The Journey - Is It Still Wanted?

[Hanemakikaze]

It sounds like something was keeping you in the game despite your utter hatred for it...funny.

To be more on point MMOs are not "Better" going the easy route or the hard route, it's a matter of opinion (OMG I know right?) wether the game direction suits your tastes or not. Calling people masochists just because they don't feel like leveling to 50 in a single day is rewarding is...well idiotic.

There are two main splinters in the MMO market.

On one hand you have players who want leveling and the world to be alive and vivid, they want leveling your character to feel as a extremly important step in the game if not a extremly large portion of the game. With multiple ways to strengthen your character vertically and horizontally, they want content that spreads over the new-max level ranges and gives everyone equal oportunity to play, and have something to do despite your level.

On the other hand you have people who feel leveling shoudl fall to the wayside and progression should be made entirely through gear obtained from the end-game enviroment, they don't care how they get to max rank and perhaps wish leveling didn't exist at all. They tend to revolve around a instant gratification scheme where content is quick and easy to get into and complete.

I may be a bit schewed in my comparison, but people who tend to find any time consuming content to be "Boring, useless..." tend to not want to spend time accomplishing well....anything. How the former model works in the long run is beyond me, I can only imagine it be sustained by constantly pushing the boundries of the game (Level cap increases, obsoleting armour every few weeks) hell WoW the game that heralded this style is seemingly buckling under itself due to this odd developement cycle.

It's a matter of opinion, to call someone stupid or masochistic because they don't align with your tastes is just....asanine.

Obviously I'm in the catagory of wanting to spend time earning my achievments and progression, I find it funny that I don't have much time to dedicate to the game yet I still favour this style of progression. You would be amazed at how many people try to point out I have too much free time if I decide that I want to have the game last me for years and have a long leveling curve.

Something kept me there even for my hatred for it? Yeah my friends, had nothing to do with the game being enjoyable, that was the one savior of the game for me was my LS and only reason I played for so long, they were and still are fun people to be around. And yes, I think people wanting to waste hours to get 1 level at around level 25 are masochists, like you said it's my opinion. Do I think you have to much time on your hands? No, you're free to do as you please I don't care how anyone spends it. The way I see leveling is the longer you stay lower the longer it takes to reach the actual fun content where you're not just grinding the same mob repeatedly for hours, waiting for hours to get a full group formed or invited to one.

Sure, the first time through on your first class is fine & all but on the next it just becomes an even more tedious task though fun at times. Kind of why I somewhat favor PL. But I'm talking about FFXIV, XI on the other hand...I remember trying to level my dragoon, that almost made me quit many times. Was damn near impossible to get an invite & forming a party for it was no cake walk either. If people played XI in the earlier days like they claimed to, they know exactly what I'm talking about. I remember literally having to wait days to get into a party and even if they were complete trash I took it because I had no choice. Bottom line is, let's not go back in that direction I like where Yoshi is headed the way exp & parties are currently and his current stance on PL.

[Jynx]

The way I see leveling is the longer you stay lower the longer it takes to reach the actual fun content

This is where your opinion and mine differ then.

I always had tons of stuff do do in XI regardless of my level, and I had tons of fun doing it.

Genkai quests
AF quests
SOLO (Yes it was viable for any class even in the "Early days")
Umpteen ammounts of quests that were extremly fulfilling either by reward of rare and expensive spells or priceless maps.
Friends to play with
Friends to help
Friends to explore with

Funny thing is I never had to be a specific level to help/play/laugh with my friends. My level was irrelivant in the long run, we did things because we wanted too. Not for the gear, not for the reward, but for the hell of it, just to see the person you helped say "Thanks man!"

Short sightedness like people spewing bile at the leveling process in a game upsets me because it's in that "Grind" where friendships and bonds are formed. People working towards a common goal, when you take all the challenge out of that it just becomes...boring.

PLing in XI was a far cry from what it is in XIV, having unlimited healing and having somone utterly destroy a group of monsters for you are two totally different stories. If Yoshida wants us to help our friends out...that's perfectly fine. Just don't let us do all the work for our friends, thats just stupid.

[Hanemakikaze]

This is where your opinion and mine differ then.

I always had tons of stuff do do in XI regardless of my level, and I had tons of fun doing it.

