Dear Healers who don't DPS

[era1Ne]

Unlike you're claiming, no one here has said otherwise (of course I may have missed a post, in which case feel free to correct me). On the contrary, it's very often brought up that players who are new to the job (or content) are not and should not expected to DPS (even though it is useful to start learning it as early as possible ). So unless I'm very much mistaken, your argument is a strawman.

Edit: Trying to find some proof for my argument really quick...

You found 4 post and there are probably more that support your post, but this is an thread or discussion with much more different opinions and some of them have an really toxic one towards healers. An question i always wanted to ask, is how do you see the difference between an "lazy, netflix watching" healer and someone who is an new healer? You can clear content as an black mage and then try it as an healer after all...

You're remembering wrong then, because many here have advocated for more healing checks or something that necessitates greater emphasis on healing. Until such adjustments are made, we aren't going to support gimping your role because you dislike how healing jobs play in FFXIV. If you're refusing to DPS as a healer, you fall into three categories:

Many is not all, so how can you say i remember wrong? Also i love healing and dealing dmg in this game and recommend to try it to everyone who asks me for help as an healer, since you help the group and in the meantime get better at healing aswell. At the same time, i just understand that there are indeed valid reasons not do dps (as much), because talking to new healers showed me that they have most of the time an confident and experience issue. Which is completely ignored when someone compares healer dps to an dd doing his rotation for example. Mistakes in a rotation can't cause a wipe most of the time.

A healer being new on the job and doing zero DPS due to a lack of confidence, is a valid reason... Many DPSing healer are not taking that into account, or just won't plain accept it as a valid reason : which is not the same as a "reasonnable argument"...
I really want to point out how some people here only consider the "technical" aspect of the problem (no DPS = loss of efficiency) and totally ignore the "personal" aspect of that problem (new, unconfident, lack of time to play, not skilled...).

This is what i wanted to say aswell.

There is no need to look back in the thread : you're saying it...



To which anti-DPS will easily answer : YoshiP sides with us....

Anyway, read the rest of my previous post, needed to do an edit to pass the 1000 char limits....

I don't really agree with the "yoship said" argument, since some quotes are taking out of context for example. It is an fact that healer dps can help the group and clear content, even tho dmg check and enrage aren't calculated with healer dmg in mind. I remember some of the "anti dps" using this fact as an argument to say, healers don't need to dps, but they are completely ignoring that during progress people will die and then healer dps can help to prevent the enrage. So in theory it is absolutely true that healers don't need to dps, because healer dps is ignored in those calculcation, but in reality you can clear content faster, if both healers do dmg and heal together.

[Taika]

You found 4 post and there are probably more that support your post, but this is an thread or discussion with much more different opinions and some of them have an really toxic one towards healers.

I went through 10 pages (on my settings) quickly and found 4 posts from 4 different posters who explicitly mention that expectations aren't and shouldn't be as high for inexperienced healers. There were more posts from the same posters, and there may have been more posts from different posters that didn't discuss this directly. Now can you show me this "toxicity"? Like said before, I believe that if there are these sorts of posts, they are probably (most if not all) directed at healers who are refusing to be helpful to their party when they could. Not "toxic towards healers" in general - in fact many of the posters are active healers themself, or at least have been in the past - or "toxic towards new, inexperienced healers".

An question i always wanted to ask, is how do you see the difference between an "lazy, netflix watching" healer and someone who is an new healer?

I talk to them. I say something like "Hey healer, don't be afraid to do some DPS when none of us are in any danger!" If they answer with throwing some DoTs or DPS spells, I'm super happy. If they say "Sorry I'm not very experienced with this content / job", that's fine. If they say "lol no that's not my job and you don't pay my sub" I'll initiate the vote kick (I will give them another chance though, explaining why it's really useful and part of their job in this game). Of course you can also check their gear and job levels and if they have the Sprout icon, but simply talking to your party members (nicely!) is generally the best way to go if you want to make things better.

[Lastelli]

An question i always wanted to ask, is how do you see the difference between an "lazy, netflix watching" healer and someone who is an new healer?

It's very simple. You observe them and if you have some basic knowledge about healing in this game you'll easily understand. If you're still not sure you can check his search info and gear. If that healer has several jobs leveled it's reasonable to assume that he knows how the game works and joined the dungeon as a healer just to play easymode. If he's wearing savage gear...well...

[Tridus]

An question i always wanted to ask, is how do you see the difference between an "lazy, netflix watching" healer and someone who is an new healer?

Easy. Do they stand idle, and react immediately with overwhelming healing power every time any bar is below 100%? If so, new healer.

That's the one thing all new healers have in common: fear of the bars not being full. Sometimes it's from other games where that is a huge problem, and sometimes its just healing newbies who don't want someone to die on their watch. It's an entirely natural, understandable reaction. A new healer sees someone at 60% with Medica II ticking, and their response is to cast Cure immediately.

It's the experienced healers who can go "oh he's at 60%, Medica II is ticking, so there's no risk of death until after the phase change, I can ignore him."

A netflix healer lets people get lower while being idle because they're distracted. They will then play catch up. Occasionally a newbie has to play catch up as well, but over the course of the entire run it's pretty clear which is which.

[Seredeelfer]

Dear Long Time Players Who Think You're Better Than Me -

You are - I get it. I am trying to improve and yet constantly being called a baddie is demoralizing. That giant sucking sound isn't really me, it's all the fun of healing being pulled into Exdeath's black holes.

[Taika]

Dear Long Time Players Who Think You're Better Than Me -

You are - I get it. I am trying to improve and yet constantly being called a baddie is demoralizing.

Who here is calling you a baddie? If you're trying to improve, you're automatically better than a great amount of healers in this game. And like said many times, in general people have absolutely nothing against new healers who are trying to learn - on the contrary, it's great if you do! We've all been new at some point, and most of us have a lot of room for improvement even if we are pretty experienced. In 99% of content and groups it's the attitude that matters.

I absolutely adore this post:

A DPS doing suboptimal things (not using Enochian), a tank doing suboptimal things (staying in tank stance even during an extended burn phase with no incoming damage and no risk of aggro drop), and a healer doing suboptimal things (massive overhealing, overwriting Medica II with 25 seconds left) are equivalent.

There is literally no case, EVER, where someone would defend a tank that Flashes 6 times, pops Rampart, than stands still waiting for aggro to drop before doing anything else. That is the real equivalence to a healer standing around doing nothing 75% of the fight, because that's the tank standing around doing nothing for 75% of the fight. Any tank that tried that would be kicked. If they came to the forum to complain, they'd be told to knock that crap off, because doing damage helps stuff die faster and is thus a good thing.

DPS doing that is so absurd that the very idea of it is laughable, but their closest equivalent is that Red Mage who complained about how they preferred single target spells do they didn't AoE big pulls. You know what the reaction to that was? I can tell you it wasn't "YoshiP says the content doesn't require AoE", despite the fact that it actually doesn't require AoE. You can burn all that stuff down one target a time successfully, and yet nobody considers that to be a defensible practice.

People react to this because nobody's come up with a good explain for why experienced healers deserve a free pass to stand around doing nothing while everyone else is active. When you know no damage is coming (see: O2N), toss some rocks. If you simply refuse to do that, you're actively refusing to contribute to the group when mechanically you are completely capable of doing so.