The state of DPS and why I both love and hate RDM

[Troile]

The real reason to hate Red Mage is because they have no level 70 job skill. It's the same skill from level 68 copied in the name of job mechanics. It was easier to deal with when it was just Verfire and Verstone, but there's nothing to look forward to from 68 to 70.

They should have given the skills different effects. Also, no, a 20% chance to proc Verfire vs Verstone is not a different effect. It honestly makes no difference which one procs. Likewise it makes no difference whether or not you use Verflare vs Verholy. All differences are simply imagined. Disappointing....

If they wanted to do it this way, they should have created a two other melee chains with different effects (so three total) and let Verflare or Verholy be the gateway to its respective chain. Would have at least made the job a bit more interesting....

[Galvuu]

snip.

The skill may be "boring" (I like it and I like having both), but from a gameplay perspective- both in terms of flow and functionality- it's amazing.
Your mana will naturally become misaligned by a bit depending on whether you have more Verfire or Verstone procs (the one with more procs tends to be lower).
Having both means that as soon as the lower hits 80 (or 40 for manify), you can go into your melee combo+finisher and are guaranteed a proc that will accelerate the next combo.
It actually flows rather well, regardless of how quickly it becomes boring xD

Edit to your edit: Two melee chains is button bloat- they'd functionally do exactly the same thing. You press three buttons in sequence to use Verflare/Verholy.
Getting a guaranteed proc (instead of 20%) is actually a pretty big deal. Accelerating mana generation so you can go back into melee comboing and Verflare/Verholy does increase your dps over a fight quite a bit. That's like your Midare Setsugekka (literally- the whole thing is 1470 potency, melee+Verflare/Verholy). RDM is just super forgiving, so even if you used Verflare/Verholy at random, you'd only lose a bit of dps.

In fact, RDM is so forgiving that when I first read the tooltip, I misread it, and thought that if your mana was balanced you couldn't Verflare/Verholy (which confused me quite a bit until I re-read it).

[NovaLevossida]

It was easier to deal with when it was just Verfire and Verstone, but there's nothing to look forward to from 68 to 70.

Honestly, with the low amount of skill that RDM demands with its full skill set, it's hard to seriously say it could be any easier.

[FaileExperiment]

They should have given the skills different effects. Also, no, a 20% chance to proc Verfire vs Verstone is not a different effect. It honestly makes no difference which one procs. Likewise it makes no difference whether or not you use Verflare vs Verholy. All differences are simply imagined. Disappointing.....

I like the idea of getting a buff when you do a black magic vs a white magic. Similar to SAM, maybe one buffs self damage, the other buffs party damage by a small amount. VerFlare/VerHoly maybe trigger a bigger temporary buff.So you'd choose one or the other based on which one is more beneficial at the time, not just which mana is lower. Also, each buff should last only a few seconds, to adjust for dualcast. That would have been pretty fun to manage. Just brainstorming.

[Furious]

Edit: Misread the post I quoted!

[Furious]

Every time I think I should go Red mage, my tank/healer friends round up pack of 12 mobs and I get to remember why Black mage will always be the king of my heart.

Being able to spam scatter to do good damage, intersected with ridiculous moulinet burst phases, and an ogcd crazy 45sec cooldown has its own charm. The numbers will never be as high as blm, but my god is it easy and safe.

[Sylvain]

In the case of SMN they could start buffing the crap skill that is Devotion.
I mean... 90sec CD to grant 1 person for 15sec 5% dmg or tankiness
Is there any job granting a worst buff than that? I'm pretty sure this is the worst in game buff.
An astro could grant one Balance to 1 person in the entire fight and it would out perform that skill.

[Pidooma]

I for one don't think RDM needs to be nerfed. Simplicity should not mean less damage. If anything the other casters should be buffed imo. It makes sense for black mage to be the highest damage dealing caster, I think everyone would be okay with that. Summoner should be pretty close to RDM and just offers a different flair for those that want something more complicated. I think right now the biggest issue isn't how easy RDM is allowing a lot of people to get close to that Skill Ceiling, instead the issue is with the hugely punishing mechanics of other dps jobs. Make it not so punishing for other jobs and they will be able to reach their potential easier, then if it's still not enough to justify it you could buff the job and I think everyone would be okay with it.

[Lildragora]

Snip

Simplicity should mean less damage, utility, or both. Complex jobs vs Simple jobs usually work this way in games for the sole fact that the harder a role is to fulfill entirely the more rewarding the experience is. In this case, more complexity means more damage output / utility to use. While someone can certainly max out a simplistic job, and even out perform other roles a maxed out more complex role should provide a higher level of output. I have not played RDM myself but if it is as simple as people are leading me to believe, it definitely should not be as strong as the other roles.

[TarynH]

Simplicity should mean less damage, utility, or both. Complex jobs vs Simple jobs usually work this way in games for the sole fact that the harder a role is to fulfill entirely the more rewarding the experience is.

Whatever happened to people enjoying simple, fun AND rewarding experiences? Have we become so jaded that we need to cry foul every time we see someone else get slight enjoyment out of life?

I'm in the "leave RDM alone" crowd. I'd rather see other jobs become "less complex" and more fun, than one fun and simple job be torn completely apart because of arbitrary views like the above.