Genkai quests
AF quests
SOLO (Yes it was viable for any class even in the "Early days")
Umpteen ammounts of quests that were extremly fulfilling either by reward of rare and expensive spells or priceless maps.
Friends to play with
Friends to help
Friends to explore with

Funny thing is I never had to be a specific level to help/play/laugh with my friends. My level was irrelivant in the long run, we did things because we wanted too. Not for the gear, not for the reward, but for the hell of it, just to see the person you helped say "Thanks man!"

Short sightedness like people spewing bile at the leveling process in a game upsets me because it's in that "Grind" where friendships and bonds are formed. People working towards a common goal, when you take all the challenge out of that it just becomes...boring.

PLing in XI was a far cry from what it is in XIV, having unlimited healing and having somone utterly destroy a group of monsters for you are two totally different stories. If Yoshida wants us to help our friends out...that's perfectly fine. Just don't let us do all the work for our friends, thats just stupid.

This sounds like something a new player would be doing, unlike you all the above was already completed (quests, AF etc). And exploring, what's to explore when you've been everywhere, done everything? Friends to help, there are none unless I'm ditching my effort to level my own class that I've been trying to to all week just to merit instead. And lastly, yeah friends to play with isn't as easy as you're trying to make it sound. There wasn't always some magical level sync, 9 times out 10 they had nothing in my range, then you're talking about solo...you've got to be kidding me.

[Jynx]

unlike you all the above was already completed (quests, AF etc). And exploring, what's to explore when you've been everywhere, done everything?

You did all the quests and explored everywhere? I call BS I spent seven years playing XI and there was always something to do even with just one level 75 job.

"Ditching my effort to level my own class"? That's just you being selfish, when did doing something for your friends need a reward? I solod tons of merits on my THIEF if I can do it, anyone can, and tons did. Get your head out of your behind and look beyond your silly objective opinion and realise that there were tons of people who enjoyed XI for exactly what it was, and those same people are looking at XIV to provide a similar (If not slightly different) experience.

If you still think that only new players had tons of stuff to do in XI, then I doubt you ever truely played the game at all and just wasted a few years of your life not even playing all the content available to you.

[Hanemakikaze]

You did all the quests and explored everywhere? I call BS I spent seven years playing XI and there was always something to do even with just one level 75 job.

"Ditching my effort to level my own class"? That's just you being selfish, when did doing something for your friends need a reward? I solod tons of merits on my THIEF if I can do it, anyone can, and tons did. Get your head out of your behind and look beyond your silly objective opinion and realise that there were tons of people who enjoyed XI for exactly what it was, and those same people are looking at XIV to provide a similar (If not slightly different) experience.

If you still think that only new players had tons of stuff to do in XI, then I doubt you ever truely played the game at all and just wasted a few years of your life not even playing all the content available to you.

Do you actually read before you say anything? I mean really. So you're calling BS on something only I would personally know, then proceed to tell me I'm selfish because I want to level a job after I get home & not merit? Seems like the jokes on you, because you don't seem to know a thing and dropping a bunch of assumptions like this forum normally does without any solid facts besides your whole self proclaimed crap.

And also good job not reading like 90% of what I said, we aren't talking soloing at 75 (seriously why would I be soloing on a 75 when I want group on a 40?), not even in the slightest so there's another nice little assumption gone wrong. The only objective opinion I see are the people here, did I once say I care how you play your game? Nope, yet here I am arguing about the most pointless crap over some people trying to defend something that I gave not so "omg so nostalgic" opinion about.

Moral of the story, actually read my posts before you start running your mouth instead of skimming through so you can grab some out of context quote to try and look witty.

[Jynx]

Do you actually read before you say anything? I mean really. So you're calling BS on something only I would personally know, then proceed to tell me I'm selfish because I want to level a job after I get home & not merit? Seems like the jokes on you, because you don't seem to know a thing and dropping a bunch of assumptions like this forum normally does without any solid facts besides your whole self proclaimed crap.

And also good job not reading like 90% of what I said, we aren't talking soloing at 75 (seriously why would I be soloing on a 75 when I want group on a 40?), not even in the slightest so there's another nice little assumption gone wrong. The only objective opinion I see are the people here, did I once say I care how you play your game? Nope, yet here I am arguing about the most pointless crap over some people trying to defend something that I gave not so "omg so nostalgic" opinion about.

Moral of the story, actually read my posts before you start running your mouth instead of skimming through so you can grab some out of context quote to try and look witty.

Let's go through some points.

-You are not selfish if you want to level instead of help a friend. You are selfish when you whine about having to level instead of helping a friend because you had every option to do either and choose the former.

