Onslaught charge and needing rage

[Fernosaur]

Plunge's only use isn't just for pulling... Plunge is a great tool to increase mobility during fights, regardless of if you pull with it or not. Onslaught will have the same use, with the addition that it generates enmity and has a considerably longer range. It will be good for increasing uptime when picking up ads from a distance or get back to the boss's butt after a mechanic. I don't know why you guys don't see the use in that. Running 20y towards a boss can easily cost you 1.5-2 GCDs or more.

Apart from increasing your own mobility and preventing the boss from moving around too much when tanking and dealing with knockback mechanics, it can also have nifty situational uses, like how DRK could cheese the third Scrapline in A9S by Plunging into Faust or how BLMs could cheese most forced movements by using Aetherial Manipulation to avoid falling off a platform. Sure, it's situational, but the super short CD will let you use it quite a lot. I'm sure the extra mobility and stability in raid positioning is worth the gauge sacrifice!

[SpookyGhost]

Plunge's only use isn't just for pulling... Plunge is a great tool to increase mobility during fights, regardless of if you pull with it or not. Onslaught will have the same use

Onslaught costs a resource, Plunge doesn't. You have to consider what you could've used instead of Onslaught and then weigh Onslaught's value vs the value of what you're losing. The biggest problem with Onslaught is you need a mob to spawn within Onslaught range but outside of the range where you can just GCD -> move -> GCD (which I don't think Onslaught's range is even capable of now that we can Sprint in combat). It's simply not worth using for what it does at it's current potency and current gauge cost, either could be adjusted and it would be more worthwhile.

[Claire_Pendragon]

Well one thing is that if you use gap closer at pull your melees would need longer time to get into melee range of the boss, and sometimes using their gap closer at pull is a dps loss. Like drg using spineshatter dive at pull loses quite a bit of potency (heavy thrust, disembowel, botd, bfb, litany, pot) on that skill.

I still think they need to increase the potency of onslaught to make it worth the gauge cost, or remove the gauge cost (though I still think it's not a good skill to use at pull).

It takes roughly the same amount of time as just running up to it while it already aggroed you for taking another step closer. (I also doubt you would engage the boss where ever it stops, rather than facing away from the group in a predetermined spot.)

When I tanked in dungeons as WAR I tried to engage the next group of mobs before my wrath wore off, AND tried to do it before my Maim wore off as well, to increase my overpower dmg. (Id even refuse to tomahawk, just so the GCD wasnt going to slow my overpower before maim wore off)
Chances are, if your maim/wrath wore off before the next pull, so did your other DPSs buffs wear off, and they are secretly hating you, and now trying to pull extra mobs for you.
But if your maim/wrath didnt fall off, then chances are your healer DOES hate your quick pull, as they are still trying to decide which glamour they want to try out next between pulls.

imo, you'd have the 20 you need as long as its not 8+man content, where you have to wait awhile to engage.

[aleph_null]

I was mostly talking about raids, where using gap closer at pull would inconvenience the melees. If you're in dungeons this doesn't apply since your encounter has already started before you jump into the boss, and having a gap closer makes the dungeon run faster, (which is why drk is better than war for fast dungeon runs, since they can sprint and plunge). For dungeons I think it'll be well worth the gauge cost as long as it speeds up the run.

[Xenosan]

Could be used to supplement aggro while Tanking out of Defiance, like Shield Swipe? is the cost less than Stance Swapping? ..That's all I can think of really think of.

[Lyth]

...

Onslaught is 100 potency on a 15 second recast. Plunge is 200 potency on a 30 second recast. If there was no gauge cost associated with Onslaught, it would be vastly better than Plunge. You're twice as mobile for the same potency. This is on top of the fact that Release has a built in Tempered Will effect. Between these two abilities, you'll have unrivalled uptime. I don't think you could increase the potency or decrease the cost in all fairness without significantly extending its recast.

