SE, We need to talk about Leatherworker ...

[QT_Melon]

So you're basically saying that it takes the same amount of time to gather enough materials to make leather and, say, 4 logs for a lumber?
At least, you were right regarding one thing: I'm wasting my time here.

Actually yes, I killed one mob within seconds and got 3 skins. That's about the same as a 80% chance gathering from a tree. Keep in mind the hit rate on a btn/min node if not properly geared is not 100%. The only difference is that maybe a person is smart about their GP to get better yields from a node. There's usually more mats for GSM/ARM/CUL and ones that depend on more gathering classes. Oh yes some may yield more like 3 per item, but to kill that argument, they want ALL 3 in each turn in. So, pls.

It's funny you left out FSH who gets more RNG than the other two... XD Poor CUL.

Ok so I looked up your character on the lodestone. I see you went with the scrip gear (red scrip) at least before you decided to upgrade.
If everything was 200 Augmented gear like this http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/11C0R




That put you at 943 CRFT, 878 CTRL and 381 CP. That was more than enough to do a rotation that was for the CP poor if you ate the Tempura Plate from the vendor in Kugane.

I posted a link to a rotation earlier that you clearly ignored when trying to cherry pick about the mat consumption (which I answered several times to the reason why some crafters may need a mat that seems "unbalanced" compared to another class). I mean you complained about needing HQ and I said it's absolutely not necessary.

So my stats are:
Craftmanship 817 | Control 770 | CP 381 unbuffed, 424 CP with Food “Tempura Platter” (Kugane vendor)
It is very easy to get to 381CP

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...w_cp_crafters/

The only rub was getting to level 61 to do the rotation. That was easily done by doing a Grand Company daily turn in and grinding the base mat needed for leves. Get a commercial engineering manual and you got XP doing that as well. You obviously had the red scrips to get your gear.

It's as if as a crafter you can't even do the basic math, you find out how much progress you make at your level and figure out a rotation. It seems you couldn't do that and when I find a guide that actually gives you info, (in fact multiple) excuses are still made. Then you tell me I don't listen? I don't even think that's a fair argument. I'm giving info to resources to HELP.

[Princess_Momoka]

... in fact Leatherworker, Alchemist, Weaver, basically any recipe with a mob drop in it.
It is completely ridiculous that we are still in this situation with some of these drops. Limited spawn locations, low-ish drop rates and not dropping enough mats for recipes that are BASIC levelling recipes.

What baffles me even more is that during ARR 2.00 we had this same issue with Fleece and they added MORE spawn points and INCREASED the drop amounts of items so they knew things like this were an issue. Then came HW and they seemed to have forgotten all about it and now it continues.

This was also an issue for things like Dissolvents in HW which were a pain in the ass too, requiring 4 Deep Eye each which would not be such an issue if SO many of the recipes required them. It just becomes a huge time sink.

I hear that Weaver has it bad at the moment at 60 with many items needed dropped items again.

Now i'm not saying this is an issue with ALL mob dropped recipes, i'm fine with having to put some work in, but for BASIC stuff this should really not still be an issue. And it's such a shame because there are so many GREAT changes in the crafting system at the moment that my passion has been reinvigorated.

So please SE, take a look at these mob drop rates and increase them like you did in 2.00

EDIT: About retainers.

I was thinking about making a post on this very issue. You forgot about Diremite Web though, and it shocks me they keep repeating this mistake. Because of this, anything with Worsted Yarn/Dawn Serge ended up(ends up? I haven't looked at the prices in the last few days on my server) not worth crafting, even as something to sell, you have higher profit margins selling things that do not take those materials. It is so bad to buy the gear dirt cheap for the GC/leve turn ins that require gear with those mats from people mass selling them as MSQ quest rewards vs crafting them. The cloth for about a month or so was 65k, if you where even interested making something with one of those cloths, you where better off just making the cloths and selling those, then bothering making the gear.

[Catwho]

Yeah for 2.0 my retainers were on full time farm for Deepeye Tears and Chimera Hair and the leathers. With x4 battle retainers, I could get 40 items an hour.

Issue is I've only got one battle retainer at 70, and the other three are 60s on classes that..... I switched from being primaries at 60 because I didn't like them as much as alternates XD So while I'm a BRD DRK SMN SCH as my primaries, my retainers are unfortunately BRD WAR WHM BLM. I planned to get those to 70 eventually, but they took a backseat to the classes I enjoyed at 60 first. I'll probably dig into WHM BLM and WAR next purely for retainer purposes. Who knows, maybe I'll like them better at 70 than I did at 60...

