Monk 4.2 Adjustments

[Mahrze]

well its mnks expansion so we might forgive se for overtuning them this tier... like drg got a noticeable push with HW (or shortly after)... Im just wondering how op one of the caster cls will be... if they ever make a story tier based on a caster cls... q.q

MNK wasn't over-tuned though, the changes fall on a QoL range.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_tk_edition/

It makes sense to me that monk would have the dps if we can legit assume mantra = raise. It could because those are both very strong abilites. Now if you make BT impacts magical damage to increase your rdps, it means you indirectly buff the casters/smn aswell. It would definitely put mnk in a very strong spot and boost casters at the same time.

Note : my last post was again a response to wereotter which claims again that smn should be tuned down to RDM. It has nothing to do with smn vs mnk.

MNK could easily do that if they replace blunt for magic down and make MNK damage type unaspected/magical. Steel Peak as a oGCD would work amazing with that. So would purification, I mean the ways that MNK could work as a cornerstone for a caster comp are plenty but you get the idea.

And no, SMN shouldn't fall as low as RDM.

[wereotter]

It makes sense to me that monk would have the dps if we can legit assume mantra = raise. It could because those are both very strong abilites. Now if you make BT impacts magical damage to increase your rdps, it means you indirectly buff the casters/smn aswell. It would definitely put mnk in a very strong spot and boost casters at the same time.

Note : my last post was again a response to wereotter which claims again that smn should be tuned down to RDM. It has nothing to do with smn vs mnk.

Comparing the utility offered by RDM and SMN as well as general job mobility, I stand by my statement that they two should do roughly the same DPS (which is what I have said the entire time) and that SMN was outperforming on DPS as a result of what it offers AND off its ability to move during a raid while maintaining damage. So yes, I think SMN wasn't hit hard enough, but that's obviously not my choice to make, and while we're at it, I think RDM needed to be brought up.

But that's the last I'm going to talk about casters here. This is a thread to talk about MONK changes, not about summoner. Maybe you could start your own thread rather than hijack someone else's.

[Daronis]

MNK could easily do that if they replace blunt for magic down and make MNK damage type unaspected/magical. Steel Peak as a oGCD would work amazing with that. So would purification, I mean the ways that MNK could work as a cornerstone for a caster comp are plenty but you get the idea.

And no, SMN shouldn't fall as low as RDM.

We've always quietly complained that our blunt damage reduction was kind of useless since we were the only class that benefited from it but why not make it magical damage reduction? Making Brotherhood boost magical damage as well would further solidify that synergy. It would give us the same type of relationship to casters that dragoons have to the 2 range physical dps classes. Sure they might reduce our damage a little bit if they were to do that but it would be a way to boost casters and give monk a different role since they gave samurai the role we were used to doing for so long.

[Mahrze]

We've always quietly complained that our blunt damage reduction was kind of useless since we were the only class that benefited from it but why not make it magical damage reduction? Making Brotherhood boost magical damage as well would further solidify that synergy. It would give us the same type of relationship to casters that dragoons have to the 2 range physical dps classes. Sure they might reduce our damage a little bit if they were to do that but it would be a way to boost casters and give monk a different role since they gave samurai the role we were used to doing for so long.

Like I've said in a lot of MNK topics. MNK is a chaotic cake layered with half-baked things with so much potential. Sounds like SMN now that I think about it xD

[Remedi]

We've always quietly complained that our blunt damage reduction was kind of useless since we were the only class that benefited from it but why not make it magical damage reduction? Making Brotherhood boost magical damage as well would further solidify that synergy. It would give us the same type of relationship to casters that dragoons have to the 2 range physical dps classes. Sure they might reduce our damage a little bit if they were to do that but it would be a way to boost casters and give monk a different role since they gave samurai the role we were used to doing for so long.

