Why are low standards for dps acceptable?

[Andrea]

i could see your points if you get hindered in alexander savage , the elitism and im sooooo gooood and ur so badddd ego boost ur trying to do here is just hilarious :P

edit : i dont mind if people gives advice , but since most of the people here do in a sarcastic "im so good ur so bad way" , sry its just to funy :P

Are you say just because it isn't Alexander savage that people shouldn't try and put effort in and instead use only skills they feel like using and doing the dps they feel like doing? Thats a pretty poor attitude to have if so. Makes you realise why the DF is how it is.

I mean, I guess I could be reading it wrong but if not..

[Asmodai]

The best thing about these threads?
They never do anything.

Because the people that post, rightfully complaining about giving others piggyback rides, will never get through to the people that they need to...

The people they need to get through to are not the people doing bad, its the people that defend them which the forums is full of. If you make it socially unacceptable to be bad less people will be bad.

[Asmodai]

One thing you can say for the lack of parsers is their is generally less epeen being waved around and people aren't mistaking high numbers for actually being good at playing.

Well fist thing, LFG is crap content anyone can do. I'm talking about where the dps actually counts, raids. Second, as for the lack of parsers comment, there are some people who run parsers who can see youre only doing 500 dps in a raid and let me tell you, those doing 500dps seem to wave their epeens around the most about how epic they are.

[Khemorex]

what im saying is :

Forums, and comments in general on the internet is like asking your neighbour, "What do you think about the environment or new tax"
they are rarely giong to give you an intelligent answer
unless your neighbour is an enviroment specialist or something xD

so unless ur an expert in how people have fun in playing games , ur not entitled to tell other people how to have fun to play a game ^^

sure u can give tips like : oh sry i cant heal u because the mobs hit to hard and ur gear lvl is to low.

but instead people come up with : are you a bot? , ur so bad :P

so bye ill go play the game and have fun instead of raging on the forums like you lot , here :P

[Andrea]

so unless ur an expert in how people have fun in playing games , ur not entitled to tell other people how to have fun to play a game ^^

so bye ill go play the game and have fun instead of raging on the forums like you lot , here :P

I didn't realise asking people to show others respect and do the sort of DPS they know they can do as entitled.

I also didn't realise having a discussion now = raging on forums.

I could call you entitled for being ok and expecting people to be ok with not bothering about using your skills to do actual DPS instead of A real reborn DPS. Its a MMO. Those are other people in your dungeon. Show some respect to them and actually put in effort instead of coasting and being rude.

[Archaell]

The people they need to get through to are not the people doing bad, its the people that defend them which the forums is full of. If you make it socially unacceptable to be bad less people will be bad.

This. The main problem are the people defending players being lazy and playing poorly. It is completely illogical and it seems like they are afraid of players getting better for some odd reason. Actually this should be called the elitism, preventing others from catching up.

If we want to make DF a better place:

1. The community has to stop defending lazy and bad play
2. The community has to encourage players to help others improve (instead of making them afraid of the vote kick every single time they try to help)
3. The community has to discourage the behaviour which goes against learning ("don't waste my time teaching him the best rotation, let's finish this!")
4. The community has to have no tolerance for selfish and non-cooperative single player play in the team based environment

Which is something almost impossible tho yet worthy of pursuing.

[Odett]

what im saying is :

Forums, and comments in general on the internet is like asking your neighbour, "What do you think about the environment or new tax"
they are rarely giong to give you an intelligent answer
unless your neighbour is an enviroment specialist or something xD

so unless ur an expert in how people have fun in playing games , ur not entitled to tell other people how to have fun to play a game ^^

sure u can give tips like : oh sry i cant heal u because the mobs hit to hard and ur gear lvl is to low.

but instead people come up with : are you a bot? , ur so bad :P

so bye ill go play the game and have fun instead of raging on the forums like you lot , here :P

We're not really raging though :P, no one is screaming around at anyone, at least I hope not. Your example isn't really accurate because your neighbor's thoughts on the environment don't really affect your life, unless you're that weird kind of person that lets stuff like that get to them.

The difference between that and someone pressing random buttons in a DF group is that the player doing that IS negatively affecting the group, be it making the run slower, not tanking, or letting people die as a healer because you're alt-tabbed or watching Netflix. It's not as much as "this is how you have fun!" but more of hoping that everyone in the group has courtesy and consideration for everyone else in clearing the dungeon. It's one thing to think you're playing correctly and have someone offer you advice and you go fix it. It's something else if you become extremely defensive when you get offered advice, or are purposely being lazy (that one is the worst, tbh). It's even more confusing when someone else in the group becomes rude to you and defends the player for not using a core job skill. You're just left there thinking like "what ;__;? we're all trying to clear this dungeon, but that one person is doing whatever they want and I'm an elitist for hoping they can use their skills correctly?"

This community has been the nicest I've seen in terms of treating inexperienced players, and that's really nice, because a lot of other MMOs are downright toxic, but it's really one thing to welcome in the new guy and not sweating over the mistakes they make out of inexperience, and downright coddling people who at level 60 still don't use their main skills. We should be welcoming as an endgame community and fostering better play, so new level-capped players can learn how to play their job better, and use that experience to go out and tackle more challenging content, instead of defending mediocrity and willful ignorance.

[Kuwagami]

This. The main problem are the people defending players being lazy and playing poorly. It is completely illogical and it seems like they are afraid of players getting better for some odd reason. Actually this should be called the elitism, preventing others from catching up.

If we want to make DF a better place:

1. The community has to stop defending lazy and bad play
2. The community has to encourage players to help others improve (instead of making them afraid of the vote kick every single time they try to help)
3. The community has to discourage the behaviour which goes against learning ("don't waste my time teaching him the best rotation, let's finish this!")
4. The community has to have no tolerance for selfish and non-cooperative single player play in the team based environment

Which is something almost impossible tho yet worthy of pursuing.

mentor system. Please look forward to it

I am staying a lil bit sceptical till the mentor system proves its value beyond getting some fancy icons, titles and rewards. It could also end up like the roulettes, which would be shame.

people will always abuse any system put in place. But we can't blame devs for not trying, because they do

[Archaell]

mentor system. Please look forward to it

I am staying a lil bit sceptical till the mentor system proves its value beyond getting some fancy icons, titles and rewards. It could also end up like the roulettes, which would be shame.

[Whiteroom]

I am staying a lil bit sceptical till the mentor system proves its value beyond getting some fancy icons, titles and rewards. It could also end up like the roulettes, which would be shame.

This, also there are a lot of people out there I would want teaching.

Look at those on the forums that defend lazy play.
"You don't have to worry about your skills! Just mash buttons and smile, The rest of the team be damned!"

Also really wish the training hall at least showed DPS so people could see how much doing the designed rotation effects your output.