3.2 PvP: Feast Game Mode Discussion Thread.

[Februs]

Sounds like another change to facilitate low skill players. Micro managing TP and proper usage of sprint is an extremely important nuance of a melee. Making calculated decisions and even gambles with your TP items/skills can be very rewarding, and also just as punishing if you plan it poorly or your gamble doesn't pay off.

Keep in mind that player re-spawns probably played into this decision. Being able to get back into the action quickly is important, especially on a map that was designed to accommodate 16 players. Depending on where the action is, you might have to book it to get back to your team (especially healers, who need to be there quickly). I think the general idea here was to keep the combat moving by removing some of the clunk, especially considering the clunk was all just window dressing in the first place.

As a dragoon, you should be pretty well aware that Tp managment is never an issue in PvP. Invigorate + Enliven = Sprint on CD, and that's IF you even need it. Spineshatter/Dragonfire Dives both close gaps in the push of a button without needing sprint. Even Evasive jump could be used as a gap closer if needed. It's hard to say how this will play out until we see it in action, but I don't think it will make much of a difference to the overall combat other than speeding things up a little.

[xxczx]

Just tested...

Invig:
We are assuming you hit every GCD in the 20sec sprint plus 10sec downtime, that leaves you with 340 TP which gives you a stupid 6s sprint.
If you just hit GCDs in the 20sec sprint and not in the 10sec, you are left with 390 TP so 9sec sprint.

Obviously using Enhanced Enliven changes this and using TP restoration items gives an even more crappy 2nd sprint

To say Dragoon has no TP management (or any melee for that matter) is silly.

[Februs]

Please don't spread false info, thanks.

That's cute, but it's not false info.

I'm not saying that every player out there knows how to manage their Tp, but the tools for Tp conservation have always been available in PvP. Enliven and Icarus Wings are enough to almost fully restore a players Tp. That's plenty of sprint time with no down time on attacking. It's no one's fault but the players if they haven't taken advantage of this. Dragoons have an even greater advantage in that they have one additional skill to replenish Tp. They can literally go from 0 to 100% in the push of 3 buttons, so they should have no issues at all if they're using every tool available to them.

Varied experiences hardly make a difference either. Frontlines is not even worth considering, since you have 24 other players to hide behind if you somehow manage to bottom out your Tp, and there is plenty of downtime in between node spawns to regen without the use of skills or items. Wolves Den is a different story, but the arena is tiny. Even a 3 second sprint in any direction is enough to get a Drg or Mnk within range of their target to use a gap closer (assuming they have Line of Sight). The only thing that is varied about PvP that is relevant to Tp consumption is the skill of the player. Now, if you're trying to say that some players are worse than others, then yes. I would agree with you, but ... so what?

Like I said before, casual or new players might find an advantage with this change because they can suddenly sprint and attack without worrying about having to manually manage their Tp, but this is just a QoL adjustment for players who have been taking full advantage of their Tp restoration moves/items since the beginning. If anything, this change helps level the playing field a little by closing the skill gap between the best of the best PvP'ers and the more casual, feather-weight, players. This is especially the case for seasoned healers. Given how fluid some of them have gotten at cheesing their opponents (Astro, I'm looking at you), it makes sense that SE did something to address the issue.

[xxczx]

They can literally go from 0 to 100% in the push of 3 buttons, so they should have no issues at all if they're using every tool available to them.

RIP Februs' TP 2016-2016.

[Februs]

Yeah, it's false info. You come in here spouting the basics of pvp like dragoon can use icarus wings and gap closers, like it's some sort of startling revaltion, then go on to claim something as asinine as TP management is never an issue.

I'm starting to wonder if you are actually reading the comments or just picking out the things you don't like, because it's pretty clear that you've completely blown by the point.

Yes, I did say that TP management is "never a problem." I suppose that was a bit of a "blanket statement," or, it would be if I was referring to all of the PvP'ers in the game. I'm pretty sure I singled out seasoned Wolves Den players, specifically, who have been managing their TP without much issue since the beginning of the game mode, but fine. If we are going to apply my statement to every single PvP'er in the game, regardless of experience or skill, then yes, this is a false statement ... which was completely not the point of my post at all, so I'm not sure why you're so focused on it.

The point, again and hopefully for the last time, is that PvP'ers have always, since the dawn of Wolves Den, have had MULTIPLE ways to replenish and adequately manage their TP. How is this in any way false information? Seems pretty straight forward to me, so I'm honestly confused how you can even contest it.

for me it's a minimal issue most of the time as I'm very used to altering my playstyle based on TP, but generally, the more TP the better.

The fact that you can argue against having adequate resources to manage your TP, but bust out a statement like this is mind blowing. It would seem that you, yourself, don't have any problems managing your TP. Now, to avoid confusion, I'm not saying that TP is not an issue that needs be "managed and planned around," but can you honestly tell me, with a straight face, that it's a "problem" after openly admitting that it's a "minimal issue" for you? How often do you honestly use sprint? When you do, how often do you say, "well, shit. Now I have no Tp left to attack," and completely ignore your Tp regen skills and items? In short, how often is TP management actually a "problem" for you?

To be perfectly clear, I never said that TP management was not important. I never implied that a player should ignore their TP management (in fact, I implied the opposite by mentioning customizing hot bars to include Tp replenishment skills and items). I also never said that it wasn't an important issue in the current Wolves Den for melee players. I simply stated that the tools for managing TP are there to be used, and it is no one's fault but the players if they chose to ignore them. I may have over-simplified my statements on TP management, but I did not think I would have to fully explore when and how a player should be managing their TP. The point, is that they can if they are willing to put the effort in.

Last thing we need in den is dragoons who think they have infinite TP and that their job is to merely get in range of casters to gapclose so that they can stunlock....

This was also a bit of a misunderstanding, but I can take the blame for it because I was not clear. I used to play a lot of PvP as Pld. When I used Sprint, it was typically only using it to stay on top of a target who was sub 70% Hp so that I could apply Full Swing and Stun lock via shield bash, thereby allowing the Dps to zerg it into oblivion. I did not mean to imply that Drg's should also be stun locking. The only reason I singled out Spineshatter dive was because it essentially halts a target's sprint in it's tracks, reducing the effective time of the sprint status, and provides the Drg adequate time to replenish a bit of Tp before continuing to attack (assuming, of course, that the target is worth blowing the stun on). I wrongly assumed you would somehow be following my train of thought without actually explaining it.