MCH too bursty?...

[Houston009]

I'm guessing you don't know me.

What exactly is this "huge build up" that mch has?

[Cherub]

I'm having a deja-vu...

Oh. Right.

Sorry bud', chances are that your complain won't be listened to. And you'll probably get a nerf to some of your CC as well, without any reason.

Just here to say that you speak out of my soul and I love this pic.<3

[RiceisNice]

EDIT: Melee LB should be brought down to something like 5k that does not benefit from any damage increase. You still have an on demand big hit, but it doesn't tilt an incompetent team into victory. Mayhaps disable LBs in the last 2 mins of the match? This is why early patch notes are really nice, we don't even know what's coming exactly and how other changes will affect everything as a whole. Need better communication rather than a tidbit of "MCH burst is getting addressed", or just no info at all.

Ranged/Caster LB already do 4k/5k respectively. Nerfing it's damage defeats the point of it due to the cast timer and animation lock, that it's often "you kill them with it or you don't" sort of deal.

Sad really. I thought Mch burst was huge because there are so many ways to interrupt it. Besides the standard stun/sleep, the burst can fizzle if wildfire is stripped, or if the bind/sleep/stun is removed before BtE hits.
Mch burst may be great, but theres a huge build up, and the CDs can only be used 3 times in a match.

Popping CDs is not a "huge build up". MCH can bind/stun for themselves and get BtE out before it's even humanly possible to cleanse bind/stun. Raging Strikes is the only CD that can only be used 3 times, the others are 90ish seconds, barring Hypercharge.

"Build up" is the wrong word to use. A better one would be situational or unconventional. It works exactly like trying to bane/fester off after your bio or tri-disaster, and SMNs would understand when I say this; there's a bit of a delay between using bind and BtE to get the triple potency. Stun gun is incredibly unreliable for this due to latency and the off chance that you either don't get the stun off or they're not within your LoS after the fact (and the latter applies to supressive fire, on top of it having a piss poor stun duration especially if DRs are factored). Nor would I be quick to dismiss to just how powerful RS is, it's a flat 20% damage buff even without a trait. Then you also have ricochet which is situational in it's own right because all it takes is one other person being next to your target and you've lost 100 potency right there. Egis and fairies count toward this, too.

[KataTime]

You are writing a lot of things that are just plain not true.

For one getting a BtE off is a joke, its literally as simple as popping all of your damage CDs (and unlike the tribind fester, it is very responsive) and just hitting bind + BtE. It is so reliable that I don't hesitate doing it on focused targets, because I can hit them both at the same time and it's good enough for the server. Same goes for stun gun.

A lot of your grievances seem like "git gud" issues, somebody not within LoS? Stunning a DR'ed target? Not being able to pull off melee LB? Ricochet hitting more than 1 target because somebody walked in (it's an instant off the freaking GCD)? I'm also not sure whats unconventional/situational about blowing all your cooldowns and hitting a damage button? Does that mean Berserk+Fel Cleave is situational? I just hit it whenever it's up and it works fine (I use the word fine when it doesn't crit =p).

[RiceisNice]

A lot of your grievances seem like "git gud" issues, somebody not within LoS? Stunning a DR'ed target? Not being able to pull off melee LB? Ricochet hitting more than 1 target because somebody walked in (it's an instant off the freaking GCD)? I'm also not sure whats unconventional/situational about blowing all your cooldowns and hitting a damage button? Does that mean Berserk+Fel Cleave is situational? I just hit it whenever it's up and it works fine (I use the word fine when it doesn't crit =p).

It's not as responsive as I'd like to be on my end.The fact that ricochet needs to single them out for full damage is already a factor, not "somebody walked in" (though more often than not, walking out of the group is typically what gets them killed in the first place). I can still get it off without a problem on people that are getting focused down, however you still can't really deny the late detection for things like stunning in melee range, or even blank/knockbacks for that matter.

And honestly, I'm not arguing that they're things that you can't play around, I'm saying that they are things that have to be played around anyway, compared other bursts.

[Maddonious]

Unless they want us to settle fights during culling time, and then do an unfair come back with melee LB... but that's dumb because it means "yeah, we don't want yo to burst with your skills, but rather with culling time and melee LB on heavy medals".

