Yoshi-P making a big mistake with what yall doing the housing

[Nerfworthy]

This has got to be a troll post, right? .. Right?

If houses weren't finite this would not even be an issue, but alas, that being said...Majority of houses at this moment belong to individual players. FCs need to be given the first shot because important content is gated behind housing for FCs! Not to mention a single house benefits many more players to an FC than it does to an individual owner.

[EmmaVirgin]

SE apparently cant give us what we want - unlimited housing

and this is just MISERABLE in a subbased game. even free2play games can solve this problem.

[ChameleonMS]

OP, as a player without personal house, I think it is completely fair that FCs are getting first dibs. FC housing services more players, which is best available trade off when housing is a limited as it currently is and will be for the foreseeable future.

Then you're in the wrong FCs. I let any of my members use the gardens all they have to do is ask. Mind you only one person has the ability to use them at a time to prevent trolls griefing ( removing ) / stealing plants. Finding the right FC can take time. Most FC leaders & officers are greedy when it comes to gardens/workshops when there is no need to be. So I don't disagree that most FCs are indeed exactly like what you've stated.

It's not so much the wrong FC and the FC owners are not typically greedy SOBs. Too many FCs have been burned by "trusted" members and SE has done next to nothing to police these actions in the past. There is just a culture of fear due to no restitution options available.

I am no better than the next FC leadership member in regards to this because we have been burned before. Lost several million gil, chest items and our house was demolished. It was pretty bad and when we complained the response was basically "Tough luck. Learn and move on."
Our lowest rank is restrictive, pretty much on Chocobo stable and general house access only. We only keep people at that rank for about a week or two to give them enough time to leave us for somewhere if we are not a fit.
Our next rank allows purchasing and execution of FC actions, and garden planting.
Our next rank allows furniture placement, orchestration, and some FC chest removal permissions.
After this point you into the leadership ranks, which have unfettered access.

It’s my assumption that they did this because they won’t be allowed to have multiple characters on the same servers in a FC together, thus denying them of the precious convenience of trading millions of Gil to each other in a flash via the FC chest. The new restrictions are a pretty big pain in the tail for RMTers, so that's a good thing at least!

There is another significant reason the RMTs are making "fake FCs". The RMTs planning on selling the plots for profit now must deal with a random plot repurchase timer; which does not "guarantee" the buyer access to the demolished plot. The buyer will have to join the FC and just purchase the FC as whole and get the house instantly. FC selling has always been allowed and the RMT are just moving more aggressively in that direction, in comparison to the past.

[NanaWiloh]

Then you're in the wrong FCs. I let any of my members use the gardens all they have to do is ask. Mind you only one person has the ability to use them at a time to prevent trolls griefing ( removing ) / stealing plants. Finding the right FC can take time. Most FC leaders & officers are greedy when it comes to gardens/workshops when there is no need to be. So I don't disagree that most FCs are indeed exactly like what you've stated.

FC's who restrict access too gardens/workshops/house decorating do it too avoid drama and theft. The bigger an FC is the more likey drama and theft will occur with in the FC. There is a limit too how far granting access can go once you hit that limit you got two choices. Swim in the drama and like it, or Restrict access and completely avoid the drama all togather. Even your method of handling will only work up too a point; then you yourself will say screw this and limit who has access.

[Usho]

FC rooms cost 300k from what I remember. Apartments cost 500k. It's only a extra 200k for the apartment and you get to KEEP THE APARTMENT FOREVER (unless you change servers and or want to move to another residential district but you can just buy another one anyway).

With FC's, if s**t goes down, you get kicked from a FC and or you don't like the FC and want to leave but already invested in a FC room, it's a waste of gil, hence why people should just save up for apartments of their own

FC's getting first dibs is meh imo. Let people get their own personal place first, then open up to FC's getting their places.

Or even better...maybe as some have said...give the players what they want unlimited housing (like FFXI). Making more wards won't change or solve anything and this process will keep repeating itself in a endless loop til yoshi-fail finally mans up and actually listen to the concerns of his players.

/2 cents

[Vidu]

and this is just MISERABLE in a subbased game. even free2play games can solve this problem.

Probably because they set it up differently from the start.

