How would you handle this situation with mean spirited mentors?

[ChocoFeru]

As a Mentor I found more useful to just not speak or teach anything, until somebody does something wrong or somebody asks me.

Some people doesn't like to be teached, so the best way is to be passive.


And about the bad mentors, report. Always report.

[Chessala]

I honestly can count the amount of decent mentors I have encountered on one hand.

Personally, I think a change of icon would help already to weed out some of the bad crowed that only want to show off their shiny crown. Make the icon a tree. New players a sprouts, returnees are flowers and mentors are trees - it follows a topic too with mentors being deep rooted players! I guarantee you not many players would want prance around a tree but a lot of people want a "jerk crown".

In all honestly, I cringe when I see a crown in a duty because in 99% of all cases, the player will cause only problems. Only recently a mentor rained insulted my friend when she was trying to help the sprout in the party. Supposedly they were on voice and he was explaining what to do. Possible but if that was the case they did an as shitty job outside of the game as they did in-game. I wish she had reported them.

I actually like the system mentioned here regarding a pop-up after a duty. Yes, it can be abused, as everything can, but it would definitely weed out a lot of bads from the pool or would encourage people to at least TRY to be helpful. I have been avoiding DF at all costs not because of new players (though recent influx of those isn't very promising either) but mostly because of jerk crown players.

[Yeol]

As a Mentor I found more useful to just not speak or teach anything, until somebody does something wrong or somebody asks me.

Some people doesn't like to be teached, so the best way is to be passive.


And about the bad mentors, report. Always report.

This is what I do as well. Some parties can handle themselves just fine. It is after I notice something really bad that I will comment on it. Like a tank wearing DEX gear for example.

When I end up in some Extreme fight. I generally ask "Wanna go over starts?" This is better than asking "Everyone know what to do?" because people might hold back in fear and don't want to be ashamed.

[LineageRazor]

Bad idea for this game.

This is patently ridiculous paranoia. 95% my ass - if it really seems this way to you, than either you're not NEARLY as polite about the "help" you provide as you claim to be in this post, or, more likely, you're allowing the few bad experiences you've had to overtake the mostly normal or even positives ones. This kind of perception bias is VERY common, especially on the forums. Even in the worst cases, the idea of them actually filing a report against you in retaliation is laughable.

As a mentor, I help folks out regularly, and at the worst the folks who I try to help will let me know that, "Yeah, I know, I was just being sloppy, sorry about that." Got almost exactly this verbatim yesterday when I advised the players in my group to turn away for Neuro Squama in Lost City of Amdapor (Hard).

Also, of course, if you're really that concerned there's always the option of offering to give advice, before giving advice. When I'm not sure how well my advice will be received, I first ask, "Do you mind if I give you some advice about your class?"

In all honestly, I cringe when I see a crown in a duty because in 99% of all cases, the player will cause only problems.

This is equally ridiculous. Even the mentors who are just in it for the crown/mount are most likely going to just participate in the run like anyone else. Like other players, they want the run to succeed, because it gives them the rewards their after, so there's no reason for them to be any more hostile than they would be without the crown. So, yeah, I believe that examples like you listed DO happen - and they happen just as often in parties that have no mentors. There's nothing inherent to being a Mentor that attracts assholes - and if you're seeing nothing but asshole mentors, again that's perception bias at work. The bad sticks in your memory far more than the good, leading to ridiculous "statistics" like the ones provided by you and by Miste in her post.

[Miste]

This is patently ridiculous paranoia.

95% my ass

you're not NEARLY as polite about the "help" you provide as you claim to be

It's fine if you don't agree with my opinion.

You see...I just posted my opinion and I posted it pretty neutrally about my experiences....and already you have jumped on me in a hostile response calling me paranoid, making fun of my experience percentage, and claiming I am a liar and actually not polite when I try to assist my fellow players.

I think you just proved my problem. That is interesting...

the idea of them actually filing a report against you in retaliation is laughable.

Hostility again :/

Btw...I never said that anyone has filed or will file a report on me, but if you read the concept of the idea the person I actually replied to on my first post their idea was to have a pop up window at the end of the duty for the non-mentor players asking if the mentor was helpful. Did you read that? Because that is what I was talking about...not filing reports through help desk...

If they click No the mentor can potentially lose mentor status and lose all rewards. You are saying this won't be abused? It will be, and SE will be forced to hire a whole new group of employees to staff a task force specifically to look over the mentor system to give back mentors their lost status and rewards when people say No just to troll, or for no valid reason, or heck even misclicking No by accident.

So yeah, my opinion is still that it is a bad idea, sorry if you don't agree.

[technole]

As a Mentor I found more useful to just not speak or teach anything, until somebody does something wrong or somebody asks me.

Some people doesn't like to be teached, so the best way is to be passive.

