Renewed Request - Please Delete Parry from the game

[d3v13nt1]

But if the one attack is parried, it can't be blocked, and if said attack is blocked, it can't be parried (and evaded but Im disregarding that).

They both are competing against the other, and in the case of the PLD, you want the Block to happen instead of Parry.
So then it comes Sheltron into play. Since Sheltron makes it a 100% chance that the next attack is blocked, its nice and all but, parry takes priority (along with evasion but Im disregarding that).
:/

You got it wrong, block over rides parry. It's been proven quite allot. Bulwark for example will significantly reduce parry rate. A higher blocking shield will reduce parry Rates. Block doesn't literally reduce its rate. If you have a 20% block rate and a 20% parry rate, you will block 20 out of 100 attacks, and them parry 20% of the remaining 80 attacks.

[d3v13nt1]

But if the one attack is parried, it can't be blocked, and if said attack is blocked, it can't be parried (and evaded but Im disregarding that).

They both are competing against the other, and in the case of the PLD, you want the Block to happen instead of Parry.
So then it comes Sheltron into play. Since Sheltron makes it a 100% chance that the next attack is blocked, its nice and all but, parry takes priority (along with evasion but Im disregarding that).
:/

You got it wrong, block over rides parry. It's been proven quite allot. Bulwark for example will significantly reduce parry rate. A higher blocking shield will reduce parry Rates. Block doesn't literally reduce its rate. If you have a 20% block rate and a 20% parry rate, you will block 20 out of 100 attacks, and them parry 20% of the remaining 80 attacks.

[Sousoulsu]

Increase the potency of boss autoattacks and add more big hits that aren't tankbusters.
As it is now, Parry is utterly worthless because the hits you wouldn't have a major cooldown up for don't matter if they're mitigated or not. They're covered by Regen and little heals.

Aside from making Parry useful by buffing non-tankbuster damage, I'd appreciate if Tanks were designed in a way where they can mitigate damage taken outside of big cooldowns. More things like WAR's Inner Beast or PLD's Sheltron would make tanking much more interesting.

So... I've been looking through Parry-related posts as I was wondering how it actually affected things.

All I see on here is "it's useless/useful due to [insert theorycraft/opinion/story here]"

I've seen all kinds of analysis and numbers regarding other stats but absolutely nothing about Parry beyond what people seem to be making up. And this isn't just here.

So, question to the assembled: has anyone actually figured out the numbers behind Parry since the 3.0 changes? Without anything resembling those we're all just guessing.

Parry (and block) are more useful when there are many small enemies attacking you. As it stands, with how healing in XIV works, the only damage that matters to in the context of healing tanks on bosses is a tankbuster; and any damage taken shortly after that tankbuster.

Tankbusters are designed such that you can rotate your big cooldowns for them and be safe, regardless of whether or not you parry or block.

If non-tankbuster damage mattered more, Parry/Block would be more valuable because it would reduce the damage you take, and thus the healing you require, between tankbusters; though that still doesn't solve the problem of Parry being worth less as a stat the higher of it you get.
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As it is, keeping a Regen on the tank and giving mana-efficient heals is enough to keep the tank safe, and Parry is a stat that is worthless unless you care about mitigating the hits of many small adds that will be attacking you for an extended period of time.

Parry being so useless makes gearing boring, unless you're gearing to do more damage. In which case, it looks like this:
Accuracy to cap > SkillSpeed to a threshhold; then Crit > Det > Skillspeed.
Somebody more math-minded would have to aid you in specific values. I'm a dumb, non-meowthematically-inclined c@.

[Tizzy_Tormentor]

Just make it scale better, I like having defensive stats, I wouldn't stack it, but skills like Dark Dance and Raw Intuition are useful.

[Sousoulsu]

Just make it scale better, I like having defensive stats, I wouldn't stack it, but skills like Dark Dance and Raw Intuition are useful.

The unfortunate thing is that non-tankbuster hits in this game simply don't matter. They are not threatening to tanks, so unless they make more fights have a ton of little adds spawn and hit you for an extended period, Parry would still be useless.

The only way they can make Parry matter is is they make non-tankbuster hits do more damage.

[Jpec07]

I never thought I'd see the day when a tank legitimately said that slowing incoming damage doesn't matter.

Of course it matters, you nunny!

[Sousoulsu]

I never thought I'd see the day when a tank legitimately said that slowing incoming damage doesn't matter.

Of course it matters, you nunny!

It effectively does not matter.
Parrying non-tankbuster hits is meaningless; and risking not parrying a tankbuster means you die, which is not a risk worth taking; much less gearing for.

The only reason Parry/Dodge/Block matters in any game like XIV is if:
A)The "big tank hits" will not kill you if you do not dodge/block/parry them;
B)The constant damage you take aside from "big tank hits" are much bigger than they are in XIV, or
C)If there are many small autoattacks coming in a short period of time (many adds).

These are the only reasons that avoidance/mitigation stats are useful and should be geared into.
As is, in current encounters and the way XIV is and has been designed up until this point, Parry is a stat that should be removed from your gear, if possible, as it is effectively a wasted stat.
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That said,
I think this game's constant tank damage (autoattacks) should be larger than they are. This would have the dual purpose of requiring more dedicated healing on tanks outside of prep and recovery from tankbusters, would require tanks to sit in tank stances more fully, and would also make Parry more valuable.

I don't think min/maxing for more damage from tanks and healers is bad, but it's not a good design when tanks avoid stats that help them mitigate damage.

[Jpec07]

I was mostly just looking for a good excuse to call someone a nunny.

I'm not sure where you're getting this notion that there isn't adequate white damage in this game to justify gearing to have a greater chance at reducing incoming damage. The encounters I've been in (everything except Savage at this point) have had plenty of incoming physical damage to help me feel the parry on my gear. 20% mitigation might not seem like that much, but that's how much a PLD's Rampart mitigates, and while not as reliable, Parry does smooth out incoming damage.

I don't think either of us wants it gone from the game, though, and I will readily agree that it's position on the combat table feels off. I'd like to see better scaling with it, and I'd like to see it made more valuable for PLD again. I also like encounters that will make me fight for every scrap of mitigation I can get, and would be overjoyed if threads like this one ceased to exist in the future. As it stands, the Fending/Slaying debate has all but ended, and this is really the last point of contention for tanks. I think we'd all like to want Parry, but most folks don't think it worthwhile (for whatever reason).

[KogaDrake]

We get it, OP, your lazy and want to just get any piece of gear at any ilv to maximize your ilv without needing to min/max to avoid a stat that isnt as useful as other. Guess what, unless your a top tier progression raider, your never going to truly see the difference between just maximizing your ilv and min/maxing the secondary stats. Guess what even more, if your a top tier progression raider, your in full penta melded crafted gear till you either get the lore part of the raid drop that is best in slot, so again it does not matter for you.

Should SE figure out a way to make it more useful? yes, but the opinions of people saying its useless and does not contribute to DPS will make it a lower priority. Anything beyond making parry become a skill that deflects some dmg and in the process does some dmg to the attacker (tank only trait or something) will always result in the same response, 0DPS contribution so avoid it. I dont see this kinda change happening, unless they also add shield spikes type effect to make block even with plds who block and parry.

As long as they keep making options such that we can have 0 parry on our gear if min/maxed, I dont really see the issue so many have..

[AziraSyuren]

I mean, Parry may be useless, but at least it's not actively detrimental like some other stats are, such as too much Skill Speed on certain classes.

...I actually think SkS might be the only example of that, at least for classes I have experience playing.