You know It is something that I come up with too, imho removing disembowel because of the sinergy it creates with ranged is a pretty boring idea not to mention that it wouldn't solve much, why not simply creating a sinergy for casters with a melee job? I mean It's worth a shot and would fix some problems casters have

[Shiroe]

if mnks could make targets ca. 5% more magic vulnerable (maybe with the blunt vun togeather), .. me might just have a "parallel" magic meta with 3 casters + mnk (and brotherhood stilk works now on the mnk.., and with 2 tanks anyway)

just the 60 sec PB is stilk OP, .. but in a caster meta, would not be so OP, cause there are less or no "burst" windows to aline the CD with

meaning if the mnk wants speedkills, he goes with 3 casters, but in that case has less personal dps..

in another comps (with group buffs / buff windows), the mnk could have high personal dps, but not kill as fast as wuth 3 casters...

while a blm (or smn) will be the same,.. will kill faster in a 3 caster + mnk comp,.. but have higher personsal ps in other comps (but no speedkill)

can chose either (fflogs personal dps) or (fflogs speedkills),.. but ro fair not both

[Mahrze]

This is a thread to talk about MONK changes, not about summoner. Maybe you could start your own thread rather than hijack someone else's.

Now now, we're coming into a good shared conclusion which casters can support. Which is MNKs blunt damage also adding magic damage weakness.

Why not simply creating a sinergy for casters with a melee job? I mean It's worth a shot and would fix some problems casters have

Yup, and since NIN already works with Slashing. MNK would be able to benefit casters and PLD+DRK since some damage for those two tanks are magical iirc

if mnks could make targets ca. 5% more magic vulnerable (maybe with the blunt vun togeather), .. me might just have a "parallel" magic meta with 3 casters + mnk (and brotherhood stilk works now on the mnk.., and with 2 tanks anyway)

Brotherhood wouldn't really need to follow that limitation, could easily be 5% damage for the team, regardless of job type. Chakra procs can come from oCGDs from casters and weapon skills from jobs that have it (RDM would have both, SMNs Ifrit could also help MNK in that regard) So there is plenty to work with as synergy with these jobs if SE would listen and make MNK add 5% magic vuln.

just the 60 sec PB is stilk OP, .. but in a caster meta, would not be so OP, cause there are less or no "burst" windows to aline the CD with

Sorry to break it to you but PB on 60s only helps MNK with recovery time on Phase Changes.

[wereotter]

Dragon Kick giving added magic vulnerability would be an interesting change, and would enable them to do what monks have wanted for a while, carry 4 stacks of greased lightning, AND give us more raid utility. (not just with casters but with Paladins and Ninjas as well)

Monk DPS wouldn't suffer if both changes are implemented considering the 10% damage resist we'd lose from Dragon Kick could be offset with another 10% damage from a 4th stack of Greased Lightning. Give both at level 50, and I think you've got a pretty good set up.

[wereotter]

Adding to above, if you did make that change, certain monk skills might need to be changed to magic damage as well in order to encourage monks to use it. Elixir Field and Howling Fist seem easy targets, as well as the elemental tackles.

[Megguido]

uhm... lately you face way more caster pfs than melee pfs... also just using ifrit on sic is what wtjs do who actually either don't wanna mess with micromanage or didn't know when to switch... if you really wanna call yourself smn by heart you either use ruda on obey to line up con with your (caster-pf) mates or even better (but also rare, haven't seen someone doing it in pf-grps for a while) you use both egis and their buffs in the same fight depending on the situation/mechanic - since casttime and mp allow you to switch them midfight/during or before the opener.

can't stand fakenews sry... Shiroe is right pets on obey always > sic. talking about only using sicfrit clearly shows who jumped on the 4.1 train just for fame and who didnt...

I actually started the game as SMN (well, ACN actually) and SMN has always been my main job, so please avoid the personal attacks about the "4.1 train" and the "u use sicfrit ur not smn by heart xd" bullshit.

That said, pet AI is unresponsive to say the least and succeeding to sync Contagion with your Bahamut phase (or your caster mate's burst phase, but since SMN has the highest DPS of all three casters, the raid will gain more damage if you align Contagion with your burst phase, not the RDM's) is a real pain because of how inconsistent it is. So yes, micromanaging the pet is difficult for a small DPS gain. Honestly, I don't see any good reason to use Ifrit on Obey, unless you want to perfectly time the Radiant shield for maximum damage, but then you'll delay said Radiant shield and will probably lose one (or more) use of it over the length of the fight, which is actually a DPS loss.

Pets on Obey > Pets on Sic is true for Scholars, whose pets have only situational spells that you must use at a precise timing. Summoner's pets have only DPS spells, and it matters little when they use it (beside Contagion, but considering how hard it is to line it up with anything).

If you are good enough to manage your pet over all the oGCD abilities that you have to carefully manipulate, that's great. But consider that adjusting your rotation may be a far greater DPS gain than micromanaging pets. But oh well, whatever floats you boat.