Anyone else think the cap of 900 for tomes should be the future cap?

[Mycow8me]

IMHO if your playing with the idea that "I need to cap before reset!" you are playing for all the wrong reasons. I was just saying that people that have the time to gear and play multiple jobs but cannot play multiple because of ilvl limitations and gear lockouts are unable to. Even more so if they don't play a certain style of content. Some don't raid, some don't like the 24 man, hell some people don't even like getting tomes at all and only use what they get from doing what they do regularly. When the cap was 450, I was usually capped by the end of the week. Now that its 900, I've only been capped one time so far. I thought it was a great way to help gear up extra classes I like to play.

Currently I enjoy:
War (main), BRD, BLM, SCH Untill very recently I could only keep war and bard geared (and bard was not geared very well untill new patch was about to drop). Now I've been able to play all 4 at various content ilvls and I haven't been getting bored of the game for this reason.

[Talraen]

IMHO if your playing with the idea that "I need to cap before reset!" you are playing for all the wrong reasons.

This may be true, but it's a factor in how everyone I know plays. Game design is increasingly based on addictive. Giving people a reachable weekly goal makes them happier. Giving people a goal they cannot reach does not. If every player was purely rational, none of this would matter, but we're not. I don't claim to know what the perfect cap is, but I know that there are unintended consequences for raising it. None of us have enough data to know how the cap actually affects player retention. But I know that, if Stormblood has a 900-tomestone cap, I will play it significantly less than I played Heavensward, because I won't be trying to hit the weekly cap. Hitting the cap is rewarding, but I'm not going to seek that reward if I know I won't get it.

EDIT: I think we're too bogged down in details here. I don't actually care what the cap is, or how many tomestones gear costs. If they want to change the cap so you can gear up 10 jobs at once, fine. My only concern is that I can hit that cap in an amount of play time I consider reasonable. One Expert five days a week is very doable. One Expert seven days a week and more tomestones on top of that is too much. So if they do a 900 cap and Experts are worth 180, great. If they keep it at 450 but halve all costs, great. Just let me hit the cap without playing the game like a job.

[bswpayton]

[QUOTE=Talraen;4105478]This may be true, but it's a factor in how everyone I know /QUOTE]

I'm really not finding the sense here all that if the cap was 900 in ur case would mean is that youd get one piece a week , as oppose to those whom reached 900 cap getting two pieces or a chest or pants instead of accessories. So youd base your play time off of the fact that others could get more scripts than you that doesn't make any sense at all, it should not take 6 months to gear 5 jobs that's crazy talk to me.

With a 450 cap thats how long it would take to gear 5 jobs when we have 15 different jobs at some point they are going to have to up the cap simply because of the amount of jobs will end up having. If 5.0 comes and its still 450 then maybe id consider playing something else if they added a new healer and tank or extra dps you cant have a 450 cap if you have 15 to 18 jobs. Hitting a cap means nothing its what you can buy with the tomes , I could careless about hitting the cap as much as I do with the actual piece of gear I can buy. So in your can if it was raised u could still buy your gear you just wouldn't hit the cap so Im struggling to find the issue here.

[Talraen]

I'm really not finding the sense here all that if the cap was 900 in ur case would mean is that youd get one piece a week , as oppose to those whom reached 900 cap getting two pieces or a chest or pants instead of accessories. So youd base your play time off of the fact that others could get more scripts than you that doesn't make any sense at all, it should not take 6 months to gear 5 jobs that's crazy talk to me.

With a 450 cap thats how long it would take to gear 5 jobs when we have 15 different jobs at some point they are going to have to up the cap simply because of the amount of jobs will end up having. If 5.0 comes and its still 450 then maybe id consider playing something else if they added a new healer and tank or extra dps you cant have a 450 cap if you have 15 to 18 jobs. Hitting a cap means nothing its what you can buy with the tomes , I could careless about hitting the cap as much as I do with the actual piece of gear I can buy. So in your can if it was raised u could still buy your gear you just wouldn't hit the cap so Im struggling to find the issue here.

Well, in short, I really don't care about gear, as long as I qualify for the content I do (i.e., not savage/extremes), which is not hard. I queue pretty much exclusively as a healer, so gearing other jobs also isn't a priority. So for me, the 450 cap basically exists as nothing but a weekly goal to meet. All I'm saying is that the mere existence of that goal makes me want to achieve it, and that's not the case if I have to really go out of my way to do so. So the two of us have entirely different priorities.

[Ultimatecalibur]

IMHO if your playing with the idea that "I need to cap before reset!" you are playing for all the wrong reasons.

Hitting a cap should be a natural result of playing normally during the week. Hitting the current 900 tomestone cap is not natural and is liable to cause many to experience burn out. The only reason the cap was raised to 900 was because 3.56 was released at roughly the time when a X.6 patch would intro a new tomestone.

Currently I enjoy:
War (main), BRD, BLM, SCH Untill very recently I could only keep war and bard geared (and bard was not geared very well untill new patch was about to drop). Now I've been able to play all 4 at various content ilvls and I haven't been getting bored of the game for this reason.

I think you need to reexamine what you consider your non-main classes as to be sufficiently geared. You do not need every class at i260/i270 for them to be properly geared. i235 to i250 should be enough for every job to be considered adequately geared right now.

[Mycow8me]

Hitting a cap should be a natural result of playing normally during the week. Hitting the current 900 tomestone cap is not natural and is liable to cause many to experience burn out.



I think you need to reexamine what you consider your non-main classes as to be sufficiently geared. You do not need every class at i260/i270 for them to be properly geared. i235 to i250 should be enough for every job to be considered adequately geared right now.