While you could use Sprint to return to a mob more quickly, you can also use it to stay on a mob longer before you sprint out of an AoE. You can then gapclose back.

Not everything needs to be a flat potency advantage to be valuable. That being said, if there is ever a skillspeed breakpoint that allows for yet another additional GCD under your megazerk, I think it may end up being a potency advantage for Onslaught x2 to replace the final FC, as its relative efficiency to FC increases under both Berserk and Release. But even without this being the case, Onslaught is a very useful ability, even as pure quality of life.

[SpookyGhost]

I don't think you could increase the potency or decrease the cost in all fairness without significantly extending its recast.

This would be fine.

While you could use Sprint to return to a mob more quickly, you can also use it to stay on a mob longer before you sprint out of an AoE. You can then gapclose back.

Unless mechanics dictate that the mob needs to be far away from the boss like in T13, you can just sprint to the mob and slowly pull it back to the boss. And this assume the add spawns miles away or that you even need Sprint in the first place to get to it. If it's not completely useless it's extremely situational and a far cry from "very useful".

[Baci]

Onslaught is 100 potency on a 15 second recast. Plunge is 200 potency on a 30 second recast. If there was no gauge cost associated with Onslaught, it would be vastly better than Plunge. You're twice as mobile for the same potency. This is on top of the fact that Release has a built in Tempered Will effect. Between these two abilities, you'll have unrivalled uptime. I don't think you could increase the potency or decrease the cost in all fairness without significantly extending its recast.

While you could use Sprint to return to a mob more quickly, you can also use it to stay on a mob longer before you sprint out of an AoE. You can then gapclose back.

Not everything needs to be a flat potency advantage to be valuable. That being said, if there is ever a skillspeed breakpoint that allows for yet another additional GCD under your megazerk, I think it may end up being a potency advantage for Onslaught x2 to replace the final FC, as its relative efficiency to FC increases under both Berserk and Release. But even without this being the case, Onslaught is a very useful ability, even as pure quality of life.

I would really like Onslaught to have no Potency at all. Just a movement skill nothing else. Also, the Tempered Will on IR is kinda pointless cause no one will use IR for that purpose.
Atm there are 3 things that really sting me as a WAR. Onslaughts Beast Cost. IR Beast Cost and IR sharing Cooldown with Unchained. Basically we´ll lose Unchained for most of 4.0

[Lyth]

Sprint functions as both a gap closer and a gap extender. The two tools are not mutually exclusive, you use both in tandem to increase your mobility. It's a bit like asking why SAM needs both Yaten and Gyoten, both of which have Keniki costs associated with them and give you less potency than other oGCDs for the cost. You might not use them on a target dummy, but together, they give you freedom of movement that you can translate into a net dps gain through increased uptime, depending on fight mechanics.

Tempered Will on IR is not pointless. Your uptime during megazerk is more valuable than any other part of your rotation, so it's intrinsically protected. Also if there's a part of a fight which is knockback heavy, you may be able to adjust your windows to increase your overall uptime and improve dps.

Overall, I see a lot of things here that creative players will take advantage of to increase their dps in any fight that's more complex than a target dummy. They're not free, but having to balance the trade-offs in a job helps add to its complexity, and for some people, fun.

[Marxam]

I would really like Onslaught to have no Potency at all. Just a movement skill nothing else. Also, the Tempered Will on IR is kinda pointless cause no one will use IR for that purpose.
Atm there are 3 things that really sting me as a WAR. Onslaughts Beast Cost. IR Beast Cost and IR sharing Cooldown with Unchained. Basically we´ll lose Unchained for most of 4.0

No it needs to have potency especially since it costs gauge. Now if the potency was at 150 then it might be more competitive especially since it is now stronger than Tomahawk. With regards to sprint and how server ticks work, using onslaught might be a better option than just sprinting to an enemy. Tempered will is incredibly useful. Using IR basically guarantees you un-interrupted burst dmg.