-I solod on Thief well before 75, getting a party was rough for thief for...almost forever. When I wasn't making my own parties I was soloing (Great way to keep your marksmenship capped.) Any class can solo pre-75 it's not the best exp under the sun but it's better than sitting around with a thumb up your behind crying about the lack of parties. On this notion, lowman parties always worked as well. You are to blame if you just went with cookie cutter camp/party setups and didn't go beyond the little box you define as the "Norm"

-I stand by my assumption that you let 9/10ths of the game pass you by while you wept gently into a friends shoulder about how bad you felt when you had to merit on drg.

-What you thought about FFXI is irrelevant, you have no place to come in and shit on everyone elses opinion of the game who don't agree with you. I haven't said anything about your sad experience in the game aside that I feel you missed out on some of the greater things the game had to offer bassed on what little information you have givin me to go on. Was it the wrong way to play the game? I might think so, but all the power to you to sit in town for hours on end waiting for someone else to make the game happen for you, "Grinding" instead of playing the game.

-I frankly don't give a damn wether you liked parts of XI or hated it all, calling people massochists because they like a certain playstyle. I guess I'm a bit guilty on this front as well as I called you selfish for not "Ditching" your merit parties to help friends, I'll bite the bullet on that one.

I did read your entire post and my points all stand, your half assed assumptions about my posts aren't helping your post either.

[Hanemakikaze]

Let's go through some points.

-You are not selfish if you want to level instead of help a friend. You are selfish when you whine about having to level instead of helping a friend because you had every option to do either and choose the former.

-I solod on Thief well before 75, getting a party was rough for thief for...almost forever. When I wasn't making my own parties I was soloing (Great way to keep your marksmenship capped.) Any class can solo pre-75 it's not the best exp under the sun but it's better than sitting around with a thumb up your behind crying about the lack of parties. On this notion, lowman parties always worked as well. You are to blame if you just went with cookie cutter camp/party setups and didn't go beyond the little box you define as the "Norm"

-I stand by my assumption that you let 9/10ths of the game pass you by while you wept gently into a friends shoulder about how bad you felt when you had to merit on drg.

-What you thought about FFXI is irrelevant, you have no place to come in and shit on everyone elses opinion of the game who don't agree with you. I haven't said anything about your sad experience in the game aside that I feel you missed out on some of the greater things the game had to offer bassed on what little information you have givin me to go on. Was it the wrong way to play the game? I might think so, but all the power to you to sit in town for hours on end waiting for someone else to make the game happen for you, "Grinding" instead of playing the game.

-I frankly don't give a damn wether you liked parts of XI or hated it all, calling people massochists because they like a certain playstyle. I guess I'm a bit guilty on this front as well as I called you selfish for not "Ditching" your merit parties to help friends, I'll bite the bullet on that one.

I did read your entire post and my points all stand, your half assed assumptions about my posts aren't helping your post either.

It's like no one here has reading comprehension I swear, let me break this down for you. I never whined about not getting parties I gave my opinion of how it WAS when I played, when I couldn't get one I did something else I really didn't feel like doing to pass the time over the 5 years of playing that bs, this is how I got everything explored/done because I was always seeking so damn long. And about me leveling ? Here's where you clearly once again can't read worth a damn, I've said multiple times that my version of helping a friend was joining a merit party instead of leveling because of course all my friends mostly only did that till an event. So once again let me break this down for you, no one actually needed my help, but I had the choice to merit or seek a few hours getting pretty much nothing done but your crappy quests that are completely meaningless to me. Got that now? I'm sure you got it after the 3rd time right?

Like I said, know what you're talking about before you run your mouth, you just make yourself look like an ass. And I haven't shit on anyones opinion just because I have a negative one, never once did I say no one can play the way they want, oh but wait I think you did a few times. Swear these forums are so ridiculous. And please show me where I assume anything about your posts, all I've done is point out the flawed 90% of the crap you're spewing about knowing what I've done or how I've done it.

Anyway this'll be last post at you, just another ridiculous fanatic making up the most ridiculous crap to try and get a point across that will never go through. All I see you saying are creative ways to be bored, and ineffective ways to party. I shouldn't have to sit there and tell my entire "life story" of xi to make a point, but as I said you're one the types on these forums that will just keep coming up with more of the same excuses every time no matter what I say so I'm leaving it at that, take it for what ya will damn hypocrite.