Same. I don't even wear the burger king crown for this reason, but of course if you queue for mentor roulette it will appear on your name regardless.

I got some in-prog A7N party the other day when they were taking almost 10 minutes to explain the fight after a single wipe, and I'm like can we pull soon? I can call things as they happen, and still maintain high DPS. Some derps here and there of course, but nothing that wasn't solvable explaining during the fight.

Sometimes I call mechanics in my raid groups, so going on-the-fly or typing during fights isn't an issue to guide or correct something. I find this works better. There are too many people in this game that bite your hand for just giving any sort of advice.

[Ama_Hamada]

This is patently ridiculous paranoia. 95% my ass - if it really seems this way to you, than either you're not NEARLY as polite about the "help" you provide as you claim to be in this post, o

LAMO! you really pulled that card on Miste/Miste Vaer??? She is one of the FEW, FEW frequent posters here that I have yet seen any kind of hint of toxicity in a post when replying to people. I seen dozens of people post something provoking/rude/ toxic / attacking people like when I tried get someone back off in the jump potion thread, and the people all respond with "i did not do anything wrong" (or for me personally bringing up drama with me in threads from past threads where it does not belong) Miste is one of the most civil people on this form and if she says she runs into many toxic new players that attack her for giving advice, despite best efforts being polite, I will trust her word, because how she shown how to act on these forums. Also you did not reply my concern on top of that, what about open world stuff? crafting advice? etc? People troll the DF queue, why we have the withdraw penalty. People enter DF and leave because some tank did not like the roulette selection so we got penalty. People also troll the DF itself, making premades and trying to force it to fail and abuse kicking outsiders. You really think people will not abuse a system like that? It would just be a system to harass mentors. Also it is not "paranoia" when she said it actually happened.

idk about 95% being literal and I really do not care. It is basically telling me a large amount do that, and I got the same, so has my friends. Heck today I kept telling this new person to help with lamps on final boss in haukke manor and not a word said. Now that I think of it, wonder if it was a complex bot.

I think you just proved my problem. That is interesting...

I was trying to post before you, limits and all, fitting you give a civil reply to only prove my point further, despite that person asking for other kinds of a response.
penalty
For the post below me(because of post limits) I do not believe that, at least online. If a game company has to make so many changes from bad acting players (DF kick, Queue penalty due to queue trolling, DF leaving penalty, and the latest feast chat removal, then it will be abused more then helpful. The game we have right now is proof of it. This very thread, why it was made and that exists, is very proof "Did this mentor help you" will be abused. I seen people in premades failing runs on purpose too.
https://youtu.be/efHCdKb5UWc?t=55

[Hitsuzen]

I feel that since humans are inherently good. A survey system will be of good use to keep mentor status. Yes it may occasionally be abused, but if the mentors can keep a high average of let's say for instance 7/10 stars they can keep mentor status.

If You're generally a good mentor outlier data will be insignificant in comparison.

[Aethaeryn]

I feel that since humans are inherently good. A survey system will be of good use to keep mentor status. Yes it may occasionally be abused, but if the mentors can keep a high average of let's say for instance 7/10 stars they can keep mentor status.

Or you can just continue to report people like the ones you encountered and let a GM sort it out rather than an easily abused system.

I've seen karma systems work in MUDs, but with an MMO you'd really need someone in charge of actually reviewing the players with negative feedback to make sure the system is being used correctly. Most people are just going to click whatever to get the popup out of the way and get on with the game. Or if it just gives a notification thing like commendations, people are more likely to ignore it unless they had a bad experience. Would ignoring count toward the positive number? Also, everyone has different ideas of what makes a positive/negative experience. For example, some people believe you're a bad mentor if you don't provide unsolicited advice before each boss when there's a new player bonus (I personally wait to be asked b/c a lot of people are just alts, but I'll give advice if I see someone struggling with a mechanic).

I don't see a point in spending money on this over a few jerks. To this day I have still only run into a tiny percentage of abusive players wearing a crown. If people posted every positive experience on these forums, you probably wouldn't even notice the negative ones anymore. People are more likely to come and complain than come praise random strangers they met on the internet. I know I don't often bother leaving reviews on products I've purchased on Amazon/Newegg/etc. unless I have a bad experience.

[akaneakki]

This is patently ridiculous paranoia. 95% my ass - if it really seems this way to you, than either you're not NEARLY as polite about the "help" you provide as you claim to be in this post, or, more likely, you're allowing the few bad experiences you've had to overtake the mostly normal or even positives ones..

Oh I'm pretty sure this isn't paranoia. Happens to me a lot actually too. People rather just be in their own world and ignore others, this has always been a thing in FF14.
And Miste are one of those people who NEVER, insults people or drag people down in a argument or when they discuss. You can see it in every post she/he makes. It feel like she hit a spot on you and you just want to hide it honestly.