spawn and the like.
If exploring and finding hidden objects would have been the core aspect of this, I would like it a lot more. But from the looks of it the core aspect is: Kill mobs, pray for crystals to drop.

The thing is: We spend about 2 hours in Eureka yesterday (granted, not that much to judge from yet), but the major part was spend with killing mobs (not fun). Maybe 15 minutes were spend with looking for the spot Krile mentioned (was fun) and another 15 with quests and explantions and the like (was okay). The core gameplay here just isnt or wasnt fun.
Right now it feels to me that I'm not grinding for rewards as in items but for rewards as in "something fun to do".

Eureka needs less mob zerging and more fun, intresting things to do - maybe thats gonna happen on higher levels, but to be frank: I doubt it. It doesnt look like it so far with the core mechanic obviously being to murder monsters while standing in a prime spawn location.

[Reynhart]

(granted, not that much to judge from yet)

With that little time in Diadem 2.0, most people didn't realize that special expedition existed, which was considered the only interesting thing in this mess. Let's give it some more time.

[Binahel]

Freedom in the sense of having multiple ways to progress. First and foremost, it's nonsense that everyone in the group has to be on the exact same level and getting people to catch up into a somewhat reliable range is super easy.
... - THAT is freedom, no matter how you slice it.

So in your opinion freedom is basically a way of slicing mobs in different ways. I would argue that, in the end, you're simply and only slicing mobs to the bitter end with no other mechanics.
also on the point of exploring: I am drawn by FFXIV because it has beautiful places to explore and also lore. it was the same in FFXI - there was for example a hidden painted wall depicting the story of the Galkan race in a tomb without any explanations, just for the sake of lore- but here in Eureka it's just a few new mobs and wilderness - a beautiful wilderness with no meaning so far.