Tales from the Storm Discussion

[Keever]

The WoL being male or female doesn't count.

Uh... huh? Why not? Just because you said so?

[Belhi]

Because women would never discuss potential romantic prospects over a relaxing meal....

Look, the women in FF14 are plenty active and competent. Y'shtola and Merlwyb in particular. Discussions on relationships almost never happen. We almost always only see talk of work. If all they ever talked about was guys then yeah sure, this would be a bit on the nose.

[Mysterysword]

Uh... huh? Why not? Just because you said so?

This is a moot point because the story already fails the Bechdel Test regardless of the WoL's gender, but by nature, any conversation involving the WoL would be impossible to apply the Bechdel Test to. Because for every person who wants to claim the WoL is canonically male, there's another who would claim the opposite. And they would both be right. So to save us all time and sanity, we should just cut out all references to the WoL when applying the Bechdel Test.

Because women would never discuss potential romantic prospects over a relaxing meal....

Look, the women in FF14 are plenty active and competent. Y'shtola and Merlwyb in particular. Discussions on relationships almost never happen. We almost always only see talk of work. If all they ever talked about was guys then yeah sure, this would be a bit on the nose.

So why can't they discuss other things and not bring romance into it at all? Contrary to what most men may believe, romance does not have to play a major or even minor role in a woman's life. And I don't think we really need to see them discussing their relationships, because their relationships with these men are shown in-game already.

What I'm going to ask here is: Why are these female characters apparently so defined by their relationships to men, that even the most banal conversations between them eventually swing back to revolving around men?

[FJerome]

What I'm going to ask here is: Why are these female characters apparently so defined by their relationships to men, that even the most banal conversations between them eventually swing back to revolving around men?

We are nearly 7 years in since the launch of the original game and to my knowledge this is the first time we've ever seen a scene like this? This is specifically a moment they're set aside to relax and take a breather, why wouldn't they make chit-chat about romance? They talk about weightier matters too but even if they didn't, it doesn't invalidate them as strong and serious characters that they may have some opposite-sex romantic interest and also talk about close male relatives sometimes?

[Belhi]

So why can't they discuss other things and not bring romance into it at all? Contrary to what most men may believe, romance does not have to play a major or even minor role in a woman's life. And I don't think we really need to see them discussing their relationships, because their relationships with these men are shown in-game already.

What I'm going to ask here is: Why are these female characters apparently so defined by their relationships to men, that even the most banal conversations between them eventually swing back to revolving around men?

Frankly, if you think that these characters are so defined by their relationships with men then you have paid almost no attention to their development in game. We have seen in detail how these women define themselves and all three are strong, independent and competent. The only one of the three that is defined at all by a male is Alaesie and her brother is as defined by his relationship to her as vice versa.

Are you seriously saying that a group of friends kicking back and relaxing will never talk about personal romantic relationships? That romantic relationships are a minor role in peoples lives? I don't now about you but most people I know of any gender consider things like that pretty important.

Look, if this was all that they would talk about fine. But its just a couple of friends chatting and things like this we rarely see them talk about. We are almost always discussing the fate of the realm. That really isn't relaxing talk to have over drinks. Further how are their relationships with these men shown in game. We haven't even met the guy Lyse mentioned. You act like they spend their whole time talking about relationships.

[Cilia]

Because one conversation centered around romantic prospects between women at any point in any piece of fiction is an absolute travesty.

/sarcasm

As a schizoid, I don't really care for the romantic discussion either. That said I still appreciate it because it shows the characters at least trying to have a life outside of their jobs. This is literally the first time we've ever seen any of the characters in question discuss romance. There are also plenty of other conversations between women and women alone that have nothing to do with men, such as a conversation between Merlwyb, Kan-E-Senna, and Nanamo sometime during 2.x (2.4, if I remember right) about politics. I don't see the need for getting so worked up over this short story.

[PArcher]

I liked this story because it was mostly fluff; nothing really new (sure we'll be introduced to this man Lyse talks about in 4.1), nothing terribly important, just the girls talking and relaxing.

Its a nice change of pace, and shows that they aren't 100% about their work. Which is really nice to see.

[Lunafreya]

I hope Lyse haters can read this story.

[Lutefisk]

Call me cynical but I think our unnamed historian does not think very highly of Lyse. If he really were crushing on her he'd be trying to avoid her gaze instead of looking right past her and that even Lyse has picked up on this habit of his implies that he's not attempting to hide his feelings.

In any case I reckon someone who knows the ins and outs of the political landscape of Gyr Abania is going to become a key player in the future. I hope we'll be seeing him in the MSQ soon.

[Enkidoh]

Call me cynical but I think our unnamed historian does not think very highly of Lyse. If he really were crushing on her he'd be trying to avoid her gaze instead of looking right past her and that even Lyse has picked up on this habit of his implies that he's not attempting to hide his feelings.

In any case I reckon someone who knows the ins and outs of the political landscape of Gyr Abania is going to become a key player in the future. I hope we'll be seeing him in the MSQ soon.

Calling it now: it's Erik.