I really don't understand what they want to do with the PvP. Especially when they nerf one of the weakest job in terms of CC (SMN) while letting BLM sit on his 'CC king' throne.

The balance is all over the place.

This is my biggest gripe to pvp but everyone lieks to tell me im wrong. I shouldnt have to wait for culling or Heavy medal to get a kill. Healers need an overall nerf (well not sch, I find that easy to deal with) to even allow people to fight properly.

Also dont dis my blm cc. Unlike a smn who can throw all his dots on someone and spread them then use 3 more INSTANT moves to burst we blms still have cast times and LoS issues. Without our blm cc helping us in 4v4 to some degree we become worthless. 15s/6s sleeps/binds dont account for much when I can only toss out 2 attacks during that time.

That being said BRD/MCH damage outside of cooldowns is just sad when you compare it to SMN/BLM.

While its low in theory at least you guys have the option to get more dps while moving then we do. Scathe scathe scathe scathe........ yeah...... if only I had the option to remove my turret status in pvp.

[NoelNoel]

I shouldnt have to wait for culling or Heavy medal to get a kill. Healers need an overall nerf

Let me stop you right here, healers do not need a nerf, (nothing needs a nerf except maybe the heavy medal system) people need to get good and focus on the same targets. Have you tried playing healer before even suggesting to nerf them? I encourage you to try it, see how "easy" you find it. Also if you actually have to wait for culling or heavy medals everytime to get kills you should reexamine your BLM gameplay...

[RiceisNice]

While its low in theory at least you guys have the option to get more dps while moving then we do. Scathe scathe scathe scathe........ yeah...... if only I had the option to remove my turret status in pvp.

If we're attacking on the move, chances are, we aren't using GB/WM. Our overall damage compared to other jobs (which is already lower to begin with) is with GB/WM, and that's before the ranged damage penalty. Our damage outside of burst really isn't any home to write home about; we have to turret just as much as a BLM with the cast times for the most part, and the payout is typically much lower. Our DPS on-the-go options essentially amounts to nothing just like scathe at this point.

Let me stop you right here, healers do not need a nerf, (nothing needs a nerf except maybe the heavy medal system) people need to get good and focus on the same targets. Have you tried playing healer before even suggesting to nerf them? I encourage you to try it, see how "easy" you find it. Also if you actually have to wait for culling or heavy medals everytime to get kills you should reexamine your BLM gameplay...

At this point in time, there's no way that you can out dps a WHM's hps unless there was an outside factor (CCs, coordinated burst,), which are incredibly few and far inbetween. That being said though, there are plenty of options to do so depending on your party composition. What really needs to be adjusted is some of the timers on CCs in relation to the interrupt changes (especially if they're going to make it harder to LoS through walll adjustments, which benefits BLMs more than anything), which isn't exclusive to just WHM/healer nerfs.

[Saint_Angeles]

EDIT: Melee LB should be brought down to something like 5k that does not benefit from any damage increase. You still have an on demand big hit, but it doesn't tilt an incompetent team into victory. Mayhaps disable LBs in the last 2 mins of the match?

Spoken like a true non-melee. Have you ever seen the animation lock on that thing? And how long it takes to go off? If it dealt 5k it would make it unbalanced completely the other direction and largely completely useless. I suppose that's not much of an issue if you don't play melee though, so nerf us to death I guess?

[Maddonious]

At this point in time, there's no way that you can out dps a WHM's hps unless there was an outside factor (CCs, coordinated burst,), which are incredibly few and far inbetween. That being said though, there are plenty of options to do so depending on your party composition. What really needs to be adjusted is some of the timers on CCs in relation to the interrupt changes (especially if they're going to make it harder to LoS through walll adjustments, which benefits BLMs more than anything), which isn't exclusive to just WHM/healer nerfs.

Healers wouldnt be as much of an issue if the diminishing returns allowed us to sleep/control them more. With an entire min of immunity it becomes incredibly hard to hold them in place after the start. They should lower the immunity to all cc down to 30s if they really want us to control them properly. Purify just destroys any really strong cc (blm) that we can place on them atm with only a 90s cd which is just ridiculous in terms of how short the game modes can be.