Make FFXIV more like FFXI and less like WoW!

[Xenosan]

It was exactly that. Almost no one traveled through the open world like you should.

The thrill of dangerous open-world was you didn't go somewhere unless you *could* go. Which usually meant being with a party. And yes stealth was a pain, especially if you were trying to reach a specific leveling spot that was really out of reach. Some locations were ridiculous, that doesn't have to be replicated, but a zone like Zi Tah, the lowest floors of crawlers nest, ranperre's tomb, they had appeal because you rarely would ever bother going down there unless you had a group that could survive it.

And your first time peddling it to Jeuno? Felt like trying to climb Mt Everest.

Was it perfect, no. But just because FFXI didn't do it perfect doesn't mean it's not something that could be implemented successfully in FFXIV.


Sorry but IMO the real break of the novelty for a zone is when you spend 99% of the time flying 500 yalms above it with a un-adjustable game-engine Draw Distance that leaves mobs, players, environments and props not rendering adequately for a 2016 game. The most prominent visual in the HW zones is the wind-trail sprite FX of your mount. Then there's a beautiful zone like Azys Lla where there's like, no reason to ever go there ; ;

I wouldn't miss flight one bit if 4.0 zones didn't have it.

Regarding open-world, I don't know if 'being like XI' is the right way to look at it. What XI did have working for it that XIV is underperforming in is the need for open-world social interaction. XIV doesn't haven't it. In XIV a new player could go until lvl 60 without ever communicating with someone on their server. And every attempt SE has made to force social interaction server-side has been transparent failures (Specialty system, favor mats, diadem).

In XIV you can do almost anything with no one, but in XI couldn't do anything without being with someone.

That's the contrast as far as I care to describe it.

[Windi]

The arguments you guys are bringing up are kind of making me cringe.

Like, the main reason the overworld is as static as it is isn't just to make the game "easier," it's to accommodate several different type of players by allowing them to go at their own pace.

And considering the potential challenge of duty quests/dungeons, there is already potential challenge in the game as is. The difference, here, is that the challenge is shifted into the right areas.

[Iromi]

. I, personally, do not want a game where I have to be social in order to progress. Few people will organize groups for content. They'll merely play something else. Hence why MMOs do not force social interaction; only encourage it. A big turn off back in FFXI was being required to party at early levels lest I get annihilated by a buffalo. I'll make friends at my own leisure, thank you.

May I ask why play a Massive Multiplayer Role Playing Game then? I am not trolling or trying to be rude/attitude, I am genuinely curious. I find it to be like me with my work..if I told the director "I want to act in this play, but not in front of people, only people I choose at my leisure. " >.>

I do like encouraging social interaction though...but hmm, being social to progress...

I find a lot of the people in these games struggle with that, so I don't think many would progress. As for me I love being social, it comes naturally and super easy to me. As an extrovert I'd love for more social content but this game really lacks that aspect..and the linkshells I am in really show that. 90% of the folks in this game I have come across are extremely socially awkward. I always feel bad for them but dunno how to help them..anyway, sorry to ramble but yea I am curious...

And anyway I wouldn't expect a game to help someone overcome their social issues. But who knows..anything is possible?

The arguments you guys are bringing up are kind of making me cringe.

Like, the main reason the overworld is as static as it is isn't just to make the game "easier," it's to accommodate several different type of players by allowing them to go at their own pace.

And considering the potential challenge of duty quests/dungeons, there is already potential challenge in the game as is. The difference, here, is that the challenge is shifted into the right areas.

It does not really accommodate me..and my friends we kind of enjoy having to fight our way to places and work together. There could be some serious strongholds with good rewards and chests in there that you have to farm keys for. That would be fun.

Sure, some places can be ezpz, but we need a few zones where you need a group to get through, or at least 2 of ya. I think the main reason the overworld is boring (or low level mobs that do nothing rather) is because of the money. People would unsub if they had to actually work together or try to get somewhere. I wouldn't want the whole world like that..that would be annoying, but at least sometimes...yeesh but this game has 0 of that!

I think Yoshida realizes that the majority of people who play this game aren't very social and can get uncomfortable in those situations so keeps it to a minimum. In DF you barely have to communicate. Can you imagine if people had to work together in the open world for something? Oh well..I guess that is what real life is for.