Due to the strick ilvl requirement system increase every patch, I cannot agree with you. Usually the end game gear/craft gear or high is the entrance gear for the next patch cycle. I don't recall dungeon gear being enough. No I don't expect them to be at the same ilvl but I dont have to worry about requirements for next patch. Why else would they increase the tome cap currently in preperation for stormblood? I can see no other reason than so people can have their other classes ready for it should they choose to. Why can't we do the same for patch cycles?

[Ultimatecalibur]

Due to the strick ilvl requirement system increase every patch, I cannot agree with you. Usually the end game gear/craft gear or high is the entrance gear for the next patch cycle. I don't recall dungeon gear being enough. No I don't expect them to be at the same ilvl but I dont have to worry about requirements for next patch.

You really need to be more aware of what is actually needed to participate in each patch cycle.

The previous Dungeon gear has always been the minimum expect ilevel for casual content with the previous capped tomestone gear being midcore content gear.

The entry to Heavensward was only expecting i100 to i115 gear. i130 gear was basically transition gear up to level 55. Stormblood is likely to be similar i245 minimum with i270 good until level 65.

Why else would they increase the tome cap currently in preperation for stormblood? I can see no other reason than so people can have their other classes ready for it should they choose to.

They are trying to maintain subscription numbers. By increasing the cap they give those players who want to have multiple of their classes more than sufficiently geared (ie. players like you) a reason to stay subscribbed over this next month and a half.

Why can't we do the same for patch cycles?

Because either they double the prices for gear or players would be gearing up far faster than necessary causing sub numbers to drop faster as players fully gear up their mains and secondaries.

Not really 235 doesn't get u into nine to twelve savage, nor zur barely gets u into sophia. There is no need to treat the game like we are running alts. Your side jobs don't have to be alts, many players have everything to sixty and that will continue to seventy.

You do realize that i270 gear will be phased out around level 65 in Stormblood? There is no real reason to try running all 13 classes in A12S. i235 to i250 will be all you need to be properly geared for Stormblood.

Why should those whom have more time be punished for those with less. Sure no cap is a horrible idea but nine hundred cap we are still talking months of gearing jobs when the game updates every three months with four fifty cap ull be gearing ur third job out of fifteen

Actually you would have geared between 2 and 6 jobs in that time (as only Dragoon and Ninja have exclusive sets, Monk/Samurai and Bard/Machinist share set and Tanks, Healers and Casters each shared by 3 jobs) and solo players would have geared their main fullly on week 6 and might as well unsub until the next patch comes.

[bswpayton]

You really need to be more aware of what is actually needed to participate in each patch cycle.

Most people that unsub have the unsub mentality most people on my sever that when I was a sprout and talked or mentored me havent skipped a beat. So when I became one myself I see the same people most people that like this game arent gona unsub , I have many friends that have every single job leveled to 60 crafters and battle classes and still sign in daily. And Im very aware that gear will be nothing around level 65 Im not concerned about that, but as a player who came maybe a year or months after hw I am concerned about being forced into playing one role when I have leveled several.

I play jobs based on the content in some content you may have insane tank bustered that may be easier to heal through than tank, or as a healer you may have horrible debuffs on you that makes your job harder which may be easier to tank. I know many players who play a job based on the content dungeons dont matter so you can have bare min gear in them to succeed. But if your doing a raid and your not in a static you should have the right to have most of your jobs fairly geared around the same ilvl just in case you need them. So taking half a year to get to other jobs is just not cool especially when anyone who joined after hw has never really played the game in such a way even with scrip cap once I got to hw lore was plentiful I could gear all my jobs as soon as I hit sixty. Most people dont just level jobs to play them in content like potd only.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Currently I enjoy:
War (main), BRD, BLM, SCH Untill very recently I could only keep war and bard geared (and bard was not geared very well untill new patch was about to drop). Now I've been able to play all 4 at various content ilvls and I haven't been getting bored of the game for this reason.

What's stopping you from playing all those jobs? Unless you do Savage, bis is meaningless. Even then, statics typically don't want people bouncing entirely different roles.

I'd like to see any time based cap removed entirely.

Let us decide our own caps. Hell leave in the caps but allow us to opt out of them if we wish. I shouldn't feel restricted just because of some other players' bad habits.

Do this and you effectively guarantee people lose incentive significantly earlier. Why keep raiding for 6+ months when you can be bis within the first four weeks. Less if you're a better player.

[bswpayton]

What's stopping you from playing all those jobs? Unless you do Savage, bis is meaningless. Even then, statics typically don't want people bouncing entirely different roles.



Do this and you effectively guarantee people lose incentive significantly earlier. Why keep raiding for 6+ months when you can be bis within the first four weeks. Less if you're a better player.

this is a very different discussion than the other thread 900 scrips currently is like a chest piece basically, this isnt the same thing as asking for no cap at all that would be dum. But 900 is very reasonable, just a weapon alone is 1000 so to level or gear ur healers and tanks which share gear if you got them weapons to would be 3 months. And everyone doesnt do statics to try and raid people where using raid finder doing things with fc members etc, you dont always have to have a static to try and do content.

I wasnt playing when the first floors of alex came out but this time around I will do them in storm blood but it wont be in a static, maybe friends with a common goal but Im not applying for a job this is a video game. But thats beside the point 900 scrips really isnt that crazy considering how much chest piece and pants, as well as weapons cost 3000 alone well close enough to it. The bit of savage I have done has been through pf or with fc members having a static isnt a must it just maybe makes things easier depending on.