Mistakes have been made here, yes - no on is denying that, not even SE/the devs themself or they wouldnt have started working on solutions and fixes.
You know what? Sometimes I'm getting the impression that a bad housing system is excatly what some people want because it gives them another reason to complain - as I said before: This complaint has been made over and over again and they've started working on it. I dont want to whiteknight here, but I'm so sick of people just yelling and shouting and complaining - and while doing all of that totally overlooking any progress and failing to see that "Just give us unlimited wards" isnt working. Might be working in other games, doesnt mean its working here - and they've made it pretty clear that it is indeed not possible.
Threads and post like these, when there are excisting threads along with the devs very clearly looking into the whole issue are only serving one purpose: Venting. And that doesnt need a new thread each time, which is whats bothering me here a little...

When the housing system was set up, it wasnt meant for everyone to have a house - I dont know why, but the devs wanted this to be an FC-thing. Maybe even to meet player-demand of more FC-content (something they did with airships and Diadem... and guess what: People, who wanted more FC-content, complained. Or at least there were people, who wanted more FC-content and people, who complained when we got it. Not sure if those people are the same or two groups or a mix of both).
Anyways, FC-only housing would have been fine, specially with the gil-sink that it really, really was back then.
Then people complained because they wanted personal houses and back then it was still a huge gil-sink, so not everyone who played through the mainstory and never touched a crafter in their life had enough gil to buy a house.
The inflation happend. And they lowered the housing-prices. And you know what? I'd call that their biggest mistake: Creating the illusion that everyone has the gil to buy a house. Aka the illusion that everyone should have a house. Something that was never meant to be. Something thats just not possible with the current system because the current system was set up with something different in mind.

But what do we do now? Just delete housing alltogether? Eliminate the whole system? Or maybe, just maybe, sit tight and remind ourselves that they've realised that there is an issue and are apparently and hopefully working on those bigger apartments for example. While not giving into the illusion that people wont find something to complain about those aswell...

I get it. The housing system right now isnt what we want, because SE had a different plan for it. A plan that once might have worked, but that they slowly underminde themself. Its up to them now to fix it - and it seems they are. Does it really need another thread every few days to complain when there are several already?

Or even better...maybe as some have said...give the players what they unlimited housing (like FFXI). Making more wards won't change or solve anything and this process will keep repeating itself in a endless loop til yoshi-fail finally mans up and actually listen to the concerns of his players.

Would "working on bigger apartments" count? Because... thats what they seem to look into.
And from what I understand from another thread on this matter: Housing in FFXI might have been unlimited when it came to everyone having a house, but was very much limited when it came to decorating that house - I've never played FFXI but if I'm not totally wrong wasnt that MogHome only something like a slightly better innroom at the start? That got only bigger and more elaborate over the years?

Bottomline: Why do you guys fail to realise that they DO listen - but that that doesnt mean that we've got a brand new, shiny, all problems fixed housing system the next day? Specially after the whole 4.1-Shirogane-shit they've showed very much that they understand that theres a housing-problem. Took them long enough, granted. And I understand that you might not want to give them credit before anything is really done, but that needs time. Magic in this game is limited to our characters, I'm afraid...

[Youkulm]

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You guys know you can restrict who can remove items, gil and demolish a house without over controlling your members interaction with housing right? All the tools are there. Example: ALL of my members have the ability to use the workshop to make /anything/ or go into Diadem, but only officers can cancel progress or collect and item. Make sense?

I've been in too many FCs with controlling leaders, I had one FC leader who wouldn't even let us use the Orchestrion. Just like Rinoku, this is why I made my own FC, to have a place where people would actually be able to use housing features. You can be generous to your FC members without being burned. You just have to be smarter with permissions and ranks.

Anyway I digress. This isn't the subject of the thread!

Back on topic.

They're not making a mistake lettings FC's have first dibs. My opinion? The mistake was personal housing having the same system...

[Usho]

Making more wards won't change or solve anything and this process will keep repeating itself in a endless loop til yoshi-fail finally mans up and actually listens to the concerns of his players.

[Youkulm]

Making more wards won't change or solve anything and this process will keep repeating itself in a endless loop til yoshi-fail finally mans up and actually listens to the concerns of his players.

This is so true. It hurts my brain that they still don't seem to understand this. The only time when houses will start to free up for players in large masses is when no one will want them anymore. That is a long time from now.

[Okamimaru]

Can't wait to relocate to one of the new wards just because I'm hoping it will be more lively than my current ward... solo homeowners don't make wards feel alive... fcs are better at that