[Windi]

@Iromi: It could just be me being below level 50 but you hardly need to be "social" in this game to progress anyway. I don't even understand that complaint.

[Iromi]

@Iromi: It could just be me being below level 50 but you hardly need to be "social" in this game to progress anyway. I don't even understand that complaint.

Yea you don't really need to be social at all to do anything in this game When I first played MMORPG in 2004...I did so because of the social aspect it offered. Playing with friends made things so much more fun then sitting at home, in my dark room playing a single player game alone. We got to tackle difficult things, get rewards and have a clan..it was pretty awesome (Lineage II) But now it just feels like I play with random people I'll never see again most likely...and there isn't any familiar faces to struggle to get rewards with at all.. Its just que, silence, win, leave. Very dull...

I mean, I don't use these games to replace social interaction in my life, no no I have a pretty big social life off the computer..lol it is just not as motivating to do things anymore without that aspect of mmorpgs anymore..

[Claymore65]

It does not really accommodate me..and my friends we kind of enjoy having to fight our way to places and work together. There could be some serious strongholds with good rewards and chests in there that you have to farm keys for. That would be fun.

Really, I think this is where Diadem could, and likely was intended to shine. A large, open world area with more difficult (at the very least Dungeon level) monsters, with powerful boss style monsters as well as more islands to explore. However, because it was mechanically more efficient to just grind mobs on a single island, that's what people did. With some improvements, it could satisfy the "Explore dangerous areas with a friend" (especially with level/ilvl sync or a system like Deep Dungeon), while keeping the overworld and game itself solo-friendly. I feel like that could be a good compromise. Maybe even a "Diadem-like" mode that doesn't require as many people would be perfect.

[Skivvy]

@Iromi: It could just be me being below level 50 but you hardly need to be "social" in this game to progress anyway. I don't even understand that complaint.

There are plenty of RPGs out there if people don't feel the need to socialize. I don't get why it's a negative to want to try and encourage gameplay that requires a group in an MMO.

[Windi]

But now it just feels like I play with random people I'll never see again most likely...and there isn't any familiar faces to struggle to get rewards with at all.. Its just que, silence, win, leave. Very dull...

That's actually a legit low-point, yeah. I have mixed feelings on it since I'm a pretty shy, introverted person both irl and in mmos and it at least gets the job done, but it doesn't help in building a sense of a community.
On the other hand I find this refreshing over the toxic bickering I've seen playing MOBAs these days.

[Lexia]

XI was VERY social dependent you needed a lot of time and friends to do stuff in the game, and I will admit I said before XIV came out that I hope it was more casual friendly then XI but not to the point of casual face roll friendly.

[Sandpark]

In Assassin's Creed or Thief the sneaking around is the actual game play. That's a big part of why people are playing the game in the first place and the game as a whole is designed around it.

In an MMO, having to sneak around is usually just put there as an obstacle to make it take longer to get to the actual game play.

In FFXI sneaking around and pulling enemies was the actual gameplay(combat oriented versus quest hubs). And the big part of why people played the game in the first place was the "Open World".

FFXI is a poor example of that though, because the only challenge it added was "Do I have enough Silent Oils/Prism Powders/etc. in my inventory?" You'd just put up Sneak and Invisible and ignore the mobs completely.

And as far as inconvenience goes, there's a difference between dealing with inconvenience that's already present and specifically requesting to be further inconvenienced. You can pretty much guarantee that whatever inconvenience someone is requesting, there's going to be a substantial portion of the player base that likes that aspect of the game just the way it is and would really rather not have it be made more difficult/time-consuming/etc.

You didn't have to even touch sneak or invisible. You could strategically move around and weave between most enemies to pull amazing feats.

To me hundreds to thousands of quest littered throughout the world is more inconvenient than actually participating in events and combat. Should they remove quest givers to convenience people who feel as I do? It's the same issue I have with the combat in this game and gathering in Dragon Age Inquisition. Busy work(multiple thousands of button pushes versus strategic button presses in reacting or enacting) that takes me out of the core of an mmorpg which is combat. I am not saying crafting and other things are not important.