But in the meantime, farming materials for Dawn Serge is absolutely horrible. I spent 45 minutes killing mobs with my chocobo the other day. It was a bit better last night, only 25 minutes for the 60 drops needed for a single piece of gear...

[QT_Melon]

But in the meantime, farming materials for Dawn Serge is absolutely horrible. I spent 45 minutes killing mobs with my chocobo the other day. It was a bit better last night, only 25 minutes for the 60 drops needed for a single piece of gear...

It's also psychologically irritating. From an immersion perspective, the manzasiri is a large animal/mob. To have something that big not able to cultivate its hair is rather ridiculous. (Right next to Spear Fishing I mean I get why regular fishing is RNG, but really...we're wandering around stabbing blindly with a spear? )

Leathers aren't as bad because it's only Skin --> Leather
Worsted Yarn and Dawn Surge (Steppe Surge) is because it's 2 Mob Drops that you need multiples of ---> Yarn then 3 Yarn ----> Cloth
That's why I had said before the other thread started, that it needed to be its own topic because the LTW rates weren't that bad, the mane was.

[Silverbane]

<Sigh> As if 4.0 didn't dumb down the game enough.

Don't complain that your hunter retainers aren't a class you've leveled yet, that's just poor planning. I had one of four like that (an archer, I main WHM with a side of WAR now), so I reset him to Fisher and re-leveled him.

And after putting L310 scrip gear on my retainers, I'm awash in skins, manes and hairs. And still have four stacks of ventures, the amount of GC seals you get from dungeon drops is insane.

[Catwho]

<Sigh> As if 4.0 didn't dumb down the game enough.

Don't complain that your hunter retainers aren't a class you've leveled yet, that's just poor planning. I had one of four like that (an archer, I main WHM with a side of WAR now), so I reset him to Fisher and re-leveled him.

And after putting L310 scrip gear on my retainers, I'm awash in skins, manes and hairs. And still have four stacks of ventures, the amount of GC seals you get from dungeon drops is insane.

I've got 8 retainers. XD The gatherers are all 70 now. yeah, poor planning (more like a straight up oversight) on my part - but I've got 1 battle retainer at 70, and if someone only has 2 retainers total, they're in an even worst situation than I am. I'll get em to 70 once I get myself to 70 on those classes, so no big deal.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

<Sigh> As if 4.0 didn't dumb down the game enough.

Don't complain that your hunter retainers aren't a class you've leveled yet, that's just poor planning. I had one of four like that (an archer, I main WHM with a side of WAR now), so I reset him to Fisher and re-leveled him.

And after putting L310 scrip gear on my retainers, I'm awash in skins, manes and hairs. And still have four stacks of ventures, the amount of GC seals you get from dungeon drops is insane.

Because going out and killing monsters or waiting hours on retainers requires so much thought? The dumbed down rebuttal doesn't work in this scenario because hunting requires you not actively be crafting nor does it make the process easier. Bumping up the numbers simply makes getting mats less tedious.

[QT_Melon]

Considering many consider paying for extra retainers as a pay to win, I don't ever try to make arguments that involve more than the free retainers. Especially if you have multiple of the same kind.

I try to look at it from the perspective of having 2 leveled.

[Silverbane]

Because going out and killing monsters or waiting hours on retainers requires so much thought? The dumbed down rebuttal doesn't work in this scenario because hunting requires you not actively be crafting.

I don't wait on my retainers. I'm smart enough to anticipate what I'll need and send them out to get it before I need it.
But you don't? You wait until you need something and then send a retainer out for it?

In that case, I suggest you get rid of the wait by buying the thing you sent your retainer out off the market board and then recouping the gil by selling what the retainer brings back. No waiting required, even if you can't plan ahead.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I don't wait on my retainers. I'm smart enough to anticipate what I'll need and send them out to get it before I need it.
But you don't? You wait until you need something and then send a retainer out for it?

In that case, I suggest you get rid of the wait by buying the thing you sent your retainer out off the market board and then recouping the gil by selling what the retainer brings back. No waiting required, even if you can't plan ahead.

Your post implied a reduction in mat component would somehow equate to dumbing down crafting. Planning ahead doesn't change the two methods for getting mats have nothing to do with crafting, thus a reduction wouldn't be "dumbing it down." You'd simply be less dependent on your retainer or farming.

Nice try though.